7DnBrnc53 Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 3 hours ago, broncos67 said: How on earth was an oft-injured 7th round pick "handed the job by default?" That's just flat out not true. They brought in Sanchez AND a first round pick because Siemian was an afterthough, and he outperformed them both and did the same thing this year. Sloter is not better than either of these guys at this moment. He just isn't. He's a PS candidate. If we trotted Sloter out for the first game of the season, we would get slaughtered Sanchez was bad. I saw the preseason game. And, Lynch was just flat-out not ready last year (or this). Also, I bet Sloter could do better than Siemian. He is not a rough and tumble veteran NFL QB. People seem to talk about Trevor like he is. Let the guy get the team to the playoffs (and win a game or two), and then start worshipping him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBruin Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 Not quite sold on Siemian's decision making being that great as of now but I'm sure another year of experience will help. To me, his quick release and ball placement are his two most impressive traits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
champ11 Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 Just now, BroncoBruin said: Not quite sold on Siemian's decision making being that great as of now but I'm sure another year of experience will help. To me, his quick release and ball placement are his two most impressive traits. He did have quite a few dropped interceptions last season. It was impressive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBruin Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 1 minute ago, 7DnBrnc53 said: Sanchez was bad. I saw the preseason game. And, Lynch was just flat-out not ready last year (or this). Also, I bet Sloter could do better than Siemian. He is not a rough and tumble veteran NFL QB. People seem to talk about him like he has. Let the guy get the team to the playoffs (and win a game or two), and then praise him. And Sloter is...what? A stiff in the pocket with a nice arm as of now. He's only practiced and played against 3rd team guys. Why oh why do people always fall into this trap... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncosFan2010 Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 Quote Why oh why do people always fall into this trap Right. Trevor was Sloter before Sloter and Zach Dysert was Trevor before Trevor. Classic grass is always greener mentality. Brandstater, Dysert, Van Pelt, that dude from Minnesota, no Sloter. We always have the next Tom Brady. Then they get cut and everyone forgets about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 We all knew after the 1st preseason game the job was Siemians. Lynch just didn't have it and it was blatantly obvious. Ive read and listened too some that don't see Lynch's off-season as an indictment on his future. I personally don't get this. He looked BAD. He didn't look like he'd made an inch of progress from year 1 to year 2. Honestly, I thought he looked better last year in regular season games than he did this preseason. I'm also someone who thought he'd win the job based off of him progressing off of what I saw last year. He didn't make that progress. To me, he looks like someone who doesn't want the job. He was timid and scared. It's part of the world. You see it in every profession, people who are fine where they're at and don't want anymore than that. Yes, even in the NFL. Lynch seemed like that type based on his performance. I know he's young and people place professional athletes on a different level than a normal job even though it isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncos67 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 15 hours ago, 7DnBrnc53 said: Sanchez was bad. I saw the preseason game. And, Lynch was just flat-out not ready last year (or this). Also, I bet Sloter could do better than Siemian. He is not a rough and tumble veteran NFL QB. People seem to talk about Trevor like he is. Let the guy get the team to the playoffs (and win a game or two), and then start worshipping him. Siemian was an afterthought that literally not one Broncos fan gave any credence to. None. Why do you think Sloter could do better than an 8-6 record and a set of stats roughly equal to other young QBs in this league? That's absolutely laughable man. I don't think anyone thinks Siemian is this veteran stud QB, but he's also quite a bit better than some fans are willing to give him credit for. The irony in the last sentence is strong- yes, Siemian should definitely start to take the next step to be considered the QBOTF, but there's a lot of Sloter worship based on....what specifically? It cuts both ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7DnBrnc53 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, broncos67 said: Siemian was an afterthought that literally not one Broncos fan gave any credence to. None. Why do you think Sloter could do better than an 8-6 record and a set of stats roughly equal to other young QBs in this league? That's absolutely laughable man. I don't think anyone thinks Siemian is this veteran stud QB, but he's also quite a bit better than some fans are willing to give him credit for. The irony in the last sentence is strong- yes, Siemian should definitely start to take the next step to be considered the QBOTF, but there's a lot of Sloter worship based on....what specifically? It cuts both ways. I don't worship Sloter. I just think that he should get more of a fair chance to compete for the starting job. We don't know if Siemian is as good as you are making him out to be (when you say that he is quite a bit better than fans give him credit for). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
broncos67 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 Just now, 7DnBrnc53 said: I don't worship Sloter. I just think that he should get more of a fair chance to compete for the starting job. We don't know if Siemian is as good as you are making him out to be (when you say that he is quite a bit better than fans give him credit for). This team is too good, even with the issues, for a UDFA rookie QB who hasn't really proven anything to get a trial period. It's not realistic. Maybe if the team falls off a cliff this year, but frankly, we have one of the better defenses assembled in recently memory, and we can't throw that away on Sloter. Hell, we can't even throw it away on Lynch. Regardless of your thoughts on Siemian, the reality is he has a ton of respect from his teammates for last season and he was voted a captain. With a new coaching staff, the entire locker room would be lost before the season even started if they just tossed Siemian aside. I'm not saying Siemian is the savior, but what I am saying is that if Paxton Lynch had Siemian's season last year, the hype train would be exponentially through the roof. He made a huge leap from Year 1 to starting last year. It could happen again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 11 hours ago, germ-x said: We all knew after the 1st preseason game the job was Siemians. Lynch just didn't have it and it was blatantly obvious. Ive read and listened too some that don't see Lynch's off-season as an indictment on his future. I personally don't get this. He looked BAD. He didn't look like he'd made an inch of progress from year 1 to year 2. Honestly, I thought he looked better last year in regular season games than he did this preseason. I'm also someone who thought he'd win the job based off of him progressing off of what I saw last year. He didn't make that progress. To me, he looks like someone who doesn't want the job. He was timid and scared. It's part of the world. You see it in every profession, people who are fine where they're at and don't want anymore than that. Yes, even in the NFL. Lynch seemed like that type based on his performance. I know he's young and people place professional athletes on a different level than a normal job even though it isn't. To criticize people saying we shouldn't be worried about Lynch's lack of progress is entirely fair. But I think the distinction is that it's still too soon to write Lynch off like many are calling for - saying he's a bust, sunk cost, etc. The reality is that where Lynch started from, not being ready even now, that was very much a likely possibility when he got drafted. It's why I was torn on taking him Rd 1 last year, I didn't see him as a help-now QB. Hell, 2 years was quoted by a ton of scouts, not just Mel Kiper. The people who said this was crazy talk were basing those conclusions mostly out of wishful thinking, because we needed a QB to step up. Maybe that's why a bunch of our fanbase is saying we should just call it quits now. In reality, the unrealistic expectations are a big part of the problem too. Now, none of the above means Lynch is going to make the leap, and it certainly raises the possibility he never gets there - the lack of progress is very discouraging. I don't know how any rational person could say otherwise. But if he was starting from scratch last year, it's entirely still very possible the extra year will allow him to bridge the gap where the game finally slows down for him. Because right now, he's not even close to ready - but that's also a function of the game being too fast for him - his read progression, D recognition and anticipation are all behind - those also end up being elements that compound struggles. Ironically, it's those areas (except anticipation) where Siemian excels. So it's not surprising at all that Siemian just looks miles ahead of Lynch prep-wise. Just like the criticism that Siemian wasn't a fiery rah-rah guy on the sidelines had zero merit, I wouldn't get too fussed about Lynch's demeanor right now - he's clearly not ready, and when you face adversity for the first time, it takes a lot to bounce back - rarely does it happen right away. If Lynch acted all p***ed at himself, and angry, we'd be saying he's lost his cool. The reality is we want to see better D recognition, faster read progression, eyes up with pressure when he moves out of the pocket. All those 3 should lead to better anticipation and ball placement. None of the above is a lock to happen - lots of physical talents fail in this exact department. But really, the rest is all sideshow - at least VJ & co. were kind enough to end the pain of this "competition" now. Next offseason, no excuses - 2 years to learn, if you can't be good enough to start, well no getting around the bust label for a 1st-rounder Elway traded up for. And believe me, given my takes on Elway's draft history, take it FWIW when I say we need another year before closing the book on Lynch's future. As for Siemian's future - let's face it, this is his make or break it year - make progress, and yeah, we can think on whether we extend him beyond his cheap years. Struggle, and we look again for our long-term option. The trick is that Siemian's physical limitations make a leap into a top 12 QB (forget top 5, top 12 would be enough to stay as our QB beyond this year) relies on his improvement in the anticipation/placement area (he has to commit that hair sooner to fit balls into tight windows in the RZ, or get the deeper completions). It's already good, but it needs to become near-elite. As with Lynch, it's no lock that happens, but the progress made in Year 1, well, let's hope we see it in Year 2. Even a top-15 QB would likely get us into the playoffs, and then, who knows (although I wish we had actually addressed run D, but that's for another thread).... Lastly, I don't know how committing to Siemian right now gets translated to "he's our QBOTF". It's not like Elway is committing to an extension. Siemian gives us our best shot to win now. If he makes a big leap forward, let's have the great future debate on how long we should commit to him. If he's more of last year, then yeah, we need to think 2018 & long-term if Lynch isn't ready next offseason (and again, our cap $ situation / draft position makes getting an elite FA QB, or a top 3 elite-ceiling draft QB, a pipe dream.....so let's hope either or both guys progress this season, and check in on Kelly/Sloter's progress next offseason, too - but barring injury, from the IR & PS, respectively). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBruin Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 I don't think it should be undersold just how dramatically Lynch needs to improve though, and in areas where it's difficult to. Accuracy. Touch. Feel for the pocket. Keeping those eyes up, reading the entire field. Speed of release. To improve in every area here is a total pipe dream and you rarely see substantial improvement in a few of these traits. I'm not going to call it impossible but there might be a 10% chance of Lynch panning out, he has to change nearly everything about the way he plays the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsthomp2007 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 6 hours ago, broncos67 said: This team is too good, even with the issues, for a UDFA rookie QB who hasn't really proven anything to get a trial period. It's not realistic. Maybe if the team falls off a cliff this year, but frankly, we have one of the better defenses assembled in recently memory, and we can't throw that away on Sloter. Hell, we can't even throw it away on Lynch. Regardless of your thoughts on Siemian, the reality is he has a ton of respect from his teammates for last season and he was voted a captain. With a new coaching staff, the entire locker room would be lost before the season even started if they just tossed Siemian aside. I'm not saying Siemian is the savior, but what I am saying is that if Paxton Lynch had Siemian's season last year, the hype train would be exponentially through the roof. He made a huge leap from Year 1 to starting last year. It could happen again. I have to say that Sloter competed in at a Div II level where at least Siemien, when healthy, had to face Big 10 competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsthomp2007 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 What are Siemien's physical limitations? He isn't Doug Flutie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 I read an article about the qbs and Nfl done by Woody Paige. And in NFL history only 2 qbs picked in the 20s became franchise picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsthomp2007 Posted August 23, 2017 Share Posted August 23, 2017 1 hour ago, thebestever6 said: I read an article about the qbs and Nfl done by Woody Paige. And in NFL history only 2 qbs picked in the 20s became franchise picks. So you are saying there's a chance. I will wait for the Dumb and Dumber gif. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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