Game of Thrones - Our Watch has Ended

[ramssuperbowl99]

2 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Him being a Targaryen mattered, sure, but not him being the heir to the throne. Hell, even if he wasn't a Targ and he was just Jon Snow, loyal adviser to Dany, do you still think Drogon would've not let him through?

No I don't think Drogon would've let him through.

And your right, Jon being the heir to the throne didn't end up mattering. There was no throne. There was no support for any monarchy at all. The ending of the show attacked the underlying evil that had been built up by Aegon over 300 years, and was represented by the Iron Throne (which is basically the Ring of Power in the Lord of the Rings). 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

1 minute ago, ramssuperbowl99 said:

Rhaegar believed his first son Aegon (with Elia, not Jon Snow) would be TPWWP because he was born under a red comet when Rhaegar wasn't. But he also believed there needed to be 3 Targaryan children. "The dragon has 3 heads" was a quote from him, which isn't related to the prophecy directly, but is related to the Targ sigil. The problem is that Elia couldn't have children after the 2 she had with Rhaegar. 

He was also aware that "[TPWWP] is the song of ice and fire", so a Stark-Targ child would fit that description well.

Okay so basically it could've literally been any random girl from the North and fulfilled that description. There was nothing special about Lyanna herself that fit the prophecy.

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

Just now, ramssuperbowl99 said:

No I don't think Drogon would've let him through.

Really? Why not? What if Grey Worm had something important to tell Dany?

Just now, ramssuperbowl99 said:

And your right, Jon being the heir to the throne didn't end up mattering. There was no throne. There was no support for any monarchy at all. The ending of the show attacked the underlying evil that had been built up by Aegon over 300 years, and was represented by the Iron Throne (which is basically the Ring of Power in the Lord of the Rings). 

And now what they instead chose to do was have all the Starks and their friends choose a Stark to sit on the throne  very democratic, indeed.

[ramssuperbowl99]

Just now, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Okay so basically it could've literally been any random girl from the North and fulfilled that description. There was nothing special about Lyanna herself that fit the prophecy.

No the Starks have ice in their veins that are unique from a random northerner. It wasn't shown in the the TV series, but in the books all of the Stark children are wargs, Ned could be shirtless in Winterfell and stay warm even in winter, etc.

 

[AFlaccoSeagulls]

Just now, ramssuperbowl99 said:

No the Starks have ice in their veins that are unique from a random northerner. It wasn't shown in the the TV series, but in the books all of the Stark children are wargs, Ned could be shirtless in Winterfell and stay warm even in winter, etc.

You're right, that would've been nice to know because otherwise there's no point in believing that Rhaegar chose Lyanna for some special purpose, and instead suggests he liked her because she was a beautiful woman and needed to make a son for his prophecy.

[ramssuperbowl99]

1 minute ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Really? Why not? What if Grey Worm had something important to tell Dany?

And now what they instead chose to do was have all the Starks and their friends choose a Stark to sit on the throne  very democratic, indeed.

You said you didn't understand why the show would tell you Jon Snow was the rightful heir, and then that didn't end up mattering. That's why. The ending went after the institutions of power that we took for granted.

Why I don't think Drogon would have let anyone though is because I'm a "dragons are smart" believer since that's what Tyrion said. There was this staredown before Jon walked by, so Drogon may have even known what Jon was going to do and let him do it because he's a Targ and because he knew his mom was too corrupted by the dream of the Iron Throne.

[Calvert28]

13 minutes ago, ramssuperbowl99 said:

No I don't think Drogon would've let him through.

And your right, Jon being the heir to the throne didn't end up mattering. There was no throne. There was no support for any monarchy at all. The ending of the show attacked the underlying evil that had been built up by Aegon over 300 years, and was represented by the Iron Throne (which is basically the Ring of Power in the Lord of the Rings). 

Ehhhh not exactly. The throne unified Westeros and any government form can be corrupt. Marxism in an ideal environment is like Star Trek where everyone is pitching in and helping towards a common goal. Instead what was brought about was Communism in Russia when it became the popular ideal.

In the books, the throne isn't the problem. It's people and their ambitions. Actually this form of government would be easy pickings for someone like another Petyr Bealish to take over.

Edited May 24, 2019 by Calvert28

[lancerman]

42 minutes ago, KingOfTheNorth said:

Yes, you are the one who said the Wolves foreshadowed the Stark's fate. Robb and Rickon both show this to be false.

There’s always a nitpicker. 

[Daniel]

Well, there's the implication that First Men blood in general has those qualities, not as much as the Starks maybe, but still.  Bloodraven is half Blackwood, and they're a Riverlands house, but they have First Men ancestry, and he of course became the Three Eyed Crow and used a weirwood bow.

[BayRaider]

Man S1 is great, watched it all yesterday again for the first time since 2011 itself. EP5 to EP10 might be the best six episode stretch of the series. 

Season Rankings for me:

S4 - A+

S1 A+

S3 A

S2 A-

S6 B+

S7 B 

S5 B-

S8 D

I feel I enjoyed S7 more than some. At least it made sense minus the teleporting. I feel a full S7 could of been one of the better seasons. 

[Calvert28]

28 minutes ago, JonStark said:

There still would be a Night King even without Jon. Saying that the he doesn't become a strong force without Jon in the world is awfully presumptuous. 

Without Jon though, he never comes south of the wall.

[Calvert28]

1 hour ago, ramssuperbowl99 said:

Watching the finale again, Jon's parentage was important to the story. 

 

Nah. His right to the throne was basically a joke that brought about Murphy's Law in this show. Actually Jon himself was Murphy.

Edited May 24, 2019 by Calvert28

[skywlker32]

14 minutes ago, Calvert28 said:

Without Jon though, he never comes south of the wall.

? What did Jon do again that led to the NK coming south of the wall?

[BayRaider]

15 minutes ago, Calvert28 said:

Without Jon though, he never comes south of the wall.

NK’s target was always the 3ER. Yeah I think Jon irritated him a bit but had no factor in his decision. 

I don’t even know if NK even wanted to destroy all of humanity. I think the 3ER might be the real villain and wouldn’t be surprised about this in the books. We know very little about the 3ER and not enough evidence to suggest he’s good. 

[Calvert28]

Just now, skywlker32 said:

? What did Jon do again that led to the NK coming south of the wall?

Brought the dragons. No one outside of the watch believed they existed, not even the northerners it seemed at least not all of them. Had he not gone and got Dany. They would have wondered around aimlessly. They could not pass through because of the magic and they could not walk on water so there goes idea. After Jon had been revived it was perfectly set up for everything to go wrong would go wrong because of Jon.