Norm Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 49 minutes ago, jfinley88 said: it may not always be to the right team but kizer throws a pretty ball man. always look nice coming out of his hand. that OT GB INT was a top 5 worst play i've ever seen too lol. im sure that's been mentioned in here countless times. He can really look the part. He's built nice and throws hard. It feels like it stops there. Maybe he's smarter than I give him credit for. But that's my lean now. Just a slow guy out there mentally. Doesn't see it but thinks he is anticipating things. But then it's not there but the ball goes there anyways. He's not toast.. Mike should have fun with the clay to mold though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 1 hour ago, jfinley88 said: it may not always be to the right team but kizer throws a pretty ball man. always look nice coming out of his hand. that OT GB INT was a top 5 worst play i've ever seen too lol. im sure that's been mentioned in here countless times. We went to ot with the 0-16 Browns lol I bleached that from my brain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dubz41 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 7 hours ago, HorizontoZenith said: WOW. An entire post belittling people upset about the trade when those people just contributed 70 pages worth of actual discussion about football instead of complaints about others. Well done! Thought you swore off this thread about 10 pages ago?!?!?! If you think that was 70 pages of 'discussion' you're delusional. I didn't belittle anyone. I commented that it was more hissy fit and knee jerk. There was NOT a lot of thinking going on. Seemed like a lot of venting and reaction. BGute is correcting some of building blocks that were not the foundation he sees moving forward. Good for Gute. He's the boss now and it is way too early to be pissing and moaning about things that nobody knows how they will turn out. It's funny, you were complaining about the Packers doing nothing and, predictably, you complain when the first move is made. Good luck to you man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinaski_86 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 3 hours ago, Dubz41 said: Thought you swore off this thread about 10 pages ago?!?!?! If you think that was 70 pages of 'discussion' you're delusional. I didn't belittle anyone. I commented that it was more hissy fit and knee jerk. There was NOT a lot of thinking going on. Seemed like a lot of venting and reaction. BGute is correcting some of building blocks that were not the foundation he sees moving forward. Good for Gute. He's the boss now and it is way too early to be pissing and moaning about things that nobody knows how they will turn out. It's funny, you were complaining about the Packers doing nothing and, predictably, you complain when the first move is made. Good luck to you man. Most of his complaining was and still is about the team not doing anything to improve the defense. You think HZ would have responded this way if the first move was adding someone on defense? No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtcheezwiz Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Chinaski_86 said: Most of his complaining was and still is about the team not doing anything to improve the defense. You think HZ would have responded this way if the first move was adding someone on defense? No. Nah it was more about us now needing to acquire 3 CB's now. It will be interesting to see how they fill that void but I'm still optimistic that we sign at least one FA there and much of this blows over. But ya if they had followed the trade up immediately with news they were signing a CB , then there is probably much more agreement on the trade lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_gb Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 6 hours ago, NormSizedMidget said: He can really look the part. He's built nice and throws hard. It feels like it stops there. Maybe he's smarter than I give him credit for. But that's my lean now. Just a slow guy out there mentally. Doesn't see it but thinks he is anticipating things. But then it's not there but the ball goes there anyways. He's not toast.. Mike should have fun with the clay to mold though. How much can we put on that to Rookie Jitters? Then add in the rough situation he was in with Hue Jackson? How would you like to be the starting quarterback as a rookie for a Head Coach that publicly goes out there and humiliates and throws his players under the bus? Honestly ... I think those struggles could have been mental out of fear of making a mistake so he was doing a lot of over thinking. I'm not entirely sure but It's a speculation. It's hard being a starting rookie QB to begin with, let alone on arguably the worst team in the NFL with a head case for a head coach. I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt for now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemike778 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 10 hours ago, TheGreatZepp said: I doubt many will argue that the defensive backfield greatly underperformed to expectations. The physical tools were there but the performance wasnt there, everyone back there needs to be reevaluated. Gone is Capers, coaching and scheme was certainly partially at fault. You have to think about pass rush and how to generate more to take pressure off the backend. The rest of the equation begins with evaluating the in house talent. On field performance, Contract, health, physical abilities/fit, attitude all factor in. The Packers have for arguments sake cut ties with old leadership, McCarthy is ready to move on, they are lookin at the team with new eyes and little sentimental/prior attachment. Really, who is going to buy in and perform to expectations. When I look at it this way it is easy to see why the Packers moved on from Randall and I doubt he’s the only one they are ready to move on from but he became the poster child for the underperforming secondary last year. He wasn’t going to be resigned after 2018, his commitment to the team has been publicly brought into question, he hasn’t been durable. There is the argument that for stretches of the season he was the best player in the secondary but when everyone looks replaceable the other variables need to make the decisions. At the end of the day, if the management didn't want Randall then he had to go. Ultimately I suppose though, there is no way of dressing this up -the roster looks weaker than it did before. For all his faults, based on his play from last year, we looked to have a talented starter on a rookie wage. We may well be able to replace him with an equal player but it will cost more - that money will come from another area of the roster so letting go of Randall may say cost us a receiver. Somewhere down the line it costs us a player. Looking at the roster, the more I think about it maybe tanking a year might be the way to sort everything out. I don't want us to restructure players or backload contracts which leave us with bad contracts down the line. Maybe just take the hit in 2018, let Nelson, Cobb and Clay play out their contract - give Rodgers a front loaded contract and probably end up picking relatively early again next year with the roster much better set up. Rodgers probably wouldn't like it but if he is going to be asking for the world with his deal then he can't really complain. I'm at peace with the trade now, accept it had to be done - and just accepting the roster is weaker than I thought it was a few days ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 17 minutes ago, mikemike778 said: At the end of the day, if the management didn't want Randall then he had to go. Ultimately I suppose though, there is no way of dressing this up -the roster looks weaker than it did before. For all his faults, based on his play from last year, we looked to have a talented starter on a rookie wage. We may well be able to replace him with an equal player but it will cost more - that money will come from another area of the roster so letting go of Randall may say cost us a receiver. Somewhere down the line it costs us a player. Looking at the roster, the more I think about it maybe tanking a year might be the way to sort everything out. I don't want us to restructure players or backload contracts which leave us with bad contracts down the line. Maybe just take the hit in 2018, let Nelson, Cobb and Clay play out their contract - give Rodgers a front loaded contract and probably end up picking relatively early again next year with the roster much better set up. Rodgers probably wouldn't like it but if he is going to be asking for the world with his deal then he can't really complain. I'm at peace with the trade now, accept it had to be done - and just accepting the roster is weaker than I thought it was a few days ago. We are only weaker at one position and we still have plenty of opportunities to address corner before the start of TC. I think we upgraded the backup QB. Everyone was sick of watching Hundley running around like a chicken with his head cut off throwing up ducks. Now we have a kid with arguably a better skill set. Plus we won't have to use a draft pick on that position and can spend our capital on TE and the defense. I suppose getting a vet backup QB would have been a nice luxury but unless we fix our defense it won't matter who is under center in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikemike778 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 1 minute ago, Pugger said: We are only weaker at one position and we still have plenty of opportunities to address corner before the start of TC. I think we upgraded the backup QB. Everyone was sick of watching Hundley running around like a chicken with his head cut off throwing up ducks. Now we have a kid with arguably a better skill set. Plus we won't have to use a draft pick on that position and can spend our capital on TE and the defense. I suppose getting a vet backup QB would have been a nice luxury but unless we fix our defense it won't matter who is under center in the end. Does upgrading backup QB to a different project really matter ? If Rodgers goes down then Kizer instead of Hundley might give us a better chance of getting to 7-9 instead of 6-10 but it doesn't really improve our chances of having a run in the playoffs. Sorry but don't really see any positives in terms of our outlook for 2018. Its not the end of the world (and the more you read, the more its clear we had to lose him) and its only like a starter going down with a serious injury but its a disappointing start to the off-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, mikemike778 said: Does upgrading backup QB to a different project really matter ? If Rodgers goes down then Kizer instead of Hundley might give us a better chance of getting to 7-9 instead of 6-10 but it doesn't really improve our chances of having a run in the playoffs. Sorry but don't really see any positives in terms of our outlook for 2018. Its not the end of the world (and the more you read, the more its clear we had to lose him) and its only like a starter going down with a serious injury but its a disappointing start to the off-season. I was tired of watching Hundley masquerading as an NFL QB so upgrading that position is a positive move IMO. If we don't fix our defense - and I think we can do better than Randall in the slot and we have time to do so - will it matter who is our QB? I 2015 and 16 Rodgers was relatively healthy but our defenses were dreadful so we lost even with #12 playing out of his mind, especially in AZ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtcheezwiz Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 10 minutes ago, mikemike778 said: Does upgrading backup QB to a different project really matter ? If Rodgers goes down then Kizer instead of Hundley might give us a better chance of getting to 7-9 instead of 6-10 but it doesn't really improve our chances of having a run in the playoffs. Sorry but don't really see any positives in terms of our outlook for 2018. Its not the end of the world (and the more you read, the more its clear we had to lose him) and its only like a starter going down with a serious injury but its a disappointing start to the off-season. There is no way to tell one now, but you can certainly be excited about having a developmental project with more tools than Hundley. We know what we have in Hundley, a bum, so at least they got a guy they think they can mold into a decent player. We have no idea what it is that attracted them to Kizer, but it's clear there was a lot of interest there. But regardless I personally just don't see how you can say he isn't an upgrade over Hundley. Let's not just act like Rodgers going down for the season is the only possible scenario we see Kizer either. Plenty of short term injuries or scanrios Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 I don't understand the mindset of writing off Hundley. I get that watching him sucked. I get that he's been in a system for three years. But game reps matter. He didn't have any coming into the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sgtcheezwiz Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 5 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: I don't understand the mindset of writing off Hundley. I get that watching him sucked. I get that he's been in a system for three years. But game reps matter. He didn't have any coming into the season. Same, of course, goes for Kizer. I think it would be wise to keep Hundley around for competition - I don't think they will get anything for him in a trade. Hundley vs Kizer would be a fun battle to watch through pre season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 1 minute ago, sgtcheezwiz said: Same, of course, goes for Kizer. I think it would be wise to keep Hundley around for competition - I don't think they will get anything for him in a trade. Hundley vs Kizer would be a fun battle to watch through pre season. If it's anything like the regular season, I think "fun" might be the wrong word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted March 11, 2018 Share Posted March 11, 2018 1 hour ago, mikemike778 said: Looking at the roster, the more I think about it maybe tanking a year might be the way to sort everything out. I don't want us to restructure players or backload contracts which leave us with bad contracts down the line. Maybe just take the hit in 2018, let Nelson, Cobb and Clay play out their contract - give Rodgers a front loaded contract and probably end up picking relatively early again next year with the roster much better set up. Rodgers probably wouldn't like it but if he is going to be asking for the world with his deal then he can't really complain. I agree in regards to Nelson, Cobb, and Clay. Especially Nelson. There were points in the season last year where he looked really old. If that is the player that he is going to be now, I don't want him on the team at all, and I certainly don't want that player counting against the cap in 3 years. I think we can all agree that Cobb and Clay are over paid for their production. With Cobb, we can probably get some of his production out of other players that currently cost a lot less. Clay still makes this team better. The depth behind him is not very good. Clay at his current salary is a better value than all of his back-ups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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