Raiders sign WR Willie Snead

[Frankie2Gunz]

1 minute ago, NYRaider said:

Robert Saleh also only had one very good year as a defensive coordinator with arguably one of, if not the, best defensive lines in recent NFL history. In his 3 other years as the 49ers DC their defense allowed more ppg than ours did under KNJ and they've had a losing record in all three of those seasons. 

Am I saying that Irving will be an unstoppable force? No. But he's a low risk/high reward signing just like Thomas. While Ranks is a high risk/low reward signing.

I would certainly not describe the difference between Rankins at 8 million as(high risk/ low reward) and Thomas at 5 million as (low risk/high reward) but to each their own.  Based on production at the NFL level I would much rather have Rankins at 8 over Thomas at 5 and I like Thomas potential.

[Jeremy408]

8 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

Morrow is one of the best coverage LB in the NFL by coverage snap metrics. Kwit is a good player on a bad defense. He is good by nearly every metric you can find. Littleton was also one of the best coverage linebackers in the NFL for several years before coming to the Raiders. He was misused and even played at SAM at times. You can't say he doesn't have talent. Point being these aren't bums out there. They can all play.

We still have a hole at safety, but Heath was good last year at free safety. Someone tell me heath didn't perform when he played free safety. I'll wait.

What #1 cornerback is on the market? Show me how well paying 10+ to free agent cornerbacks has worked out. What impact wide receiver did you want to sign? I think allocating less $ to receiver was smart.

Why would we pay for another linebacker? It's not what's wrong with this team. Inexperience in the secondary and lack of pass rush are. The secondary players will be a year more experienced and have one of the best secondary coaches in the NFL now in Ron Milus. Plus we added one of the best pure pass rushers in the NFL in Ngakoue (at least top 15). 

I really don't see doom and gloom with this team. I"ll check back in a week and we'll see how some of these posts age.

AMEN

[NYRaider]

5 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

What #1 cornerback is on the market? Show me how well paying 10+ to free agent cornerbacks has worked out. What impact wide receiver did you want to sign? I think allocating less $ to receiver was smart.

Why would we pay for another linebacker? It's not what's wrong with this team. Inexperience in the secondary and lack of pass rush are. The secondary players will be a year more experienced and have one of the best secondary coaches in the NFL now in Ron Milus. Plus we added one of the best pure pass rushers in the NFL in Ngakoue (at least top 15). 

I really don't see doom and gloom with this team. I"ll check back in a week and we'll see how some of these posts age.

Not to mention we just spent early picks on Arnette and Mullen. You have to have some faith in the process and trust that your guys will improve. 

I also agree that allocating less money to WR's was smart. Ruggs/Edwards didn't play very well but it's way too early to give up on them. Brown is an upgrade over Agholor and Snead is a similar player to Agholor coming onto the team. 

As you mentioned Kwit and Morrow played well, plus Littleton played at an All-Pro level in the previous two seasons before he got here. I think it's funny that Frankie will criticize Littleton after one bad year in a new scheme when he has proven to be a good player in 2018/2019. But love Rankins who has injury issues and hasn't played well in 2 years. I think Littleton will play much better in Bradley's scheme. 

The interior pass rush will need to be better but we took chances on 3 guys with potential. We literally signed Thomas, Irving, and Jefferson for the same amount that the Jets paid Rankins. 

[NYRaider]

5 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said:

I would certainly not describe the difference between Rankins at 8 million as(high risk/ low reward) and Thomas at 5 million as (low risk/high reward) but to each their own.  Based on production at the NFL level I would much rather have Rankins at 8 over Thomas at 5 and I like Thomas potential.

Thomas only has a $2.8M cap hit, Jefferson has a $3.25M cap hit, and Irving has a $1M cap hit. We literally signed all 3 guys for the same price we would've had to pay Rankins. 

[Jeremy408]

11 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Robert Saleh also only had one very good year as a defensive coordinator with arguably one of, if not the, best defensive lines in recent NFL history. In his 3 other years as the 49ers DC their defense allowed more ppg than ours did under KNJ and they've had a losing record in all three of those seasons. 

Am I saying that Irving will be an unstoppable force? No. But he's a low risk/high reward signing just like Thomas. While Ranks is a high risk/low reward signing.

I’ve saying a lot of that for years. Anyone who Anoint him one of the best defensive coordinators in the NFL can’t ignore Gus Bradley

[Frankie2Gunz]

8 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Then why has Rankins sucked for 2 years?

I'm not sure how much more clear I can be?  It takes over a year to recover from an achilles tear then combine that with Rankins being put on IR and missing a large portion of the season with a knee injury and you have two seasons below average season based on production. 

Robert Saleh clearly thinks Rankins can play or else he wouldn't have signed him to 8 million per season. 

[NickButera]

1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

We took some gambles addressing our interior pass rush. But hopefully Rod can get the most out of Hurst, Irving, Jefferson, and Thomas. It's a pretty weak defensive tackle class and ideally Ferrell will be able to contribute as a pass rusher playing inside. 

Odds are, one of them will have a very good year.

[Frankie2Gunz]

5 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Thomas only has a $2.8M cap hit, Jefferson has a $3.25M cap hit, and Irving has a $1M cap hit. We literally signed all 3 guys for the same price we would've had to pay Rankins. 

Sheldon Rankins signed a 2 year, $11,000,000 contract with the New York Jets, including a $1,500,000 signing bonus, $6,000,000 guaranteed, and an average annual salary of $5,500,000. In 2021, Rankins will earn a base salary of $1,000,000, a signing bonus of $1,500,000 and a roster bonus of $2,750,000, while carrying a cap hit of $4,500,000 and a dead cap value of $4,500,000.

[Jeremy408]

9 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Thomas only has a $2.8M cap hit, Jefferson has a $3.25M cap hit, and Irving has a $1M cap hit. We literally signed all 3 guys for the same price we would've had to pay Rankins. 

And that’s the thing. For the Rankins signing for 8M to make sense he would have to outproduce Jefferson Irving and Thomas. 

Edited March 27, 2021 by Jeremy408

[NYRaider]

2 minutes ago, Frankie2Gunz said:

I'm not sure how much more clear I can be?  It takes over a year to recover from an achilles tear then combine that with Rankins being put on IR and missing a large portion of the season with a knee injury and you have two seasons below average season based on production. 

Robert Saleh clearly thinks Rankins can play or else he wouldn't have signed him to 8 million per season. 

Rankins has has broken his leg, torn his Achilles, and suffered an ankle injury. He has one good year of production in 5 NFL seasons. 

Robert Saleh also has one great year as a DC with an extremely stacked defensive line. Outside of the Super Bowl year his defenses have allowed 25.1 ppg and they've had a losing record every year. 

[ronjon1990]

14 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said:

1. They were called Sacksonville for a reason. I'm not saying that they didn't cover but I'm saying pass rush was the main attraction of that defense so we can't get it twisted. As far as what you said about the run vs pass and Rockaway playing with superior linebackers of course youre not wrong but to give some perspective: The sacksonville defense was bottom 12 against the run but was #2 overall. .That tells you how good that pass rush really was. As someone who played corner for most of my life, I definitely know the relationship between a pass rush and coverage and I'll be the first to tell you that you can be an average player and look much better with the pass rush and you can be a good player who looks great because of the pass rush. Don't get me wrong corner is VERY important But there's a reason why pass rushers are usually the highest paid non-quarterbacks in the NFL. 

I noticed you mentioned how Mike Zimmer is a better defense of mind than Gus Bradley And how If Ngakoue didn't thrive with Zimmer then how is he going to thrive with Bradley. There's a couple of things wrong with that premise. 1. Do you know the difference between their systems? Zimmer runs the same defense as Paul Gunther(Just runs it better). Call Gunthers Defense the defensive end are bigger edge players that are asked to do a lot in the run game(See Carlos Dunlap and Everson Griffin). Ngakoue was a head scratching trade because he's more of a speed rusher And is less than 250lbs. Even then in half a season he had four sacks(Before going to the ravens mid season and getting four more sacks totaling eight sacks on the season). In Gus Bradley's defense The emphasis on edge rushers Are there small speed rushing guys When it comes to passing downs. Ngakoue played for Gus Bradley as a rookie and produced nine sacks. With no supporting cast(So it's not like this theoretical thing like can he produce in a Gus Bradley system) Scheme is something you can't ignore. Very few players transcend schemes. 

3. I have no idea where the Tyson Alualu love is coming from but you know he's 34 right And has never had more than four sacks in a season. I don't understand how that somehow compares to Yannick Ngakoue who has had eight or more sacks in a season every year he's been in the NFL regardless of what team he's played for since he was a rookie.

Again I don't say all of this to say he's a superstar by any means I'm saying he will help the pass rush tremendously which will help the back end coverage which will the rest of the defense as a whole. Yes we definitely can cover better and I believe we will win a simpler defense thats more conducive for young players. I think the answer to a lot of the Raiders problems are just the younger players have to take the next step in their development which wasn't gonna happen with the coordinator that we had. More realistically the only two spots that from a talent standpoint we don't have anybody to fill the role the roster is FS and RT. Everything else we have the talent to actually play it's just going to come down to is the talent going to materialize. We can't get free agents realistically to fill every spot we have to develop the young players that we drafted.

 

1. The 2017 Jaguars were 16th in run defense and their pass defense was considered one of the best of the last few decades. 

As someone who played Safety for most of my life prior to making a switch to Edge Rusher following a growth spirt, I too know the benefits of a shut down secondary. That's why there's a term for it: coverage sacks. 

2. Transcendent players overcome scheme issues. We see it all the time. 

3. This is blatantly false. 2016's Jaguar defense included: Posluzny, Cyprien still playing pretty decent, Telvin Smith, Jalen Ramsey, Prince Amukamara, Tashaun Gipson, Malik Jackson, Dante Fowler, Aaron Colvin, Myles Jack, Tyson Alualu, and Abry Jones. 

4. Yes, I know how old Alualu is. I also know his role teams was to be a stout run defender, which he has been fairly good at. He's not a sack demon. He's also a better DT than any that we currently have until they prove otherwise on the field. I'm not comparing Alualu and Yannick as individuals, I'm saying that a solid, legitimate NFL caliber DT would do more for our defense and player progression for a guy like Crosby than a stud player does. That's not some foreign concept, as I illustrated with Randy Moss. You don't build a team around a star, you find a star to complete a team. Why? Because you only need 1 or 2 stars with some decent supporting cast. A star in a garbage dump is just a star in a garbage dump. Yannick with bad DTs is going to be more hamstrung than Crosby would be with solid DT play. 

5. You say you don't say this to say he's a superstar, and follow up by saying he's going to help tremendously. Based on what, exactly? He has ALWAYS played with better secondaries and LB units, and typically with better D-lines, than we hav, yet produces about the same amount as Crosby. Our other pass rush is not even bad, it's totally nonexistent. If he helps that out, he's a superstar. What I see is a guy people are low key pimping as the next great Raider pash rusher, but don't have the cajones to make that statement outright because deep down they recognize he's nothing more than a gamble who has had the benefit of playing alongside some outright transcendent talent his entire career while hardly producing monster numbers, and only doing so because they "hope" he pans out as the "big" signing we wanted. You yourself have now consistently tried to argue he did so without a supporting cast like he will be here or downplay the effects of having top tier coverage play and functional DL cohorts, which isn't just flat out incorrect. As soon as you tried saying hiis rookie year was without a supporting cast, you tipped your hand that you're trying to make him out to be bigger than his record will support. He had a high point of 12 sacks, now 5 seasons ago. 6 seasons ago, Vic Beasley had 15.5 sacks. So continuing to harp on the past that much is a weak argument. 

6. Talent, or bodies? Because yeah, we have A TON of bodies at DT now (fun side note: literally, 2070 listed pounds) across 7 guys. At CB we have 7 guys too, with 2 that are proven guys worth keeping, a bunch of hopes and prayers, and Nevin Lawson who nobody missed. The same general group that was a major liability while we wait for everyone to take "the next step" (tick tock, tick tock, still waiting for Johnson to be a viable player 3 years on....🙄). Even Mullen, who I give credit to, regressed a bit last year. The list goes on and on. Anyone who thinks we only REALLY need a FS and a RT is out of their mind and hyped up on some Mayock juice, because nothing whatsoever indicates that we've improved anything. The Secondary and the DL are the two units EVERYONE agreed needed massive upgrades coming into the offseason, and now everyone is high on life over signing a bunch of nobodies? Seriously? And every critique is met with "Well, we're obviously going to sign Hooker or Boston, duh!" because....reasons? If I had a dollar for every time someone said we were just going to sign one guy or another, I'd retire, and maybe with enough to retire back stateside, which is saying something lol. 

[NYRaider]

6 minutes ago, NickButera said:

Odds are, one of them will have a very good year.

Jefferson has outperformed Rankins over the last two seasons.

[MrOaktown_56]

6 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Jefferson has outperformed Rankins over the last two seasons.

If we are going off of peak, Irving was a monster in Dallas at one point.

[ronjon1990]

4 minutes ago, NickButera said:

Odds are, one of them will have a very good year.

Why? Didn't we say the same thing about Collins and Ross and Hurst and Hall and Ellis and Rubin and Wright and McDonald and Vanderdoes and Hester...and that's only at DT...over the last 4 years or so? 

Seems to me, at this rate, the odds are better that none of them pan out to be worthwhile than any one of them panning out to go alongside Hankins....

[Humble_Beast]

31 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

Morrow is one of the best coverage LB in the NFL by coverage snap metrics. Kwit is a good player on a bad defense. He is good by nearly every metric you can find. Littleton was also one of the best coverage linebackers in the NFL for several years before coming to the Raiders. He was misused and even played at SAM at times. You can't say he doesn't have talent. Point being these aren't bums out there. They can all play.

We still have a hole at safety, but Heath was good last year at free safety. Someone tell me heath didn't perform when he played free safety. I'll wait.

What #1 cornerback is on the market? Show me how well paying 10+ to free agent cornerbacks has worked out. What impact wide receiver did you want to sign? I think allocating less $ to receiver was smart.

Why would we pay for another linebacker? It's not what's wrong with this team. Inexperience in the secondary and lack of pass rush are. The secondary players will be a year more experienced and have one of the best secondary coaches in the NFL now in Ron Milus. Plus we added one of the best pure pass rushers in the NFL in Ngakoue (at least top 15). 

I really don't see doom and gloom with this team. I"ll check back in a week and we'll see how some of these posts age.

our biggest weakness on defense and we attacked it in free agency. We brought in an elite edge rusher, and added alot of potential and spent resources to improve the DL. I like that approach then overpaying for a NT like Dalvin. Leonard Williams wasn't even an option