FrantikRam Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 8 minutes ago, Ozzy said: Sure but it is also wild to not believe that both Metcalf and Lockett are greatly better with Russell Wilson than without him. Lockett has made his career because of Russell Wilson. Lockett signed a 4 year $69 million dollar deal last year, no way he gets that money unless Seattle thinks that Russell Wilson loves the dude and this will make him happy, also no way he has the career he has had without Russell Wilson extending plays with his legs and making big throws downfield to him. Look at David Moore in Seattle with Russell Wilson and without. Look at how good Doug Baldwin was with Wilson, Jermaine Kearse, Paul Richardson, Luke Willson etc. Not great receivers on paper at all but Wilson made the dudes productive and they were an effective offense. Will be very interesting how good DK is next year without a great QB. Look at David Moore versus Lockett or Metcalf. Hell, look at Golden Tate or ANY Seahawks WR with Wilson aside from Lockett and Metcalf. That's what tells you how good those two are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownie man Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 40 minutes ago, FrantikRam said: That puts the Broncos anywhere between 15 and 20. Yo we don’t even know how good Jerry Jeudy is yet or Javonte Williams. I wouldn’t be surprised at all to see them make the pro bowl this year with Russ. Denver is loaded Courtland Sutton is a top 5 number 2 receiver. Plus Hamler and Patrick I think you’re absolutely sleeping on Denver. but I don’t blame you too much they haven’t been able to showcase their talents because of the QB situation. But by the end of the year your list is gonna look incorrect for sure. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sryan66611 Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 6 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said: No matter what you think of DK, if I'm him I'm trying to get out of Seattle ASAP unless they're making a play for someone like Watson or Willis. No way I'm tying my prime to Drew ******* Lock. Haven't you heard they already have the pick in and are going to draft Matt Corral in which he will be reunited with his college QB and essentially be Burrow/Chase 2.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 10 minutes ago, NudeTayne said: And one of those second rounders is pick 40, practically a late first. This thread is one of the biggest dumpster fires I've ever seen on this site. Seattle absolutely fleeced Denver and it will cost Elway his job. Hilarious. It's pretty much whatever. I think that Russ is still easily a top 10 QB, however i was a big advocate in the original "what should seattle do with wilson" of them trading him because i don't love the way he's going to age and I didn't like the way their roster was set up for the future. I thought this was probably the best time to cash in on his value, tbh. I Don't like it if they legitimately turned down more compensation from Washington just because they didn't want to trade him within the conference, but a top 10 pick, a top 40 pick this year is a good starting point. There's no guarantee that Denver is really good next year. I really do like the team, but if they went 1-5 in that division, would anyone truly be shocked? That's not going to be an easy division at all with those quarterbacks. This was the right move for both squads 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BullsandBroncos Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 54 minutes ago, FrantikRam said: You listed five FIRMLY average NFL players. As a collective group, they may even be below average overall. As a collective group, they may even be below average overall. never said it. Got it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dbrog24 Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 11 minutes ago, NudeTayne said: And one of those second rounders is pick 40, practically a late first. This thread is one of the biggest dumpster fires I've ever seen on this site. Seattle absolutely fleeced Denver and it will cost Elway his job. Hilarious. The only hope Seattle has with this stock is to go hard on defense and try to suck bad enough (just start Drew Lock and you'll get there) to be in the running for next year's better QB class. You seem to neglect to realize that Denver is in Win-Now mode as almost every position is filled on the roster to a decent level except QB. Trades aren't all numbers...context matters. Trust me when I say Denver people would be ready to riot if they had to go through another year with someone like Trubisky. There's also a very real possibility Seattle will now enter that zone of never being quite good enough because they have a gaping hole at QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrantikRam Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 9 minutes ago, BullsandBroncos said: As a collective group, they may even be below average overall. never said it. Got it. Come on man. You said that I said they didn't belong in the NFL. I never said that. Below average players are still good enough to be in the NFL, and I said they were all average. In today's NFL where this is more offensive talent than ever, a cast of average players together represent a below average unit overall. But they still belong in the NFL for sure. The 15-20th best skill group definitely belongs in the NFL. And it's also bordering on below average. Both things can be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkippyX Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 1 hour ago, FrantikRam said: Yea I used AD because he frees up other pass rushers - but the reason is because the Rams have accounted for 25% of the sacks taken by Wilson over the years. But you're right - Murray is right there too. He loves his midget tossing 18% but we all know that this trade is really about how awesome your Rams are so go on. Cardinals are at 15%, 49ers are at 12.6%, its almost like they played the Seahawks more for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 9 minutes ago, FrantikRam said: Look at David Moore versus Lockett or Metcalf. Hell, look at Golden Tate or ANY Seahawks WR with Wilson aside from Lockett and Metcalf. That's what tells you how good those two are. True but also tells you how bad the WRs were on Seattle yet they still won a Super Bowl because Russell Wilson was the QB and despite pretty suspect OL play, the great D a run game with Russell they won big. I still see a decrease in production from DK and Lockett without Russell as their QB, and I still think Lockett is crazy overpaid. He is not Mike Evans, Cooper Kupp, Stefon Diggs, or Michael Thomas. Then again a lot of WRs were overpaid last year, Julio Jones, Amari Cooper and especially Kenny Golladay. At least Lockett is pretty consistent and stays healthy I guess. I still think it was an attempt by Seattle to make Russell happy last year so they overpaid to keep him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrantikRam Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 13 minutes ago, Forge said: It's pretty much whatever. I think that Russ is still easily a top 10 QB, however i was a big advocate in the original "what should seattle do with wilson" of them trading him because i don't love the way he's going to age and I didn't like the way their roster was set up for the future. I thought this was probably the best time to cash in on his value, tbh. I Don't like it if they legitimately turned down more compensation from Washington just because they didn't want to trade him within the conference, but a top 10 pick, a top 40 pick this year is a good starting point. There's no guarantee that Denver is really good next year. I really do like the team, but if they went 1-5 in that division, would anyone truly be shocked? That's not going to be an easy division at all with those quarterbacks. This was the right move for both squads Agreed. And to put this into perspective... The Bucs and Rams both went 11-5/12-5. First year with new QBs. Brady better than Wilson. Stafford a notch below. The Rams and Bucs both had better rosters than Denver. Both had experienced head coaches. The Broncos are bringing Wilson in to a lesser roster, with a lesser coach and offensive mind - and in possibly a tougher division, and an overall more difficult schedule. That has 9-10 wins written all over it to me 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrantikRam Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 3 minutes ago, SkippyX said: 18% but we all know that this trade is really about how awesome your Rams are so go on. Cardinals are at 15%, 49ers are at 12.6%, its almost like they played the Seahawks more for some reason. Ah last I checked a year or so ago I think it was higher. My mistake. Nothing to do with how great the Rams are? Overall I've been happy playing against Wilson the last five years, and enjoy when the Rams play him. That was all I was attempting to say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrantikRam Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 So pick 9 this year. And a package of decent players aside from Lock. Versus a 3rd, the 32nd pick, Jared Goff, Jared Goff's contract and one more first rounder. Or in other words - teams may not even have entertained our trade package for the 9th overall pick alone. When it's not out of the realm of possibility that Stafford will be better than Wilson moving forward and they're the same age? Wow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHONUFF Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 (edited) Generally when teams see success in the draft amassing good talent and building a roster; generally your draft picks tend to get less and less playing time. Part of the problem is that the team went away from Carroll's mantra of competition. It's hard to justify to the ownership that you are sitting the guy that you just paid millions to in lew of a rookie. When players you draft can't see the field it hurts their development. Teams tend take more chances on players. Edited March 9, 2022 by SHONUFF Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dbrog24 Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 The fact that there are people on here arguing over whether a top10, hell even 12, QB who has won a superbowl isn't worth 2 firsts and 2 seconds and cap relief (you don't pay Fant as he's a TE who falls down when touched by punters...Harris was already on the decline...and Lock is as bad as it gets in the NFL with accuracy)...it's comical man. Trades like this never used to happen and now there have been higher price tags paid for CBs or Tackles. Like what is actually happening in this thread? I don't think it's arguable that it's an amazing trade for the Broncos. It can also still be a great one for Seattle if they play their cards right. Both can be true 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelKing728 Posted March 9, 2022 Share Posted March 9, 2022 50 minutes ago, brownie man said: Yo we don’t even know how good Jerry Jeudy is yet or Javonte Williams. I wouldn’t be surprised at all to see them make the pro bowl this year with Russ. Denver is loaded Courtland Sutton is a top 5 number 2 receiver. Plus Hamler and Patrick I think you’re absolutely sleeping on Denver. but I don’t blame you too much they haven’t been able to showcase their talents because of the QB situation. But by the end of the year your list is gonna look incorrect for sure. Teddy is a solid QB but he can't take a team to greatness like Wilson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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