What moves will Andrew Berry make at the Quarterback Position this Offseason?

[Browns1987]

2 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

No way he runs him out if he wouldn’t even bench him when he’s been injured enough and playing poorly enough to justify it for 2 months.

If he wants him out, what better than to keep him on the field and put Hudson one on one with Watt? He was either going to get very injured or look like total garbage like it happened. 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 minute ago, big poppa pump said:

I do understand the not wanting to root for a "dirtbag" of a human being, and I honestly can't say I know much about what Watson is being accused of.  There is obviously a pattern of inappropriate sexual behavior that can't be overlooked.  What I want to see, however, is how this plays out in the court system, before I say forget this guy.  I mentioned before that one of the things I did see, was that the Dolphins trade would have gone through, except for the fact that 4 of the 22 accusers had held out from getting paid off.  If there are 22 victims, then I want to see them all stand up in court, and point at Watson, and say "I don't want a dime, but I do want to see this scu.ba. prosecuted.

I get your point but I also don’t think being guilty and being found guilty in court are one and the same.

As far as the facts, it’s essentially 2 dozen women all unaffiliated all telling different versions of the same story.  Perhaps there are some money chasers in there, but there are a lot of dudes in the NFL who have (or had) more money than Watson who weren’t/aren’t accused of this.

It just seems highly unlikely all these people who don’t know each other coordinated a hit job on some random nice guy. (Not that you’re saying they are).

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 minute ago, Browns1987 said:

If he wants him out, what better than to keep him on the field and put Hudson one on one with Watt? He was either going to get very injured or look like total garbage like it happened. 

I think the idea would be to do it in a manner that doesn’t make you look like a horse’s arse for coming up with that scheme.

Baker looked rough last night.  Stefanski looked worse imo.

[JDD]

6 minutes ago, big poppa pump said:

I do understand the not wanting to root for a "dirtbag" of a human being, and I honestly can't say I know much about what Watson is being accused of.  There is obviously a pattern of inappropriate sexual behavior that can't be overlooked.  What I want to see, however, is how this plays out in the court system, before I say forget this guy.  I mentioned before that one of the things I did see, was that the Dolphins trade would have gone through, except for the fact that 4 of the 22 accusers had held out from getting paid off.  If there are 22 victims, then I want to see them all stand up in court, and point at Watson, and say "I don't want a dime, but I do want to see this scu.ba. prosecuted.

See this is the what I said earlier. He is innocent until proven guilty. I don't care about the court of public opinion in a case like this. If there are people willing to go to the cops and be deposed over this, there is an issue. This wasn't some person on social media making a random claim and everyone just jumping on it. 

[big poppa pump]

1 minute ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I get your point but I also don’t think being guilty and being found guilty in court are one and the same.

As far as the facts, it’s essentially 2 dozen women all unaffiliated all telling different versions of the same story.  Perhaps there are some money chasers in there, but there are a lot of dudes in the NFL who have (or had) more money than Watson who weren’t/aren’t accused of this.

It just seems highly unlikely all these people who don’t know each other coordinated a hit job on some random nice guy. (Not that you’re saying they are).

No, and I also would not victim blame either.  I am assuming his pattern of behavior was definitely of the deviant nature.  I would like to know if the women maybe knew this, or were actually forced into it.  If it's the latter, then I hope he spends a significant time in jail. (which no one seems to be saying will happen)  Essentially my personal opinion to whether we go after him would depend on how an actual court case played out!

[MSURacerDT55]

48 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

For me the two aren’t necessarily separated.

For example, how do I explain to my boys why I’m rooting for such a horrific human?  What message does that send? And it would be one thing if he were just some piece of the puzzle, but he’d be the face of the franchise.

”Hey dad, I want a Watson jersey for Christmas” is just… ugh..

What did they do back in Rome? Fathers, Kids and all attached knew these were gladiators and watched for entertainment. The failure of society was when we started marketing these guys as good people and tried to make football a feel good sport when these guys do nothing short of trying to kill each other. Football is a savage sport just like Boxing and MMA and it should be looked at as such.

 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

2 minutes ago, MSURacerDT55 said:

What did they do back in Rome? Fathers, Kids and all attached knew these were gladiators and watched for entertainment. The failure of society was when we started marketing these guys as good people and tried to make football a feel good sport when these guys do nothing short of trying to kill each other. Football is a savage sport just like Boxing and MMA and it should be looked at as such.

 

I’d like to think we as a society have evolved after a couple thousand years.

Just because people did things a certain way before doesn’t mean we should keep doing it that way.

[MSURacerDT55]

1 minute ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I’d like to think we as a society have evolved after a couple thousand years.

Just because people did things a certain way before doesn’t mean we should keep doing it that way.

2000% agreed, but these guys are conditioned a certain way, heck in similar ways as they were back then. The only difference is how they are looked at and perceived. Society has changed and evolved to a degree but the objective of gladiators and football are still similar  

[MWil23]

46 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

As a dude with 3 (iirc) daughters, I’m not sure there’s another answer here.

Yep, no question that's changed things for me. And all 3 of them love sitting on my lap and watching football with me, and they wear their Browns gear and just love it because they love me. I personally can't in good conscience ruin that experience with them, and I totally get others who don't feel the same way.

[roger murdock]

Deleted 

Edited January 4, 2022 by roger murdock
Deleting for being wrong and stupid and reactionary

[dawgdish]

4 minutes ago, roger murdock said:

What Watson's been accused of is perversion but less damaging than rape or assault. If you ask me if I'd rather some creep flash his junk at me or have someone kick me over and over while I'm on the ground I'll take the flashing/exposure 1000 times over.

Lakers fans loved Kobe despite being accused of far worse. Hell 2 of the last 5 presidents of the united states have worse track records. 

 

If you watch sports to cheer for role models and morally upstanding citizens you're either a hypocrite or a fan of ivy league rowing. 

Pretty sure no woman is going to ask you.

[MWil23]

6 minutes ago, roger murdock said:

What Watson's been accused of is perversion but less damaging than rape or assault.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2021/05/21/new-information-proper-context-for-deshaun-watson-sexual-misconduct-lawsuits-daily-cover

Forcible sex isn't perversion. 2 counts against him on the Bill Clinton type.

[candyman93]

2 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2021/05/21/new-information-proper-context-for-deshaun-watson-sexual-misconduct-lawsuits-daily-cover

Forcible sex isn't perversion. 2 counts against him on the Bill Clinton type.

@bruceb I need you to put your legal skills to work. What’s the difference between forcible sex and rape?

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 minute ago, roger murdock said:

What Watson's been accused of is perversion but less damaging than rape or assault. If you ask me if I'd rather some creep flash his junk at me or have someone kick me over and over while I'm on the ground I'll take the flashing/exposure 1000 times over.

I’d prefer neither 🤷‍♂️ 

You’re also glossing over a lot as it relates to power dynamics and in some cases professional ramifications.  

1 minute ago, roger murdock said:

Lakers fans loved Kobe despite being accused of far worse.
 

Kobe was accused in one instance.  We have no clue what happened re: consent.  If there were another 2 dozen instances of poor behavior, I’m not sure people would have viewed him the same way.

1 minute ago, roger murdock said:

Hell 2 of the last 5 presidents of the united states have worse track records. 
 

Maybe we should be giving them a pass too, right? I mean, everyone knows politicians are sleazy.

1 minute ago, roger murdock said:

If you watch sports to cheer for role models and morally upstanding citizens you're either a hypocrite or a fan of ivy league rowing. 

Ah yes, the old conundrum of having to root for only the most moral people or watch a sport where everyone has definitely always been moral lol.  Would Duke lacrosse or Stanford swimming be an acceptable alternative?  
 

Definitely no chance at a middle ground here…

 

This is a pretty tone deaf and dismissive post by someone who usually isn’t either of those things.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 minute ago, candyman93 said:

@bruceb I need you to put your legal skills to work. What’s the difference between forcible sex and rape?

How would he know?  He pays the going rate as I understand it.