2019 Draft Discussion

[GHARMON9]

1 hour ago, JBURGE said:

Did you just say that Gary had a similar amount of TFL in his last 2 seasons as Hunter, Chandler Jones, Cameron Jordan, and Vernon and then said his lack of production is a concern? Or were those individual season amounts for those players.

those are careers. so he contradicted himself

[Nick_gb]

19 minutes ago, Chili said:

Packersnews made some very good eye opening points regarding our new offensive blocking scheme. I have highlighted some excerpts from the article. Based on this information the outside zone scheme I think it will directly influence the direction we will take in the draft.

It seems clear that LaFleur will demand a top tier RB in order for his scheme to succeed. He already has a excellent one in Jones but injury concerns requires us to look at bringing another one in, either through the draft or free agency. Jamaal Williams lacks the shiftiness and agility required to play in a zone scheme imo. I'm not a fan of the idea of signing Devin Coleman as I thought he sucked arse last season when he toted the rock but accept that he may be someone LaFleur could target. I don't think it makes sense for us financially to target Bell even though he is exactly the right kind of player for us.

OL will be a priority in the draft. We need to make sure we get that OL right for LaFleur.

The fact that the outside zone relies on the RB running towards the TE outside leg implies far more blocking from our TE. That's a big clue. More blocking could mean that the TE importance to the scheme as a receiver is diminished but there is a way around it. Fullbacks.

With Shanahan for example he freed up Kittle by having Juszczyk take up some of the blocking responsibilities. He did this before for Owen Daniels using Leach as the blocker at Houston and with Chris Cooley using Sellers as the blocker at Washington.

McVay however took a different approach with the Rams by using his TEs to block instead and run 3 WR sets.

My gut feeling, knowing that Rodgers likes to throw the ball to wide receivers we're more likely to adopt McVay three-wide concepts. It makes little sense to remove a receiving option in favour of incorporating a full back unless the TE is an elite receiver. Is Graham still an elite receiver? that's the big question that LaFleur needs to decide. Rodgers never really made full use of the TE over his career and I suspect that will likely continue.

LaFleur did not use a FB at Tennesee so it's likely he will choose not to incorporate a FB again in favour of having an extra receiver. This means the blocking responsibilities will have to go to someone else and that is the TE. The fact he hired Outten as TE coach implies that LaFleur plan to incorporate blocking in his TEs. The signs are pointing towards an offensive scheme that blends Shanahan outside zone blocking with McVay three wide concepts and that the TE will not be a big part of the passing offence - a bit like the Falcons 2016 offense.

If that's the case then that signals two things:

1. Jimmy Graham is a poor fit. Could he be cut?  We will find out by March 15th.

2. We WILL draft a TE early. In fact it wouldn't surprise me if we double dip in the draft. I don't think we will re-sign Kendricks and Lewis. We got other Blocking-TE options in free agency whom we could target such as Stocker, James, Boyle, O'Shaughnessy.

 

If we keep Graham that could mean one of three things:

1. More two tight end sets - we will need to be very active in FA and draft for this to work.

2. We will have a fullback next season allowing Graham to act as our 3rd receiving option.

3. Make Graham our new slot receiver.

 

So to recap, it appears that RB, OL and TE will be big priorities for us in the draft/FA. I can't believe i'm saying this but it appears in the grand scheme of things WR is not the most important issue for us atm especially considering we drafted 3 WRs last year as well as Adams and Geronimo. I think we will directly replace Cobb with Geronimo.

Yes, we do need a vertical threat to draw the safety away from the box to create space underneath for Rodgers and to avoid stacked boxes against the run. Rams had Watkins last year and Cooks this year, 49ers has Goodwin so there's a clear pattern with those type of offenses. I'm sure the same is true for all types of offenses, when Nelson was injured for the season our offense went to the dumps and we didn't even have a TE to threaten the seam either. This resulted in Rodgers struggling to get both the pass and run game going. The vertical threat is absolutely critical in opening up our offense and the good news is I think we already have some guys on our roster - MVS and EstB. I know everybody wants AB or Beckham and that would be nice but I don't see either happening. Maybe we can pick up a cheap speedy WR in the 2nd or 3rd wave of FA? John Brown? Phillip Dorsett? Chris Conley?

17

When a running back sucks so much that you forget his actual name. RIP Tevin Coleman. RIP. 

[HighCalebR]

OK State RB. Justice Hill. Dion Lewis wishes he was as good. Or the Texas A&Ms Trayveon Williams. Two of my favorites for the year. 

Cheap mid-round RBs. Get the kids at RB.

[squire12]

7 minutes ago, HighCalebR said:

OK State RB. Justice Hill. Dion Lewis wishes he was as good. Or the Texas A&M guy. Two of my favorites for the year. 

Cheap mid-round RBs. Get the kids at RB.

Agreed.   Either mid round RB, or mid level UFA.

[snackattack]

I like a few of the mid round rbs, but if we can address either edge or safety at 12 or 30 (or both), i would be all jazzed up if josh jones was somehow there with our 2nd rounder. 

[PossibleCabbage]

1 hour ago, HighCalebR said:

OK State RB. Justice Hill. Dion Lewis wishes he was as good. Or the Texas A&M guy. Two of my favorites for the year. 

Cheap mid-round RBs. Get the kids at RB.

Hill's the name I have circled too.  When your QB costs full price, it doesn't matter how good an RB is if he can't pass protect... which Hill can.

[Packerraymond]

4 hours ago, Chili said:

 

It seems clear that LaFleur will demand a top tier RB in order for his scheme to succeed. He already has a excellent one in Jones but injury concerns requires us to look at bringing another one in, either through the draft or free agency. Jamaal Williams lacks the shiftiness and agility required to play in a zone scheme imo. I'm not a fan of the idea of signing Devin Coleman as I thought he sucked arse last season when he toted the rock but accept that he may be someone LaFleur could target. I don't think it makes sense for us financially to target Bell even though he is exactly the right kind of player for us.

 

A ZBS requires the opposite of a top tier RB, do you remember the Broncos under Shanahan? Here's his 1k backs.

Terrell Davis 6th rounder

Olandis Gary 4th rounder

Mike Anderson 6th rounder

Had a stud in Clinton Portis, traded him after 2 years because his system didn't need it, got Champ Bailey.

Rueben Droughns pulled from Detroit practice squad

Tatum Bell, another high pick he dealt in a year to get a top DB.

We're more than fine with Jones and Williams and a late round pick for competition. 

 

[cannondale]

Way too many positions of need, some that may need double dipping, to be thinking RB

[PossibleCabbage]

1 hour ago, cannondale said:

Way too many positions of need, some that may need double dipping, to be thinking RB

I mean, we really only have 2 RBs on the roster so unless they sign one (unlikely) odds are one of the 6 day 3 picks could be a RB. 

[Cheech]

13 hours ago, Chili said:

Jamaal Williams lacks the shiftiness and agility required to play in a zone scheme

To add to what @Packerraymond was saying: Ryan Grant was the opposite of shifty and agile.  He had great vision and was a one-cut runner.  I'm not ready to claim Williams is a great fit for the ZBS, but I do agree that if he isn't you still don't have to invest more than a day 3 pick in the position.  

[Leader]

1 hour ago, Cheech said:

To add to what @Packerraymond was saying: Ryan Grant was the opposite of shifty and agile.  He had great vision and was a one-cut runner.  I'm not ready to claim Williams is a great fit for the ZBS, but I do agree that if he isn't you still don't have to invest more than a day 3 pick in the position.  

I'm neither here nor there where we should or will draft a RB (or snag an FA) - but I am concerned that Jone's last two seasons have ended because of knee injuries. Deep at the position isnt how I would characterize our roster - cause I dont trust his knees.

[JBURGE]

RB in round 3 or 4 is just fine with me. You have to hope that EDGE and safety will be addressed by then (including FA)

[Victor1124]

On 2/25/2019 at 1:54 PM, CWood21 said:

I'll believe it when I see it.  He doesn't pop off on the tape.  He's a good athlete, but not a great athlete IMO.  Maybe I'm wrong.  But the fact that his production throughout college has been pedestrian doesn't set off a bunch of red flags?  Maybe you invest in him at 30 if he's available, but I'd venture to guess there's someone whose significantly safer and offers a significant amount of upside.

Yea, I can't understand the Gary hype at all; especially when i see some people have him ranked 4th overall on some big boards. Watching his tape, he doesn't really do much besides stalemate with the tackle and then maybe chase someone down from behind once the play goes past him. I don't see much of a bull rush or pass rush moves. I agree that he is a good athlete and not a "freak athlete".  

To me, he seems like a worse version of Nick Perry. 

[cannondale]

8 hours ago, PossibleCabbage said:

I mean, we really only have 2 RBs on the roster so unless they sign one (unlikely) odds are one of the 6 day 3 picks could be a RB. 

Could be, but we are essentially talking about a third string back. We have multiple positions where we don't even have NFL caliber starters, much less backups. Maybe if the board falls right you take a flier in Round 6 or 7, but UFA backs are plentiful and would serve the purpose just fine.

 

 

[MacReady]

I bet the draft is going to turn out wildly different from everyone's expectations.  I bet it will be a really weird draft that sees us taking a S at like 20th overall, then an OL at 30, then the best remaining pass rusher at 32 and then we have to wait for our third pick while also ending up with a first round pick next draft.