Post-Draft Talk

[Styrian Raider]

On 5/1/2023 at 7:15 AM, RaidersAreOne said:

Interesting. Sanders went 3 picks before us and we landed Byron Young instead.

At least that tells me that Ziegler/Kelly have a feeling where which prospect could go during the draft.
Especially LBs seem to had some kind of a downfall in value in the last drafts.

(but i still think that we drafted Tucker too early, tho)

[raidr4life]

10 hours ago, big_palooka said:

You think the Raiders are pick 1 or 2 overall? 

 

 

Watch out for Michael Penix jr.

[ronjon1990]

41 minutes ago, raidr4life said:

Watch out for Michael Penix jr.

I think Caleb Williams has #1 all but locked up and his fan club will keep his hype there come hell or high water, absent a team legitimately not needing a QB having the number 1 pick and refusing to trade it. 

But another big year by Penix, he could very easily wind up QB2 in the class. Next year's QB class really intrigues me, especially if the trend of overdrafting the position continues. I felt a few QBs this year got overdrafted by a good bit (in a more crowded class, I don't think Richardson remains a top tier pick; Bennet, O'Connell, Haener, Tune, Clifford, Hall, and DRT went varying degrees of higher than I would have had them). 

The 2024 class....Williams, Maye, Nix, Evers, Travis, and Penix could all wind up early picks, and some sleepers like Jefferson, Milton and Van Dyke could very well make things really interesting in the first and second rounds. And even some of the more obvious late day 2/early day 3 guys have a lot of potential to rise up with good/rebound years and workouts. 

Probably one of the deeper QB classes we've had in a good while. Only worry I have with Penix is injury history and being a lefty. I'd absolutely love to have the guy, but we'd really really need to  have our RG and RT spots locked down.

Williams is the better prospect, physically, but man does he have some maturity questions. I don't see anything legal being a concern, he doesn't strike me as that sort. He just seems to swing between mature leader and immature tool depending on the day. Like, dude has very few flaws from a talent perspective. As safe a QB pick as your Burrow's, Lawrence's, etc, imo. But he also has Zach Wilson level nerve grating potential. End of the day, I don't think anyone would miss out on a whole lot with Penix from a physical talent perspective and I've never heard or seen anything from him that raises any character questions. 

[raidr4life]

42 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

I think Caleb Williams has #1 all but locked up and his fan club will keep his hype there come hell or high water, absent a team legitimately not needing a QB having the number 1 pick and refusing to trade it. 

But another big year by Penix, he could very easily wind up QB2 in the class. Next year's QB class really intrigues me, especially if the trend of overdrafting the position continues. I felt a few QBs this year got overdrafted by a good bit (in a more crowded class, I don't think Richardson remains a top tier pick; Bennet, O'Connell, Haener, Tune, Clifford, Hall, and DRT went varying degrees of higher than I would have had them). 

The 2024 class....Williams, Maye, Nix, Evers, Travis, and Penix could all wind up early picks, and some sleepers like Jefferson, Milton and Van Dyke could very well make things really interesting in the first and second rounds. And even some of the more obvious late day 2/early day 3 guys have a lot of potential to rise up with good/rebound years and workouts. 

Probably one of the deeper QB classes we've had in a good while. Only worry I have with Penix is injury history and being a lefty. I'd absolutely love to have the guy, but we'd really really need to  have our RG and RT spots locked down.

Williams is the better prospect, physically, but man does he have some maturity questions. I don't see anything legal being a concern, he doesn't strike me as that sort. He just seems to swing between mature leader and immature tool depending on the day. Like, dude has very few flaws from a talent perspective. As safe a QB pick as your Burrow's, Lawrence's, etc, imo. But he also has Zach Wilson level nerve grating potential. End of the day, I don't think anyone would miss out on a whole lot with Penix from a physical talent perspective and I've never heard or seen anything from him that raises any character questions. 

Quinn Ewers is one other guy I'm interested in as well.

[Blazer026]

21 hours ago, raidr4life said:

Watch out for Michael Penix jr.

He looked good last year. 2021 he was so awful though, kinda scares me. 

[big_palooka]

7 hours ago, Blazer026 said:

He looked good last year. 2021 he was so awful though, kinda scares me. 

Several injuries as well.

[ronjon1990]

10 hours ago, Blazer026 said:

He looked good last year. 2021 he was so awful though, kinda scares me. 

2 hours ago, big_palooka said:

Several injuries as well.

I think these are reasons he didn't declare this year. 

Injuries happen and Indiana isn't known for its offensive brilliance, but those only get you so far. 

Kid probably knows/feels he could/should be a 1st rounder, but chances are someone wisened him up about potentially falling due to the above. Plus, only having 1 full season starting likely wouldn't have helped. 

Going back to a conference contender that looks like they're on an upswing was definitely the best decision. A healthy and productive 2022 and 2023 can put a good bit of the questions to bed. 

Edited May 3, 2023 by ronjon1990

[Bitty 2.0]

On 5/2/2023 at 2:37 AM, raidr4life said:

Watch out for Michael Penix jr.

100% he probably would’ve went number one this year

[ronjon1990]

11 minutes ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

100% he probably would’ve went number one this year

Whoa. What? 

I like the guy a lot, but you really that high on him?

[FloydFan]

On 5/2/2023 at 2:42 AM, ronjon1990 said:

I think Caleb Williams has #1 all but locked up and his fan club will keep his hype there come hell or high water, absent a team legitimately not needing a QB having the number 1 pick and refusing to trade it. 

But another big year by Penix, he could very easily wind up QB2 in the class. Next year's QB class really intrigues me, especially if the trend of overdrafting the position continues. I felt a few QBs this year got overdrafted by a good bit (in a more crowded class, I don't think Richardson remains a top tier pick; Bennet, O'Connell, Haener, Tune, Clifford, Hall, and DRT went varying degrees of higher than I would have had them). 

The 2024 class....Williams, Maye, Nix, Evers, Travis, and Penix could all wind up early picks, and some sleepers like Jefferson, Milton and Van Dyke could very well make things really interesting in the first and second rounds. And even some of the more obvious late day 2/early day 3 guys have a lot of potential to rise up with good/rebound years and workouts. 

Probably one of the deeper QB classes we've had in a good while. Only worry I have with Penix is injury history and being a lefty. I'd absolutely love to have the guy, but we'd really really need to  have our RG and RT spots locked down.

Williams is the better prospect, physically, but man does he have some maturity questions. I don't see anything legal being a concern, he doesn't strike me as that sort. He just seems to swing between mature leader and immature tool depending on the day. Like, dude has very few flaws from a talent perspective. As safe a QB pick as your Burrow's, Lawrence's, etc, imo. But he also has Zach Wilson level nerve grating potential. End of the day, I don't think anyone would miss out on a whole lot with Penix from a physical talent perspective and I've never heard or seen anything from him that raises any character questions. 

Will be interested to see what happens with Milton next year. So incredibly physically gifted, if he can step into Hooker's role and limit his overthrow Joe tendencies, he could really shoot up draft boards. Looked great in the bowl game and filling in for Hooker post injury this year.

[CaribouLou]

I'm just a little confused how we go from possibly drafting two first round tackles (Johnson and Harrison) to not even drafting 1 throughout the whole draft with 9 pick?. If they clearly realized that o-line could possibly be a need why would we neglect it the rest of the draft? That just doesn't make sense to me. That and the Tre Tucker pick are the two biggest head scratchers to me.

Edited May 3, 2023 by CaribouLou

[big_palooka]

Dane Brugler's way to early 2024 mock:

https://theathletic.com/4477888/2023/05/02/nfl-mock-draft-2024-caleb-williams/

Quote

15. Las Vegas Raiders: J.J. McCarthy, QB, Michigan

The fourth quarterback drafted in this mock, and you don’t need to squint to see the talent with McCarthy. He is a loose athlete for his size with NFL-level arm strength and the poise to make plays.

Mock is great as it puts players on your radar for the upcoming season. For those without the Athletic, he has 5 in round one:

Williams(1), Maye (4), Ewers (6) McCarthy (15), Penix (23)

OT (5) including  Olu Fashanu (3 overall to Indy)

WR (4) - Marvin Harrison Jr. (2 overall to Houston) 

DT (4) - Mason Smith (10 overall to Pitt)

CB (4) - Kool-aid (9 overall to Rams)

TE (2) - Brock Bowers (7 overall to NE)

 

 

[big_palooka]

1 minute ago, CaribouLou said:

I'm just a little confused how we go from possibly drafting two first round tackles (Johnson and Jones) to not even drafting 1 throughout the whole draft with 9 pick?. If they clearly realized that o-line could possibly be a need why would we neglect it the rest of the draft? That just doesn't make sense to me. That and the Tre Tucker pick are the two biggest head scratchers to me.

To me shows discipline. They had guys ranked higher down with other picks. Didn't force it. OT was pretty soft in this class, so it checks out. 

[ronjon1990]

3 minutes ago, FloydFan said:

Will be interested to see what happens with Milton next year. So incredibly physically gifted, if he can step into Hooker's role and limit his overthrow Joe tendencies, he could really shoot up draft boards. Looked great in the bowl game and filling in for Hooker post injury this year.

Yeah, he's gonna be a boom or bust candidate for sure. He's definitely got some hype building. 

What really intrigues me is whether he can actually rise into 1st/2nd round status with a big year. Not so much for him, but for another transfer QB with all the physical talent in the world who ideally would declare in 2025- DJ Uigalelei. 

I feel like there's been a bit of a stigma on guys who didn't pan out at big programs like Michigan or Clemson or Alabama that go elsewhere and find great success. Guys who transfer program to program unilaterally or move up (think Hooker and VT to Tennessee prior to last year's run, Nix from Auburn to Oregon, Williams from Oklahoma to USC, etc) seem to get a bit less scrutiny. I get why, I just don't always think it's warranted. 

When Milton chose Tennessee and DJ chose Oregon St, they were decidedly steps down. Could give some insight to how the new transfer and NIL stuff will impact draft status. Obviously not a perfect science as guys like Hurts transferred to another big program but didn't really raise his draft stock- but I feel like he was a bit more of a project than guys like Milton or DJU. 

Wild what all can be gleaned from things like that- draft status impact, projections on where guys may or may not transfer to, where guys may avoid signing with altogether, etc etc. 

[ronjon1990]

11 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

Dane Brugler's way to early 2024 mock:

https://theathletic.com/4477888/2023/05/02/nfl-mock-draft-2024-caleb-williams/

Mock is great as it puts players on your radar for the upcoming season. For those without the Athletic, he has 5 in round one:

Williams(1), Maye (4), Ewers (6) McCarthy (15), Penix (23)

OT (5) including  Olu Fashanu (3 overall to Indy)

WR (4) - Marvin Harrison Jr. (2 overall to Houston) 

DT (4) - Mason Smith (10 overall to Pitt)

CB (4) - Kool-aid (9 overall to Rams)

TE (2) - Brock Bowers (7 overall to NE)

 

 

I want to like McCarthy. I just don't see "it" with him for some reason.