ovfd55 Posted April 8, 2020 Share Posted April 8, 2020 3 minutes ago, e16bball said: Much tougher to get pressure from the 4-man front we’ll have, as compared to the 5-man front we were working with last year. Just by sheer math, you’re forcing OLs into a lot of pre-snap single assignments. With a 4-man front, they’ve got a better bead on who’s coming and who probably isn’t, and they’ve got a little more ability to react to blitzers and pass guys off. In other words, I think the defense we’re transitioning to will require more talent up front (particularly on the edges) to get to that same level of pass-rush pressure. I don’t think we’re getting home with a lot of pressure from the Chris Odoms and Nate Orchards of the world in this alignment. We’ll need guys who can beat OTs one-on-one from a 3-point stance, and we’ll need guys who can still be productive or impactful if they’re getting sent fairly frequent double teams. This new scheme will be substantially better against backs and TEs and slot receivers, because we’re essentially replacing an Allen/Payne/Ioannidis with a Thomas Davis or a KPL. But I think our ability to get scheme/pure numbers pressure will be diminished. From a roster standpoint, I think the plan to take Young works well until you hit one big stumbling block — the insistence on keeping Ryan Kerrigan. You could turn an aging backup at a stacked position into future cap space (via rollover) and a draft pick that we could use on a TE or WR or RT prospect that could be part of this team for years to come. in other words, diversify a little. Maybe no one wants to trade anything for him, in which case I’d get it. But I find it a little hard to believe that no 3-4 team is looking for an accomplished second pass-rusher who they could probably immediately sign to a more favorable contract extension. I would of =[ traded Kerrigan as well but don't think its the worse thing in world to keep him as you can have a front 4 of Allen Settle Payne Kerrigan in some run spots,then bring back in fresh Young Iaonadiss and Sweat to rush on Passing downs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted April 8, 2020 Share Posted April 8, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, e16bball said: Much tougher to get pressure from the 4-man front we’ll have, as compared to the 5-man front we were working with last year. Just by sheer math, you’re forcing OLs into a lot of pre-snap single assignments. With a 4-man front, they’ve got a better bead on who’s coming and who probably isn’t, and they’ve got a little more ability to react to blitzers and pass guys off. In other words, I think the defense we’re transitioning to will require more talent up front (particularly on the edges) to get to that same level of pass-rush pressure. I don’t think we’re getting home with a lot of pressure from the Chris Odoms and Nate Orchards of the world in this alignment. We’ll need guys who can beat OTs one-on-one from a 3-point stance, and we’ll need guys who can still be productive or impactful if they’re getting sent fairly frequent double teams. This new scheme will be substantially better against backs and TEs and slot receivers, because we’re essentially replacing an Allen/Payne/Ioannidis with a Thomas Davis or a KPL. But I think our ability to get scheme/pure numbers pressure will be diminished. From a roster standpoint, I think the plan to take Young works well until you hit one big stumbling block — the insistence on keeping Ryan Kerrigan. You could turn an aging backup at a stacked position into future cap space (via rollover) and a draft pick that we could use on a TE or WR or RT prospect that could be part of this team for years to come. in other words, diversify a little. Maybe no one wants to trade anything for him, in which case I’d get it. But I find it a little hard to believe that no 3-4 team is looking for an accomplished second pass-rusher who they could probably immediately sign to a more favorable contract extension. Definitely, I get why they want to keep Kerrigan - having a guy spend his whole career in DC is cool - but Kerrigan, Norman and of course TWill should’ve been traded to playoff contenders last year. We could be sitting on an extra 2nd, extra 3rd or 4th and an extra late round pick if that had happened. I know for sure the Ravens could’ve used Kerrigan and the Texans both who had lost their best pass rushers via FA/trade last offseason. And, the Browns & Pats wanted Trent in August or Sept but Brice wouldn't trade him. The fact that the Bills signed Norman not too long free we cut him tells me we could dump him for a late-round pick last year and Norman would have helped the Bills in their playoff game vs Houston. Edited April 8, 2020 by turtle28 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ripsean21 Posted April 8, 2020 Share Posted April 8, 2020 27 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Definitely, I get why they want to keep Kerrigan - having a guy spend his whole career in DC is cool - but Kerrigan, Norman and o& course TWill should’ve been traded to playoff contenders last year. We could be sitting on an extra 2nd, extra 3rd or 4th and a late round pick if that had happened. I know for sure the Ravens could’ve used Kerrigan and the Texans both who had lost their best pass rushers via FA/trade last offseason. I wouldn’t have traded Ryan but the others yes I would have traded as you said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 If Trent Dilfer isn't Tua's agent he should definitely hire him. Geez. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 This was posted in another thread. I like it for this situation. 12 hours ago, AkronsWitness said: 2014 Draft. The Browns traded with the Bills out of the #4 spot. They had shots and passed on Kahlil Mack, Mike Evans, OBJ and Aaron Donald in favor of Justin Gilbert. 2011 Draft. The Browns traded with Falcons out of the #6 spot. They passed on Julio Jones in favor of Phil Taylor. This is why I have PTSD whenever somebody mentions "The smart thing to do would be to trade down and add that other guy plus get another 2nd rounder" 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, MikeT14 said: This was posted in another thread. I like it for this situation. 2017 with Wentz on the board as well. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 On 4/8/2020 at 3:04 PM, ripsean21 said: I wouldn’t have traded Ryan but the others yes I would have traded as you said I don't know why. I love Kerrigan but his best days are behind him. Also, we’ve been rebuilding and should’ve been even sooner last year after we knew Alex wasn't going go play. Trading Kerrigan made sense for our future and for the end of his career where he could have played his last two years of this contract - maybe more if he doesn't retire after this year and if he had went to a contender like Chris Long had done. If Kerrigan doesn't retire and plays another year or two and I was him, I'd go to a contender on a cheap contract to be a situational pass rusher and to try and get a ring. I wouldn't even re-sign here if I was him bc at best - if everyone we have develops well - we won't be a contender for 3 more years. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 1 hour ago, MikeT14 said: This was posted in another thread. I like it for this situation. They also traded down w/ the Eagles and passed on Carson Wentz. I always say they could've had Carson Wentz throwing to Julio if Julio had stayed in Cleveland which was kind of unlikely given until Dorsey got there they were doing a horrible job of building a roster all decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTTRDynasty Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 More at link. https://www.espn.com/nfl/draft2020/story/_/id/29007542/why-chase-young-nfl-draft-most-dominant-defender When searching for comparisons, the names Myles Garrett and Shawne Merriman come up, but one coach had to go beyond the football field -- beyond the human species, in fact -- to find an apt analogy. "Gosh, everything we try to do, he seems to defeat us," Indiana coach Tom Allen said. "It's like in an action movie. You have a plan to take care of this thing you can't destroy, you think you have him, and then, boom, he comes right through the flames." To get a sense of exactly what it was like to prepare to play Young and then to have to line up in front of him, we spoke to coaches and players who had to do just that during the 2019 season. They provide the clearest explanation yet of exactly what the NFL should expect. Former Indiana offensive coordinator Kalen DeBoer: You could just tell he was physically blessed. He's dominant because he's worked hard on making himself a better football player, but 6-6 and 260, 270, that type of stature, complemented by the speed off the edge, is just so impressive. Northwestern offensive line coach Kurt Anderson: He's got all the tools of an edge rusher that make you have to game plan a little bit for him, because he can change the course of a game with one strip sack, a critical third-down type of deal that makes the quarterback move and throws the timing off of deep routes. I've been fortunate that I've been able to coach in the NFL and see some of these elite edge rushers. Coached in the SEC against Myles Garrett. He reminded me of somebody like that. Wisconsin offensive coordinator Joe Rudolph: The biggest thing was early in the week, like Day 1, I got to teaching them how quickly this is going to happen up the field. If you're not exposed to that, then the first thing you do is if you get beat or pressured or insecure about it, you start to change up what you do fundamentally. We did all we could, man. We lined guys up offsides all week in practice, and we have fast guys, but just put them in that position. Former Michigan State offensive coordinator Brad Salem: The other issues in passing down, third down, your protection has to slide to him, or your back has to help and chip. Then there's certain things you can't do, like your back getting out, certain protections and certain directions, so it limits what you do. Former Penn State offensive line coach Matt Limegrover: We were going to try to chip him with our tight ends or check him with our back as much as we could. One thing about Ohio State's defensive coaches is they're not dummies. They know people are going to have a plan for them. You try to start moving guys around and then they move him around and you're trying to adjust your protection. Allen: Any time you have a guy like that, who is so disruptive, he can basically single-handedly destroy your pass game, he can disrupt your run game. There are only a few of those guys where you say we need to know where he is at all times and if you leave him one-on-one with a guy, it's over. Ferguson: When I watch film, I like to watch the third quarter or early fourth. You really start to see how guys play, because you're tired and that's when your tendencies come out. What I saw on tape, straight through he was quick-twitch and still going. His best move was a double swipe, so I tried to hand-fight him and not give him my hands or commit to one move. Cincinnati head coach Luke Fickell: Going into the game, you know you have to do so much. It might be simple things, like we've got to make sure we slide more to this side. We've got to make sure we've got the ability to chip with the back. We're not going to be like some others and say, "We're not going to take our chances and put this guy in a situation." Rudolph: As simple as it was, the most unique part of him was how quickly he got up the field. When you watch him and you see his first step and you see how much ground he covers on his first step, he does a great job of working on timing the snap count and using all the information he can pre-snap to be as quick as he can off the ball. Allen: We can't hold the ball too long, we have to chip him with our back, we have to slide to him, we have to double-team him with our tight end or whatever you need to do. All those things sound good, but that takes away from other things we like to do, so he was a nightmare. Ferguson: He doesn't show much emotion. Even my running back, Mike Warren, he was talking to him the whole game and all Chase did was give him a little smirk. He's a hell of a football player. He's going to make some NFL team happy. Higby: I noticed he has one move he has perfected. As a tackle, you have to be perfect in your technique to even have a chance, and if you don't, he's going to beat you every time. It's like a double hand swipe, he has the steps down, the hands down, he has everything about it perfect, so it works really well for him. Allen: We all figured he was going to declare, but when he did, we threw a little party. I hope they don't have any more like him coming, because woo! Austin: I'm so glad his *** left early. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 21 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said: Austin: I'm so glad his *** left early. Best quote of them all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naptownskinsfan Posted April 10, 2020 Share Posted April 10, 2020 5 hours ago, MikeT14 said: This was posted in another thread. I like it for this situation. We all know that we won't hit on the second round pick as well. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted April 10, 2020 Author Share Posted April 10, 2020 31 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said: We all know that we won't hit on the second round pick as well. To be fair, the best second round pick we’ve made in a decade is pretty damn good. He just so happens to be on the Packers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naptownskinsfan Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 21 minutes ago, lavar703 said: To be fair, the best second round pick we’ve made in a decade is pretty damn good. He just so happens to be on the Packers. Which goes to show you that good coaching gets a lot out of players. Even when we've had good coaching, backdoor politicking has ruined that. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted April 11, 2020 Share Posted April 11, 2020 (edited) 18 sacks in 26 games started the last 3 years a different former DL player is not bad. And, switching to LOLB does wonders for the stat sheet, even if you’re playing in the same scheme! Edited April 11, 2020 by turtle28 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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