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Football's Future Top 100 -- #12

Danger

By Danger
in NFL Comparisons

-First Choice-  

35 members have voted

  1. 1. -First Choice-

    • QB Matt Ryan
      2
    • QB Ben Roethlisberger
      1
    • RB Todd Gurley
      3
    • RB Ezekiel Elliot
      1
    • WR DeAndre Hopkins
      2
    • WR Julio Jones
      10
    • TE Travis Kelce
      0
    • T Trent Williams
      1
    • T Lane Johnson
      0
    • G Zack Martin
      6
    • DT Geno Atkins
      0
    • DT Fletcher Cox
      0
    • EDGE Chandler Jones
      0
    • EDGE Calais Campbell
      0
    • EDGE Cameron Jordan
      0
    • LB Bobby Wagner
      0
    • CB Xavier Rhodes
      0
    • CB Jalen Ramsey
      7
    • S Harrison Smith
      2
    • Other (I can only put 20 choices on here so if I missed your choice whoops -- Please specify)
      0

  2. 2. -Second Choice-

    • QB Matt Ryan
      0
    • QB Ben Roethlisberger
      2
    • RB Todd Gurley
      1
    • RB Ezekiel Elliot
      1
    • WR DeAndre Hopkins
      3
    • WR Julio Jones
      5
    • TE Travis Kelce
      0
    • T Trent Williams
      1
    • T Lane Johnson
      0
    • G Zack Martin
      6
    • DT Geno Atkins
      1
    • DT Fletcher Cox
      4
    • EDGE Chandler Jones
      1
    • EDGE Calais Campbell
      0
    • EDGE Cameron Jordan
      0
    • LB Bobby Wagner
      0
    • CB Xavier Rhodes
      0
    • CB Jalen Ramsey
      9
    • S Harrison Smith
      1
    • Other (I can only put 20 choices on here so if I missed your choice whoops -- Please specify)
      0

  3. 3. -Third Choice-

    • QB Matt Ryan
      0
    • QB Ben Roethlisberger
      0
    • RB Todd Gurley
      1
    • RB Ezekiel Elliot
      2
    • WR DeAndre Hopkins
      0
    • WR Julio Jones
      2
    • TE Travis Kelce
      0
    • T Trent Williams
      3
    • T Lane Johnson
      1
    • G Zack Martin
      4
    • DT Geno Atkins
      1
    • DT Fletcher Cox
      3
    • EDGE Chandler Jones
      2
    • EDGE Calais Campbell
      2
    • EDGE Cameron Jordan
      0
    • LB Bobby Wagner
      1
    • CB Xavier Rhodes
      0
    • CB Jalen Ramsey
      10
    • S Harrison Smith
      3
    • Other (I can only put 20 choices on here so if I missed your choice whoops -- Please specify)
      0

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ET80

ET80

Posted
Posted
36 minutes ago, Danger said:

Lets look at #4 and #5. They have Eli Manning and Andy Dalton throwing to them...

And nobody in their right mind would think that the likes of Ryan Fitzpatrick, Ryan Mallett, Bryan Hoyer, TJ Yates, Tom Savage or Brock Osweiler is anywhere near those two, either. Much like Ryan, there is a pretty big gap between Eli, Dalton and the Texans QBs in that timeframe.

36 minutes ago, Danger said:

Maybe I'll put Hopkins in the same tier as Julio and AB this season. We'll have to see how he can do with Watson for a significant part of the season.

This is what I'm kind of getting at. In the six games WITH Watson, Hopkins put up these numbers on average:

6.34/91.84/1.0

When Watson went down?

6.375/96.125/0.75

So, catches remained consistent, yards went UP, TDs dropped a quarter - despite the significant talent difference between Watson and Tom Savage/TJ Yates.

So - Hopkins is proving he's QB proof. Get it in his general direction and he'll make a play. We don't know what Julio would be like we without his Pro Bowl level QB, but we DO know that Hopkins still looks like an elite player no matter who is QB.

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DaBoys

DaBoys

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, Texas_OutLaw7 said:

I keep voting for Martin. Maybe I am biased?

I don't think so. The Cowboys have some of the best players in the league. Certainly a group of top 20 players. They play OL and RB. After that? There are only 2 players(Lee, Lawrence) that deserve consideration to even be on the top 200 list.

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RandyMossIsBoss

RandyMossIsBoss

Posted
Posted
8 minutes ago, DaBoys said:

I don't think so. The Cowboys have some of the best players in the league. Certainly a group of top 20 players. They play OL and RB. After that? There are only 2 players(Lee, Lawrence) that deserve consideration to even be on the top 200 list.

Yeah it's not, I assume people are just not voting OL for whatever reason, valid or not. Martin is surely the consensus #1 guard, and will be one of the 1st three offensive linemen ranked on this list, possibly #1.

I think Lawrence is definitely top 100, closer to top 50. I'd say him, the three OL and Zeke are safely top 100, Lee borderline due to obvious durability concerns.

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Jakuvious

Jakuvious

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, ET80 said:

And nobody in their right mind would think that the likes of Ryan Fitzpatrick, Ryan Mallett, Bryan Hoyer, TJ Yates, Tom Savage or Brock Osweiler is anywhere near those two, either. Much like Ryan, there is a pretty big gap between Eli, Dalton and the Texans QBs in that timeframe.

This is what I'm kind of getting at. In the six games WITH Watson, Hopkins put up these numbers on average:

6.34/91.84/1.0

When Watson went down?

6.375/96.125/0.75

So, catches remained consistent, yards went UP, TDs dropped a quarter - despite the significant talent difference between Watson and Tom Savage/TJ Yates.

So - Hopkins is proving he's QB proof. Get it in his general direction and he'll make a play. We don't know what Julio would be like we without his Pro Bowl level QB, but we DO know that Hopkins still looks like an elite player no matter who is QB.

I feel like you changed your argument here once you actually looked up the numbers. Because initially you said:

Quote

We caught a six game glimpse of what Hopkins can do with an elite QB at his disposal, so a fill 16 game stretch will tell you what I'm preaching here. 

But since that 6 game glimpse wasn't really any different than what Hopkins did all season last year, it really shouldn't shift any opinions. Now you're instead saying the argument is that he's QB proof, but that's silly because you're saying he's better than Julio because of something we can't know about Julio. And we do have some previous seasons that make Hopkins look a little less QB proof.

I'm a big fan of Hopkins. There's some things he does I think better or as well as anyone in the league. He's been infuriating for the Chiefs for years. One of Marcus Peters's worst matchups by far. But even if you want to extrapolate his stats with Watson and say that is who he would've been for years with better QB play, that still leaves him less productive than Julio most seasons. He would win the fake TD battle at that point, but that's about it. If your argument for one player over another is going to be speculative, statistically, it should at least present a clear advantage with that speculation. He flat outperforms and outproduces Julio next year, sure, then there's merit to the debate. But as it is, there's really no track record, even breaking it down to small sample sizes like you did, to argue Hopkins's production over Jones's.

And aside from maybe TDs, I'm normally not that big on the bad QB argument for skill position players. The targets often make it a wash. Great WRs still product with poor QB play because they get forcefed by bad QBs, whereas your great QBs will operate more on reading the defense and are more likely to use that great WR as a decoy.

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AlNFL19

AlNFL19

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, Danger said:

Lets look at #4 and #5. They have Eli Manning and Andy Dalton throwing to them...

Maybe I'll put Hopkins in the same tier as Julio and AB this season. We'll have to see how he can do with Watson for a significant part of the season.

I'm not sure which I'd take, but Hopkins and Beckham catch everything. Those two could have great years.

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