Packers sign TE Jimmy Graham

[Arthur Penske]

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[sgtcheezwiz]

They used to throw the back shoulder to Finley with pretty good success, idk why they couldn't use that with Graham. Ofc it won't be the only thing he does.

I think Graham will have a huge impact this season. People are worried about his speed, read one scout thinks he is around 4.7 now, but Finley ran a 4.86. Looks like Finley broke more tackles, both make/made insane contested catches, Graham has 2 inches of height and bigger hands. Have read Graham has had some issues with drops but iirc correctly Finley did too, I'll have to check the stats to confirm. 

 

Maybe once cornermania passes you all will appreciate this move a little more lol.

[Gopackgonerd]

Lol that PS

[MacReady]

Why wouldn't they Photoshop that 87 into 88?  Too soon.  Too soon to see another 87. 

[ReadyToThump]

2 hours ago, Gopackgonerd said:

Lol that PS

When did Jordy start taking HGH and tanning?

[Packerraymond]

So who's the better player? Lance Kendricks or Geronimo Allison? This could be an irrelevant conversation with FA and draft still to come, but in 11 personnel do you want Graham out wide at WR with Adams and Kendricks inline or Allison out wide with Graham inline? Figure Cobb in the slot and Adams on the boundary are the only guarantees at this point.

[squire12]

1 minute ago, Packerraymond said:

So who's the better player? Lance Kendricks or Geronimo Allison? This could be an irrelevant conversation with FA and draft still to come, but in 11 personnel do you want Graham out wide at WR with Adams and Kendricks inline or Allison out wide with Graham inline? Figure Cobb in the slot and Adams on the boundary are the only guarantees at this point.

Can I say neither and hope for an upgrade somewhere in the FA or draft yet to come???

[CWood21]

Haven't really had a chance to ring into this signing, so here I go...

First off, he doesn't have to be New Orleans Jimmy Graham in order for this signing to be successful.  As long as he's better than what he was with Jimmy Graham, that's a success.  Let's look at the two offenses.  They're near polar opposites in terms of design and drive.  In New Orleans, he was part of a pass-heavy offense and in his final four seasons with New Orleans he averaged 138 attempts.  With Seattle, he averaged 88 targets per game.  Another 50 attempts goes a long way towards improving production.  That being said, I anticipate those numbers being closer to New Orleans' numbers than Seattle numbers simply because the Packers are a more pass-happy offense than Aaron Rodgers.  So unless you believe that he's lost a step or not as productive as before, I think you have to be optimistic about seeing a bounce back in production.

Secondly, I'm interested to see the contract in it's entirety.  Right now, the only thing we know is that the Packers are giving $22M of that $30M in the first two seasons.  Based on recent contracts, they're roughly 30% in signing bonuses so assuming that's the case we're looking at a signing bonus of $9M.  I'd anticipate a cap hit close to $7M-$8M.

[Packer_ESP]

6 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Secondly, I'm interested to see the contract in it's entirety.  Right now, the only thing we know is that the Packers are giving $22M of that $30M in the first two seasons.  Based on recent contracts, they're roughly 30% in signing bonuses so assuming that's the case we're looking at a signing bonus of $9M.  I'd anticipate a cap hit close to $7M-$8M.

I was just playing around with these numbers and I agree the cap hit for this year should be around 7M. The only figures we know for sure are the 22M and 30M you just mentioned. If we assume that 30% signing bonus we're looking at a third year with 8M in salary (30 - 22) plus 3M cap hit from the SB, which makes it 11M in cap hit. Three possibilities going from one extreme to the opposite:

• 1M base salary in 2018, 12M in 2019: cap hits are 4-15-11 and player cash is 10-12-8. Very unlikely, it's great for 2018 but 15M in 2019 is a tough pill to swallow.
• 4M base salary in 2018, 9M in 2019: cap hits are 7-12-11 and player cash is 13-9-8 which is a good spread.
• 7M base salary in 2018, 6M in 2019: cap hits are 10-9-11 and player cash is 16-6-8. Too much cash upfront and the hit this year is too high.

The middle option is the most realistic I think, give or take 1M.

[CWood21]

2 minutes ago, Packer_ESP said:

I was just playing around with these numbers and I agree the cap hit for this year should be around 7M. The only figures we know for sure are the 22M and 30M you just mentioned. If we assume that 30% signing bonus we're looking at a third year with 8M in salary (30 - 22) plus 3M cap hit from the SB, which makes it 11M in cap hit. Three possibilities going from one extreme to the opposite:

• 1M base salary in 2018, 12M in 2019: cap hits are 4-15-11 and player cash is 10-12-8. Very unlikely, it's great for 2018 but 15M in 2019 is a tough pill to swallow.
• 4M base salary in 2018, 9M in 2019: cap hits are 7-12-11 and player cash is 13-9-8 which is a good spread.
• 7M base salary in 2018, 6M in 2019: cap hits are 10-9-11 and player cash is 16-6-8. Too much cash upfront and the hit this year is too high.

The middle option is the most realistic I think, give or take 1M.

Just a half-haard guess...

2018: 4 million salary/bonuses, 3 million SB = $7M cap hit
2019: 9 million salary/bonuses , 3 million SB = $12M cap hit
2020: 8 million salary/bonsues, 3 million SB = $11M cap hit

I suppose they could move another million or two to year 1 if they wanted, but I anticipate it structured something like that.

[vegas492]

20 hours ago, JBURGE25 said:

not sure if serious

What don't you get?  He was a collegiate basketball player, who turned to football for one year and was drafted on potential.  Potential that really, really paid off!

[JBURGE]

5 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

What don't you get?  He was a collegiate basketball player, who turned to football for one year and was drafted on potential.  Potential that really, really paid off!

the joke is that every quarter since jimmy graham entered the nfl the commentators have mentioned how he played basketball. It's been a running joke for years and extended to a handful of different tight ends lol

[vegas492]

Sorry, JBurge25, I didn't get the joke.

[sgtcheezwiz]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

Haven't really had a chance to ring into this signing, so here I go...

First off, he doesn't have to be New Orleans Jimmy Graham in order for this signing to be successful.  As long as he's better than what he was with Jimmy Graham, that's a success.  Let's look at the two offenses.  They're near polar opposites in terms of design and drive.  In New Orleans, he was part of a pass-heavy offense and in his final four seasons with New Orleans he averaged 138 attempts.  With Seattle, he averaged 88 targets per game.  Another 50 attempts goes a long way towards improving production.  That being said, I anticipate those numbers being closer to New Orleans' numbers than Seattle numbers simply because the Packers are a more pass-happy offense than Aaron Rodgers.  So unless you believe that he's lost a step or not as productive as before, I think you have to be optimistic about seeing a bounce back in production.

Secondly, I'm interested to see the contract in it's entirety.  Right now, the only thing we know is that the Packers are giving $22M of that $30M in the first two seasons.  Based on recent contracts, they're roughly 30% in signing bonuses so assuming that's the case we're looking at a signing bonus of $9M.  I'd anticipate a cap hit close to $7M-$8M.

Even if you think he lost a step, he is still faster than most tight ends. Think it was Silverstein of McGinn talked to a scout who said Jimmy probably has 4.7 speed. It's no official measurement ofc, but they still think he has some speed. I have found two 40 times for Jermichael Finley- a 4.86 and 4.67. Might be a wash on speed? Finley was huge for us, I expect Graham to be even better.

[CWood21]

1 minute ago, sgtcheezwiz said:

Even if you think he lost a step, he is still faster than most tight ends. Think it was Silverstein of McGinn talked to a scout who said Jimmy probably has 4.7 speed. It's no official measurement ofc, but they still think he has some speed. I have found two 40 times for Jermichael Finley- a 4.86 and 4.67. Might be a wash on speed? Finley was huge for us, I expect Graham to be even better.

I mean, he doesn't even have to be a burner.  He's still 6'7" with strong hands.  That will never change.  How many LBs are there in the league that can run with Graham?  Probably a few.  Now of those few, how many of them can go win a 1-on-1 battle with him?  Probably even less.  There's very few players who can match up with Graham, and if you're going to play man coverage on Graham you're probably forced to use your safety over him.  So if you're using one of your safeties on Graham, you're either rolling with a single high safety or you're taking one of your LBs off the field in favor of a 3rd safety.  That is going to make it easier to run the ball.