2019 NFL Draft Thread v.2

[SBXISBXVSBXVIII]

3 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

He'd go #1 overall lol 

True. But it would stop the silly debate about trading Carr for a 5' 9" QB.

[SilverNBlackFan]

1 hour ago, SBXISBXVSBXVIII said:

True. But it would stop the silly debate about trading Carr for a 5' 9" QB.

If Gruden is a 100 million coach, he should be able to take a talent like Kyler Murray and make it work. The guy easily has the most upside out of any QB.

Patrick Mahomes was the furthest thing from being Pro-Ready. Played in a super gimmicky O, never took snaps under center,  footwork was a disaster but the raw talent was there. Andy Reid took him, sat him and refined his skills like a true premier coach should do and made him into a player. Not saying Murray is as talented as Mahomes, but the clay is definitely there to molded.

 

[drfrey13]

1 hour ago, Frankie2Gunz said:

1 QB in NFL history had more TD's passes in their first 2 season than Carr.  His name is Dan Marino.  His first 3 season are amongst the greatest in NFL history and you want to trade him, sign Taylor and draft a unproven 5'9 QB who is also going to play baseball LOL  What more needs to be said than this and the lunacy that it speaks.....

All of the QB's you have mentioned have never been in MVP consideration as Carr was before he broke his leg and that was with an average supporting cast. 

I would also say Carr elevated Crabs career.  He averaged over 8 TD's per year with us and 4 with the 49ers.  Cook had his best statical season to date with us last year.   

You do realize that Carr has played with a franchise that has been terrible since he has taken over as the starter.  Bad draft picks, terrible FA signings, constant coaching and coordinator turnover and you want to point the finger at Carr and claim he needs to go.  Very low brow mentality.  

And Cooper is one of the top WRs when targeted.  I am not sure about his all time rankings but I know his first 2 years where pretty high up there for WRs.  Then Carr stops looking his way. We all saw it and tried to figure it out.

[SBXISBXVSBXVIII]

3 minutes ago, SilverNBlackFan said:

If Gruden is a 100 million coach, he should be able to take a talent like Kyler Murray and make it work. The guy easily has the most upside out of any QB.

Patrick Mahomes was the furthest thing from being Pro-Ready. Played in a super gimmicky O, never took snaps under center,  footwork was a disaster but the raw talent was there. Andy Reid took him, sat him and refined his skills like a true premier coach should do and made him into a player. Not saying Murray is as talented as Mahomes, but the clay is definitely there to molded.

 

We don't have a coach like Andy Reid who could mold him.

[drfrey13]

5 minutes ago, SilverNBlackFan said:

If Gruden is a 100 million coach, he should be able to take a talent like Kyler Murray and make it work. The guy easily has the most upside out of any QB.

Patrick Mahomes was the furthest thing from being Pro-Ready. Played in a super gimmicky O, never took snaps under center,  footwork was a disaster but the raw talent was there. Andy Reid took him, sat him and refined his skills like a true premier coach should do and made him into a player. Not saying Murray is as talented as Mahomes, but the clay is definitely there to molded.

 

Mahomes has had such a good year because he has the arm strength and accuracy to still make throws when his footwork and body position are horrible.  He is one small shoulder injury away from being average.  If it happens then you will have to see how well he knows how to play the game.  I like watching him play but Reid has done very little to correct him.  What Reid has done is taken his style of play and made an amazing offense around him.  Does not hurt that he has 2 unstoppable weapons.  Also with that passing attack you could plug and play any back up RB in the league and they will be very successful.  Watching an interview where Mahomes said he learned how to throw by playing shortstop.  He does look like a SS out there playing QB and that is why he is so fun to watch.  SS are easily the most entertaining baseball players to watch when they are elite.

[Bitty 2.0]

12 minutes ago, SilverNBlackFan said:

If Gruden is a 100 million coach, he should be able to take a talent like Kyler Murray and make it work. The guy easily has the most upside out of any QB.

Patrick Mahomes was the furthest thing from being Pro-Ready. Played in a super gimmicky O, never took snaps under center,  footwork was a disaster but the raw talent was there. Andy Reid took him, sat him and refined his skills like a true premier coach should do and made him into a player. Not saying Murray is as talented as Mahomes, but the clay is definitely there to molded.

 

 Kansas City is the stack team, Alex Smith was a pro bowler with them. 

 Do you follow football? Mahomes footwork is still a mess, he jumps when he throw the ball.

 It’s a lot easier when your All-Pro WR and TE are wide open down the field makeing Circus catches for you.

[Frankie2Gunz]

1 hour ago, drfrey13 said:

Mahomes has had such a good year because he has the arm strength and accuracy to still make throws when his footwork and body position are horrible.  He is one small shoulder injury away from being average.  If it happens then you will have to see how well he knows how to play the game.  I like watching him play but Reid has done very little to correct him.  What Reid has done is taken his style of play and made an amazing offense around him.  Does not hurt that he has 2 unstoppable weapons.  Also with that passing attack you could plug and play any back up RB in the league and they will be very successful.  Watching an interview where Mahomes said he learned how to throw by playing shortstop.  He does look like a SS out there playing QB and that is why he is so fun to watch.  SS are easily the most entertaining baseball players to watch when they are elite.

You need to stop being logical to people who clearly are illogical.  They just don't get it and never will.  They want to potentially set this franchise back a decade for some unproven, 5'9 shiny new toy that may or may not be good.  These clowns always want whatever player has a few good games in college, look at a few mock drafts and all of a sudden think they're talent evaluators.  Their lack the ability to think about the ramifications the franchise will endure if their "pro scouting" abilities are wrong is an absolute joke. 

I'm sure most of these homers were arguing that Kap was a franchise QB after 2 good years with the 9ers.  I actually bet someone who would have a better career, Kap or Luck.  He was pulling out stats and showing me film about how Kap was clearly a better QB.  Ummmmm Let's just say I won that bet.  

In the middle of the college season there was some homer on here clamoring about how we should trade Carr and draft Tua the QB from Bama.  I just sat back and laughed but there were multiple people on here who agreed with him.  I really wish I would pull up the thread and find out who was spewing that garbage.

Your assessment on Mahomes is accurate.  The issue with a player like Mahomes is that the minute his arm strength diminishes, he loses a step, loses his agility or loses all of the fantastic weapons he has we will see what kind of QB he really is.  The window of being elite for a QB like Mahomes is far less than a true pocket passer. 

It's really sexy when he's 21, has never had a serious injury that affects his playing style but I will say that he better adapt and change the way he plays as he gets older or it won't be pretty.   

[Frankie2Gunz]

1 hour ago, SilverNBlackFan said:

If Gruden is a 100 million coach, he should be able to take a talent like Kyler Murray and make it work. The guy easily has the most upside out of any QB.

Patrick Mahomes was the furthest thing from being Pro-Ready. Played in a super gimmicky O, never took snaps under center,  footwork was a disaster but the raw talent was there. Andy Reid took him, sat him and refined his skills like a true premier coach should do and made him into a player. Not saying Murray is as talented as Mahomes, but the clay is definitely there to molded.

 

Let me ask you this question.  If you were starting a franchise from scratch and had to compile a list of QB's to build your franchise around who would you put ahead of Carr?  

The fact that you want to trade him, sign Taylor LOL and waste the 4th overall pick on an unproven 5'9 QB clearly means that you would put Carr in the bottom 10 in terms of franchise building block QB's.  

[Rich7sena]

2 hours ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

 Kansas City is the stack team, Alex Smith was a pro bowler with them. 

 Do you follow football? Mahomes footwork is still a mess, he jumps when he throw the ball.

 It’s a lot easier when your All-Pro WR and TE are wide open down the field makeing Circus catches for you.

I think Mahomes more shows that not every QB has to look the same to be successful in the NFL. Mahomes, much like Rodgers, is simply a natural--not a whole lot of guys like him throwing the football.

Honestly, I don't know how much better or even if he'd be any better if his footwork and delivery looked like Brady.

[OldManWillis]

I think alot of people forgot how hard it is to find an above average QB much less elite. How long did it take us to find Carr after Gannon retired. 

Carr is not untouchable, but use him as a stopgap if we draft a QB. Don't get rid of him unless a young QB shows they can take the reins.

Until that point build the offensive talent around him. Best case scenario- Carr rises his play and becomes the franchise QB we thought we had. Worst case- we have the offensive talent to support a drafted qb.

 

[Frankie2Gunz]

6 minutes ago, Rich7sena said:

I think Mahomes more shows that not every QB has to look the same to be successful in the NFL. Mahomes, much like Rodgers, is simply a natural--not a whole lot of guys like him throwing the football.

With the way Mahomes plays can you see him playing until he's 40 unless he drastically changes his style of play?  He's fun to watch when he's 21 but as we all know age is not kind especially with the beating NFL players take.  He has an all world arm, there is no questioning that but take away his mobility, allusiveness and all world weapons and what kind of QB do you have? 

Is the kid as bright as Manning or Brees or someone who will be able to adjust after his physical skills break down?

[Rich7sena]

Changing the subject: I watched Josh Jacobs after Daniel Jeremiah had him going top 5 and I've got to say that's around where I'd have him going, too. My comp for him is Ezekiel Elliot. In fact, I would be mad if the Raiders took him at 4--he's definitely on my list.

[Bitty 2.0]

9 minutes ago, Rich7sena said:

I think Mahomes more shows that not every QB has to look the same to be successful in the NFL. Mahomes, much like Rodgers, is simply a natural--not a whole lot of guys like him throwing the football.

the Point is Alex Smith had 4,000 +  yards last year.  Let that sink in a ball control QB had 4000+ yards .

 Andy Reid has a history of making average QBs look great  so now he has a legit good QB he’s looking like the world’s best.

[Rich7sena]

1 minute ago, Frankie2Gunz said:

With the way Mahomes plays can you see him playing until he's 40 unless he drastically changes his style of play?  He's fun to watch when he's 21 but as we all know age is not kind especially with the beating NFL players take.  He has an all world arm, there is no questioning that but take away his mobility, allusiveness and all world weapons and what kind of QB do you have? 

Is the kid as bright as Manning or Brees or someone who will be able to adjust after his physical skills break down?

Mahomes doesn't really run enough for me to worry about his play style.

To answer your second question: you're literally asking about a different player than Mahomes is. Are you asking what kind of player he'll become in 20 years? If so; lol why? And Mahomes is more than just arm strength and mobility. In fact, I'd say he's more arm strength and accuracy, which tends to age pretty well.

To answer your last question: why wouldn't he be?

[Rich7sena]

2 minutes ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

the Point is Alex Smith had 4,000 +  yards last year.  Let that sink in a ball control QB had 4000+ yards .

 Andy Reid has a history of making average QBs look great  so now he has a legit good QB he’s looking like the world’s best.

True. Andy Reid is a create coach, schemer, and very good play caller. I would be hesitant to take anything away from Mahomes, though. It's clear to me after watching him play that he's an all-time talent.