NinerNation21 Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 20 minutes ago, 48 1/2ers said: Its pretty strange the NFL hasn't evolved like other sports in this regard (the only thing I can remember is expanding practice squads from 7 to 10). But rosters should be expanded some, the IR should have tiers, and all 53 should be allowed to be active. Sure, it eliminates a certain type of strategic planning but the overall product would be so much better off. And it would promote a healthier and safer environment, which is what the NFL wants people to think is actually happening 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big9erfan Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, N4L said: They should have a two-four week DL similar to baseball. At least now you can bring guys back from IR. I'll also never understand why you have guys on your roster that are inactive on gamedays. @757-NINER I don't think you should be that excited about getting Smith back. Last time we saw him, he was pretty average I guess if you consider 100+ tackles average. Didn't play in 2017 but had over 100 tackles in both 2015 and 2016. Not much else in the way of stats in 2016 but in 2015 he had 4 sacks, 3 forced fumbles, 6 PDs and an interception. He has 4.4 speed and this coaching staff seems to love speed. If he can get back to playing like he did in 2015 and 2016 he can be a big upgrade from guys like Coyle. I'm not excited in the sense that I think he's going suddenly turn into a super star. But teams improve by upgrading when and where they can and he has the potential to be a nice upgrade from Coyle who hasn't cracked 100 tackles yet in his 5 year NFL career. Edited September 13, 2018 by big9erfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 17 minutes ago, big9erfan said: I guess if you consider 100+ tackles average. Didn't play in 2017 but had over 100 tackles in both 2015 and 2016. Not much else in the way of stats in 2016 but in 2015 he had 4 sacks, 3 forced fumbles, 6 PDs and an interception. He has 4.4 speed and this coaching staff seems to love speed. If he can get back to playing like he did in 2015 and 2016 he can be a big upgrade from guys like Coyle. I'm not excited in the sense that I think he's going suddenly turn into a super star. But teams improve by upgrading when and where they can and he has the potential to be a nice upgrade from Coyle who hasn't cracked 100 tackles yet in his 5 year NFL career. Tackles are an insanely overrated stat. I'm not even sure he was considered average in 15/16 with the Raiders. That may be giving him the benefit of the doubt. But he is better than coyle, that's for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y2lamanaki Posted September 13, 2018 Author Share Posted September 13, 2018 21 minutes ago, Forge said: Tackles are an insanely overrated stat. I'm not even sure he was considered average in 15/16 with the Raiders. That may be giving him the benefit of the doubt. But he is better than coyle, that's for sure An example of this is Derek Smith in his final years. Led the team in tackles and had a ton of them, but it didn't mean he played well. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 1 minute ago, y2lamanaki said: An example of this is Derek Smith in his final years. Led the team in tackles and had a ton of them, but it didn't mean he played well. Yeah, especially if you're not shedding blocks and making those tackles 5 yards past the line of scrimmage lol. Smith is also abysmal in coverage, so there's that. He's just not good. Better than Coyle, yes, but that's not saying much. He's a high end back up / rotational piece, and a below average starter. Now, I get that the team is hoping he can rekindle his 2013 type season, but being that is now 5 years gone, I'm thinking it's probably not likely. It was just a terrible, terrible contract. Personally, I wish we'd bring Bowman back as an early down thumper in the middle to play MIKE. Foster at Will, Bowman at MIke, Warner at SAM. When you switch out to a two LB set, Warner and Foster obviously. OF course, I also wish we'd go out and sign Jahri Evans to play guard too. I just have a different philosophy than this FO I suppose lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big9erfan Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 1 hour ago, Forge said: Tackles are an insanely overrated stat. I'm not even sure he was considered average in 15/16 with the Raiders. That may be giving him the benefit of the doubt. But he is better than coyle, that's for sure Better than Coyle is all that I'm expecting. Like I said I'll take an upgradee wherever we can get one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
757-NINER Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 3 hours ago, Forge said: Yeah, especially if you're not shedding blocks and making those tackles 5 yards past the line of scrimmage lol. Smith is also abysmal in coverage, so there's that. He's just not good. Better than Coyle, yes, but that's not saying much. He's a high end back up / rotational piece, and a below average starter. Now, I get that the team is hoping he can rekindle his 2013 type season, but being that is now 5 years gone, I'm thinking it's probably not likely. It was just a terrible, terrible contract. Personally, I wish we'd bring Bowman back as an early down thumper in the middle to play MIKE. Foster at Will, Bowman at MIke, Warner at SAM. When you switch out to a two LB set, Warner and Foster obviously. OF course, I also wish we'd go out and sign Jahri Evans to play guard too. I just have a different philosophy than this FO I suppose lol Smith was pretty good in coverage when he was a WILL in this scheme. I don't care how he looked as Raider, playing for Del Rio. He was never going to be a good fit as a 3-4 ILB, so that holds no merit when I evaluate him for this scheme. Even when Norton was the DC, he had him playing MIKE which again, would not be the best way to use him IMO. The last time he was in this scheme, as the weak-side backer, he was a SB MVP. Now that was some years ago but still, its not like he was a JAG. https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/1884548-malcolm-smiths-past-production-proves-seahawks-wont-miss-a-beat-on-defense.amp.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted September 13, 2018 Share Posted September 13, 2018 35 minutes ago, 757-NINER said: Smith was pretty good in coverage when he was a WILL in this scheme. I don't care how he looked as Raider, playing for Del Rio. He was never going to be a good fit as a 3-4 ILB, so that holds no merit when I evaluate him for this scheme. Even when Norton was the DC, he had him playing MIKE which again, would not be the best way to use him IMO. The last time he was in this scheme, as the weak-side backer, he was a SB MVP. Now that was some years ago but still, its not like he was a JAG. https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/1884548-malcolm-smiths-past-production-proves-seahawks-wont-miss-a-beat-on-defense.amp.html Yeah, I don't think this scheme is some magical salve that will resolve the issues he had in Oakland. For a couple of reasons. One, I dont' think the coverage scheme is that different - he was bad in zone coverage in oakland, bad covering tight ends and running backs, the same thing he'd be charged with doing in the WILL here. Now, he will be a little more free to roam, so other aspects of his game will improve (won't need to shed as many blocks, for example), but again, I'm not buying a significant increase in coverage ability just because of the scheme. Secondarily, a couple of things. One, that defense was loaded and two, he was largely a part time player (never played half the defensive snaps in any of his years in seattle) and injury fill in. So sample size can be an issue here. And again, he played on one of the most stacked defenses we've seen in the last 20 years. That can easily cover up a considerable amount of deficiency (that being said, in Oakland he had no help, so I doubt that he's as bad as he displayed there either; probably somewhere between Oakland and Seattle, though I'd wager closer to the former at this point given he's five years removed from that seattle player). So honestly, I'm not even sure that in his seattle days he was more than just a jag who was covered up. There are a litany of players who showed very well in part time roles with a team and then completely crumbled and were exposed when they were asked to do more after going elsewhere. I have no idea if that was what he was or not. The fact that he was a super bowl MVP was completely irrelevant. That was a single game he played well in. I'm not saying he can't play well in a single game. Even JAGS have good games. I mean, Nick Foles just won a super bowl mvp. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GW21 Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 21 hours ago, big9erfan said: Better than Coyle is all that I'm expecting. Like I said I'll take an upgradee wherever we can get one. That’s not a very high bar, I think Elijah Lee is better than Coyle and was a bit disappointed when they decided to roll with Coyle against Minnesota. I think Lee has the potential to be our top ILB backup of the future while continuing to contribute on special teams. I know they like Coyle in this role, but I’m hoping Lee proves himself and we are able to cut ties with Coyle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big9erfan Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 49 minutes ago, Gore Whore 21 said: That’s not a very high bar, I think Elijah Lee is better than Coyle and was a bit disappointed when they decided to roll with Coyle against Minnesota. I think Lee has the potential to be our top ILB backup of the future while continuing to contribute on special teams. I know they like Coyle in this role, but I’m hoping Lee proves himself and we are able to cut ties with Coyle. Better than Coyle is all I'm expecting. I am hoping for more. I think Smith at his best was a competent, average NFL LB. I don't expect Coyle to ever be that and I would be greatly surprised if Lee becomes that. I know people here are down on Smith, most more so than me. I'm not touting him as anything other than ordinary. But at this point I still think he has more potential than Lee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 I don't know much about Smith, but I have seen Elijah Lee on the field, at least at the college level. I took note of him as he was one of the bright spots of the Kansas St Defense my Sooners went up against. When a play was made, he was usually there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big9erfan Posted September 14, 2018 Share Posted September 14, 2018 7 minutes ago, Chrissooner49er said: I don't know much about Smith, but I have seen Elijah Lee on the field, at least at the college level. I took note of him as he was one of the bright spots of the Kansas St Defense my Sooners went up against. When a play was made, he was usually there. Yes. I liked Lee too. I was surprised he went undrafted and was happy when we picked him up. But nothing I saw then or since makes me think he is anythjing other than a role player in the NFL. I'll be really hnappy if I'm wrong about that. Smith has barely played since 2016. So at this point he is probably more of an unknown than Lee. I get that. And he's older too. But he proved that at some point in his career he could be an NFL starter, or at least a high quality backup. That's what I'm hoping for ... again expecting nothing more than an upgrade from Coyle,. Clearly our coaching staff didn't think Lee was, or he would have been starting instead of Coyle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NcFinest9erFan Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NcFinest9erFan Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted September 16, 2018 Share Posted September 16, 2018 10 minutes ago, NcFinest9erFan said: Fudge no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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