2018 Draft Thread I

[J-ALL-DAY]

And that would be perfectly fine. I'm not expecting an RG3 type of trade with these prospects. 

[Forge]

43 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

I think that's just asking for you to be disappointed.  I think a best-case scenario, you're looking at a Carson Wentz-like trade.  A 1st and 3rd this year, a 1st in 2019, and a 2nd in 2020.

This is the deal I kept pointing to as what I wanted with the number 2 overall. I'm perfectly okay with that deal. Obviously if we don't move down as far as 8, it wouldn't be as strong of a return, which I'm also fine with. Heck, replicate the Bears deal from last year and I'm good lol

[big9erfan]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

Wait.  You think a team is going to give up two additional 1sts to move UP from their original 1st?  So a Washington-esque deal is what you think the Niners should ask for?

Phillie gave up two firsts,  a second and a third to move up from 8 to 2 for Wentz (and it was a great move).  I think a chance at Rosen or Darnold would be worth that and probably even more. I honestly think the Giants would give that much.  And if they're picking something like 4th or 5th then that's what we would get for moving back just to 4 or 5.  If several QBs go in the top 3 or 4 then we could even try to move back to the 8 to 10 range and pick up another high pick. That would still give us a shot at one of the two good OTs in the draft and give us the capital to move up to get Nelson too. One of those extra picks could also be used on a C. That would solidify our line for years to come. And, we'd still have high picks this year and next to fill go after CBs and edge rushers, or a true number 1 WR.

[CWood21]

19 minutes ago, Forge said:

This is the deal I kept pointing to as what I wanted with the number 2 overall. I'm perfectly okay with that deal. Obviously if we don't move down as far as 8, it wouldn't be as strong of a return, which I'm also fine with. Heck, replicate the Bears deal from last year and I'm good lol

The problem is there has to be a market AND demand.  Are we sure they're going to be there this offseason?  Obviously, the Jimmy G acquisition puts the Niners out of the market for a QB.  And the Browns could easily revisit the McCarron trade in the offseason as he's set to become a RFA, and the Bengals will likely slap the highest tender on him.  So IF both the Browns and 49ers are out of the market for QBs, both of them are likely looking to trade down.  Looking at the teams currently slotted in the top 10, only the Jets and Cardinals are teams that are near mortal locks to be in the market for QBs.  The Giants and Chargers could theoretically be in the market for the heir apparent to their current starting QBs.  IF the Browns draft some non-QB at first overall, what's stopping a team going to the team picking 3rd if the Niners offer is too high?  Right now, it's too early to make any real strong opinions one way or the other.

[CWood21]

3 minutes ago, big9erfan said:

Phillie gave up two firsts,  a second and a third to move up from 8 to 2 for Wentz (and it was a great move).  I think a chance at Rosen or Darnold would be worth that and probably even more.

Possibly.  But we're also not even sure that both Rosen and Darnold are coming out.  What happens if Darnold shocks everyone and stays at USC?  If that's the case, than teams are likely negotiating with Cleveland (or whoever picks first) to obtain the first overall pick.

[Forge]

5 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

The problem is there has to be a market AND demand.  Are we sure they're going to be there this offseason?  Obviously, the Jimmy G acquisition puts the Niners out of the market for a QB.  And the Browns could easily revisit the McCarron trade in the offseason as he's set to become a RFA, and the Bengals will likely slap the highest tender on him.  So IF both the Browns and 49ers are out of the market for QBs, both of them are likely looking to trade down.  Looking at the teams currently slotted in the top 10, only the Jets and Cardinals are teams that are near mortal locks to be in the market for QBs.  The Giants and Chargers could theoretically be in the market for the heir apparent to their current starting QBs.  IF the Browns draft some non-QB at first overall, what's stopping a team going to the team picking 3rd if the Niners offer is too high?  Right now, it's too early to make any real strong opinions one way or the other.

Honestly, not too concerned about the market/demand. I think that something will be there. There's of course a ton of ifs and buts at this point for a huge amount of teams.  Alex Smith and Kirk Cousins could potentially be on the move as well so that needs to play out too. Which quarterbacks come out and stay put.  But I think some sort of market will be there. The ideal spot would be for quarterback, but I am not going to rule out someone moving to #2 for someone else either (Barkley?). It wouldn't net as much because I don't think anyone is making a huge jump for a running back, but I'm fine with a small trade as well.  

[CWood21]

8 minutes ago, Forge said:

Honestly, not too concerned about the market/demand. I think that something will be there. There's of course a ton of ifs and buts at this point for a huge amount of teams.  Alex Smith and Kirk Cousins could potentially be on the move as well so that needs to play out too. Which quarterbacks come out and stay put.  But I think some sort of market will be there. The ideal spot would be for quarterback, but I am not going to rule out someone moving to #2 for someone else either (Barkley?). It wouldn't net as much because I don't think anyone is making a huge jump for a running back, but I'm fine with a small trade as well.  

The market is almost assuredly going to come from a team needing a QB.  Since 2010, there's been 5 draft day trades that have included a team trading up for a non-QB in the top 5.  They are:

2012 - Cleveland (Trent Richardson) - 3rd Overall
2012 - Jacksonville (Justin Blackmon) - 5th Overall
2013 - Miami (Dion Jordan) - 3rd Overall
2014 - Buffalo (Sammy Watkins) - 4th Overall
2017 - Tennessee (Corey Davis) - 5th Overall

That's five trades in the last seven drafts that included a top 5 pick and the team making the trade up didn't use their pick on a QB.  Three of those were for WRs for their young QBs, and one of those was Minnesota bluffing Cleveland into a trade-up.  That's not really a good thing to hang on.  And most of those trades didn't involve a ton going back the other way.

[Forge]

9 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

The market is almost assuredly going to come from a team needing a QB.  Since 2010, there's been 5 draft day trades that have included a team trading up for a non-QB in the top 5.  They are:

2012 - Cleveland (Trent Richardson) - 3rd Overall
2012 - Jacksonville (Justin Blackmon) - 5th Overall
2013 - Miami (Dion Jordan) - 3rd Overall
2014 - Buffalo (Sammy Watkins) - 4th Overall
2017 - Tennessee (Corey Davis) - 5th Overall

That's five trades in the last seven drafts that included a top 5 pick and the team making the trade up didn't use their pick on a QB.  Three of those were for WRs for their young QBs, and one of those was Minnesota bluffing Cleveland into a trade-up.  That's not really a good thing to hang on.  And most of those trades didn't involve a ton going back the other way.

I actually think those are pretty decent numbers all things considered. I just said that there was a shot of that, not that it was likely. When you add in that small shot of a non-quarterback trade up, along with the actual quarterback trade up market, as I said...not too worried about market demand. I think we have a legitimately decent shot at moving down. 

[big9erfan]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

Possibly.  But we're also not even sure that both Rosen and Darnold are coming out.  What happens if Darnold shocks everyone and stays at USC?  If that's the case, than teams are likely negotiating with Cleveland (or whoever picks first) to obtain the first overall pick.

I didn't say they were. My point is that there is a chance we could get a lot in trade if we end up with the number 2 pick.

[big9erfan]

Wow, do I ever love watching Mayfield play.  I'm pretty close to believing he's the best QB in the country.  On the flip side, can't tell you all how much I hate watching Big 12 football - Maddenesque. 38-38 at halftime. 1400+ yards of total offense. Is that even football?

[burlow]

Before Bama vs LSU starts, let me say that I would be quite pleased if we pick up guise in the draft.  I have not watched much barkley but guice between the tackles is shades of my boy Franky G.  One of LSU's problems is that they get a bit to creative and try him outside to much, but between the tackles Guise is quick and sharp and hits hard.  He can still break outside stuff but LSU is bad at pulling it off.  Players to watch on the Purple and Gold side is Guise, Key and Chark Jr (WR).

[Chrissooner49er]

On 11/4/2017 at 7:01 PM, big9erfan said:

Wow, do I ever love watching Mayfield play.  I'm pretty close to believing he's the best QB in the country.  On the flip side, can't tell you all how much I hate watching Big 12 football - Maddenesque. 38-38 at halftime. 1400+ yards of total offense. Is that even football?

What do you call the Ohio State game? Iowa came to play...Ohio St was stuck in last week, apparently. Neither the O nor the D showed up. I'll take my Big 12 ball over that any day.

Ohio St and Penn St go down. Interesting. Both for the 2nd time. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

So if we end up trading down and accumulating two first rounders this season or a high 2nd, no one will complain if we double dip on the OL right? Granted, I REALLY want one of the pass rushers, but fixing the OL is a must, especially with our potential franchise QB at the helm.

[Forge]

45 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

So if we end up trading down and accumulating two first rounders this season or a high 2nd, no one will complain if we double dip on the OL right? Granted, I REALLY want one of the pass rushers, but fixing the OL is a must, especially with our potential franchise QB at the helm.

I wouldn't complain, but I think it's unlikely. I think that we will go offensive line with one of the first two, but I think the team will bypass double dipping. Also depends on what we do in free agency, of course. I'm not a fan of the interior options available, but the team may be. 

[48 1/2ers]

1 hour ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

So if we end up trading down and accumulating two first rounders this season or a high 2nd, no one will complain if we double dip on the OL right? Granted, I REALLY want one of the pass rushers, but fixing the OL is a must, especially with our potential franchise QB at the helm.

I would complain lol, we need a pass rusher and a receiver just as bad as OL. 2 interior lineman with 2 first round picks would be so depressing. Free agency for the O line position is where I want us to look. Like the Falcons did with Alex Mack or the Rams with Whitworth/Sullivan thats where I'd like us to make those improvements. 

I will say when it comes to Oline play i'm ignorant to judge, pretty much every other position I can assess technique and potential on a play by play basis but O line I cant so that's probably part of the reason. Also I think mentality and injury history is a big thing with Oline which again i'm too ignorant on the topics to judge.