How bad are the Miami Dolphins?

[hornbybrown]

1 hour ago, Bolts223 said:

So revisiting this:

- Dolphins are now 0-4 with a -137 PD differential.

- They've lost each game by at least 20. Three of which at home.

- That being said, all 4 opponents they have faced were playoff teams last year and all are at least in contention to make it again this season.

 

Do we think this team is still on pace to go 0-16 and be remembered as possibly the WOAT team?

I think they dumb luck there way into a win but they are the worst team I have ever seen. This is coming from a expert on bad football being a browns fan 

[Awsi Dooger]

On 9/19/2019 at 8:01 PM, SkippyX said:

That 14-0 team was not one of the best 25 NFL teams. 

Their schedule was pathetic

• 1-13 Oilers
• 3-11 Patriots
• 3-11 Patriots
• 4-9-1 Bills
• 4-9-1 Bills
• 4-9-1 Chargers
• 4-9-1 Cardinals
• 5-9 Colts
• 5-9 Colts
• 7-7 Jets
• 7-7 Jets
• 7-7 Vikings
• 8-6 Giants
• 8-6 Chiefs

That's a strength of schedule of 70-122-4  (.367) 

• 70-108-4 not counting playing the Dolphins (.396)

Sure they won some close games against good playoff competition but that 14-0 regular is the most overrated anything in Sports.

• They outscored their playoff opponents 55-38

The Steelers lost 3 games that year because they split with the 8-6 Bengals, they split with the 10-4 Browns, and they lost to the 10-4 Cowboys.

• they also beat the 10-3-1 Raiders
• The Steelers were .500 vs 10 win teams just like the Dolphins  (0-0)

The Dolphins deserved the 1972 Season Lombardi Trophy, to be the answer of a trivia question, and little else.

Congratulations. You are another simpleton backfitting moron who has no idea what he is talking about. Classic case of no situational awareness at all. But very typical. I've seen this stupidity recited on one forum after another from numbers nitwits. There is nothing more pathetic in sports than the new obsession with strength of schedule. It is butchered in real time terms far more often than not. 

Prior to that 1972 season the Dolphins were considered to have one of the toughest schedules in football. It was an ongoing theme on all the preview magazines and televised programs. The opener was at Kansas City in not only an instant revenge game for the Chiefs after the famous Christmas Day 1971 double overtime playoff loss to Miami, but also as the Chiefs opened a new ultra hyped stadium.

Consequently the Dolphins were 4 point underdogs in that opening game. On all the talk shows during the preseason and before opening week, Kansas City was a consensus pick. Many analysts were picking the Chiefs by wide margin. After all, the Dolphins had been trounced by Dallas 24-3 in the last meaningful game they played, the 1971 season Super Bowl. Then as now, these was desperation to disbelieve in the upstart Dolphins. That's why almost every public analyst was heavy on Kansas City's chances. The Chiefs were actually a popular pick to regain the Super Bowl title. It was an ultra talented team with numerous eventual Hall of Famers.

I always get a kick out of all the numbskulls who place that Chiefs game on the "easy" list, with zero comprehension of how it played out at the time.

Miami controlled the game from start to finish. The final score of 20-10 was not as lopsided as the game itself. Kansas City scored its only touchdown as time expired.

Two weeks later the Dolphins were also a 4 point underdog at Minnesota. That was a highly anticipated game because beloved Fran Tarkenton was returning to the Vikings after 5 seasons with the Giants. Consequently every Minnesota home game became an energized tribute to Tarkenton. The Vikings were desperate for a home victory because they had narrowly dropped their home opener to an excellent Redskins team, the same team the Dolphins would eventually face in the Super Bowl.

That Vikings game was the one game Miami should have lost. No question about it. Minnesota out hit the Dolphins all game long. Larry Csonka was nearly broken in half by Wally Hilgenberg. Only some timely turnovers kept Miami in the game. Then Garo Yepremian somehow connected on a 51 yard field goal in the middle of the 4th quarter. Everyone was shocked. That type of kick was seldom made in those days, especially outdoors at multipurpose Metropolitan Stadium. The score was 14-6 prior to that kick. No 2-point conversion in that era. Very basic: If Garo misses that kick there is no Perfect Season. It ends tamely at 2-1. I always get a howl out of people who condemn Garo for the Super Bowl gaffe, with not one fleck on knowledge that the 1972 Dolphins never earn the legendary status minus Garo's clutch kick at Minnesota.

That kick energized the Dolphins. After being stymied all day, Griese drove Miami methodically down the field for a winning late touchdown pass to Jim Mandich...16-14.

Now, imagine this toward 2019. Let's say one of the current 2019 teams is 3-0 after 3 games, and 2 of the victories were road games as 4 point road underdog against quarterbacks who were obviously on the way to the Hall of Fame. And yet at the end of the season you have some genius proclaiming that it was one of the easiest schedules of all time.

That genius would be laughed out of the room. He'd be an instant fool. Everyone would remember the situational realities of 3 months earlier, when those games were considered likely defeats.

But none of that is present with SSS, the Strength of Schedule Simpletons. They can make the world anything they want it to be. They are comically clueless toward place and time. For example, entering 1972 the Baltimore Colts were a long term dynasty, winner of the 1970 season Super Bowl and AFC Championship Game participants in 1971. There was no expectation or logic that they would fall apart in 1972. The first meeting between the two teams was first half of the season. Baltimore was struggling but nobody took that game for granted, given the long term class of the organization. Miami was a very small road favorite. There was tons of talk that the Colts would try to rescue their season by upsetting the Dolphins. Keep in mind there was still tremendous animosity and tension regarding Shula leaving the Colts prior to the 1970 season to take the Miami job. Baltimore saved its best efforts for those home game revenge outings against Shula. Miami was outscored 49-3 by the Colts in the two games at Baltimore among 1970 and 1971. 

Then in 1972 the Colts were indeed extremely active and motivated early in the game. It was Baltimore's largest home crowd of the season. The crowd was so loud the announcers said they could barely heard each other in the booth. Yet Miami methodically churned out a 23-0 win.

I could keep going and going. The 1972 Miami Dolphins were the first team in NFL history to defeat 5 eventual Hall of Fame quarterbacks. And they did it at all stages of those quarterback careers -- Dawson and Unitas near the end, Tarkenton and Namath near the middle, and Bradshaw near the beginning.

Three of those victories against Hall of Fame quarterbacks were on the road. 

I stopped short of saying Miami 1972 remains the only team in NFL history to win 5 games against different NFL Hall of Fame quarterbacks. That was true for a long time but I haven't seen it publicized recently. It is possible it has been matched or exceeded, even though I think I would have heard about it. 

Obviously a key variable is that the Dolphins went unbeaten with a 39 year old rickety backup quarterback directing most of the games. Age 39 at that point was closer to 45 today. Morrall's frame certainly didn't remind me of Brady or Brees, let's put it that way. 

The 1973 Dolphins team had a healthy Griese all season. But he was rusty and had an awful season. The 6.6 YPA was by far Griese's lowest for any full season after Shula arrived. There was so much local concern regarding the passing game that it was a huge topic late in the season, until a breakthrough 4 touchdown game in the regular season finale hosting Detroit. 

It is laughable to claim 1973 as superior. That 1973 team faced a similar early season road challenge as the 2 games from 1972. Instead of underdogs in week 2 at Oakland, the 1973 Dolphins were favored. But they lost the game and were handled most of the way. It ended up 12-7 but never seemed that close. Miami trailed 12-0 in the 4th quarter before a touchdown pass from Griese to Mandich. 

Late that season the Dolphins traveled to face a miserable Colts team. This time the Dolphins were a double digit road favorite, completely unlike 1972 when it was tiny favoritism. But 1973 Miami sleepwalked throughout the entire game. Never threatened at all. Granted, Griese did not play. But he didn't play at Baltimore in 1972 either. Morrall played again and the crowd was every bit as active as the 1972 home game, but since 1973 Miami had a vulnerability that 1972 Miami lacked, the Colts trampled the Dolphins 16-3.

As someone who witnessed all those games and remembers virtually every detail, it cracks me up every time the 1973 Dolphins are asserted as superior. Yeah, the team that got taken apart by a 2-10 Colts team. Yep, that's the Dolphins team I want to hang my mantle on. 

It makes perfect sense to Strength of Schedule Simpletons. That's the hilarious aspect. They never have the slightest clue. But as long as they have a record book and a gullible public loaded with fellow simpletons, any butchering is readily available. 

Edited September 30, 2019 by Awsi Dooger

[Bolts223]

18 hours ago, hornbybrown said:

I think they dumb luck there way into a win but they are the worst team I have ever seen. This is coming from a expert on bad football being a browns fan 

Well I already feel comfortable saying that they are worse than the Browns team that went 0-16. That team was actually in a lot of games, it just took some unbelievable bad luck and Hue Jackson ineptitude to lose all those close games.

[DawgX]

24 minutes ago, Bolts223 said:

Well I already feel comfortable saying that they are worse than the Browns team that went 0-16. That team was actually in a lot of games, it just took some unbelievable bad luck and Hue Jackson ineptitude to lose all those close games.

And DeShone Kizer being arguably the dumbest QB I've ever seen.

[AlexGreen#20]

18 hours ago, Awsi Dooger said:

Congratulations. You are another simpleton backfitting moron who has no idea what he is talking about. Classic case of no situational awareness at all. But very typical. I've seen this stupidity recited on one forum after another from numbers nitwits. There is nothing more pathetic in sports than the new obsession with strength of schedule. It is butchered in real time terms far more often than not. 

Prior to that 1972 season the Dolphins were considered to have one of the toughest schedules in football. It was an ongoing theme on all the preview magazines and televised programs. The opener was at Kansas City in not only an instant revenge game for the Chiefs after the famous Christmas Day 1971 double overtime playoff loss to Miami, but also as the Chiefs opened a new ultra hyped stadium.

Consequently the Dolphins were 4 point underdogs in that opening game. On all the talk shows during the preseason and before opening week, Kansas City was a consensus pick. Many analysts were picking the Chiefs by wide margin. After all, the Dolphins had been trounced by Dallas 24-3 in the last meaningful game they played, the 1971 season Super Bowl. Then as now, these was desperation to disbelieve in the upstart Dolphins. That's why almost every public analyst was heavy on Kansas City's chances. The Chiefs were actually a popular pick to regain the Super Bowl title. It was an ultra talented team with numerous eventual Hall of Famers.

I always get a kick out of all the numbskulls who place that Chiefs game on the "easy" list, with zero comprehension of how it played out at the time.

Miami controlled the game from start to finish. The final score of 20-10 was not as lopsided as the game itself. Kansas City scored its only touchdown as time expired.

Two weeks later the Dolphins were also a 4 point underdog at Minnesota. That was a highly anticipated game because beloved Fran Tarkenton was returning to the Vikings after 5 seasons with the Giants. Consequently every Minnesota home game became an energized tribute to Tarkenton. The Vikings were desperate for a home victory because they had narrowly dropped their home opener to an excellent Redskins team, the same team the Dolphins would eventually face in the Super Bowl.

That Vikings game was the one game Miami should have lost. No question about it. Minnesota out hit the Dolphins all game long. Larry Csonka was nearly broken in half by Wally Hilgenberg. Only some timely turnovers kept Miami in the game. Then Garo Yepremian somehow connected on a 51 yard field goal in the middle of the 4th quarter. Everyone was shocked. That type of kick was seldom made in those days, especially outdoors at multipurpose Metropolitan Stadium. The score was 14-6 prior to that kick. No 2-point conversion in that era. Very basic: If Garo misses that kick there is no Perfect Season. It ends tamely at 2-1. I always get a howl out of people who condemn Garo for the Super Bowl gaffe, with not one fleck on knowledge that the 1972 Dolphins never earn the legendary status minus Garo's clutch kick at Minnesota.

That kick energized the Dolphins. After being stymied all day, Griese drove Miami methodically down the field for a winning late touchdown pass to Jim Mandich...16-14.

Now, imagine this toward 2019. Let's say one of the current 2019 teams is 3-0 after 3 games, and 2 of the victories were road games as 4 point road underdog against quarterbacks who were obviously on the way to the Hall of Fame. And yet at the end of the season you have some genius proclaiming that it was one of the easiest schedules of all time.

That genius would be laughed out of the room. He'd be an instant fool. Everyone would remember the situational realities of 3 months earlier, when those games were considered likely defeats.

But none of that is present with SSS, the Strength of Schedule Simpletons. They can make the world anything they want it to be. They are comically clueless toward place and time. For example, entering 1972 the Baltimore Colts were a long term dynasty, winner of the 1970 season Super Bowl and AFC Championship Game participants in 1971. There was no expectation or logic that they would fall apart in 1972. The first meeting between the two teams was first half of the season. Baltimore was struggling but nobody took that game for granted, given the long term class of the organization. Miami was a very small road favorite. There was tons of talk that the Colts would try to rescue their season by upsetting the Dolphins. Keep in mind there was still tremendous animosity and tension regarding Shula leaving the Colts prior to the 1970 season to take the Miami job. Baltimore saved its best efforts for those home game revenge outings against Shula. Miami was outscored 49-3 by the Colts in the two games at Baltimore among 1970 and 1971. 

Then in 1972 the Colts were indeed extremely active and motivated early in the game. It was Baltimore's largest home crowd of the season. The crowd was so loud the announcers said they could barely heard each other in the booth. Yet Miami methodically churned out a 23-0 win.

I could keep going and going. The 1972 Miami Dolphins were the first team in NFL history to defeat 5 eventual Hall of Fame quarterbacks. And they did it at all stages of those quarterback careers -- Dawson and Unitas near the end, Tarkenton and Namath near the middle, and Bradshaw near the beginning.

Three of those victories against Hall of Fame quarterbacks were on the road. 

I stopped short of saying Miami 1972 remains the only team in NFL history to win 5 games against different NFL Hall of Fame quarterbacks. That was true for a long time but I haven't seen it publicized recently. It is possible it has been matched or exceeded, even though I think I would have heard about it. 

Obviously a key variable is that the Dolphins went unbeaten with a 39 year old rickety backup quarterback directing most of the games. Age 39 at that point was closer to 45 today. Morrall's frame certainly didn't remind me of Brady or Brees, let's put it that way. 

The 1973 Dolphins team had a healthy Griese all season. But he was rusty and had an awful season. The 6.6 YPA was by far Griese's lowest for any full season after Shula arrived. There was so much local concern regarding the passing game that it was a huge topic late in the season, until a breakthrough 4 touchdown game in the regular season finale hosting Detroit. 

It is laughable to claim 1973 as superior. That 1973 team faced a similar early season road challenge as the 2 games from 1972. Instead of underdogs in week 2 at Oakland, the 1973 Dolphins were favored. But they lost the game and were handled most of the way. It ended up 12-7 but never seemed that close. Miami trailed 12-0 in the 4th quarter before a touchdown pass from Griese to Mandich. 

Late that season the Dolphins traveled to face a miserable Colts team. This time the Dolphins were a double digit road favorite, completely unlike 1972 when it was tiny favoritism. But 1973 Miami sleepwalked throughout the entire game. Never threatened at all. Granted, Griese did not play. But he didn't play at Baltimore in 1972 either. Morrall played again and the crowd was every bit as active as the 1972 home game, but since 1973 Miami had a vulnerability that 1972 Miami lacked, the Colts trampled the Dolphins 16-3.

As someone who witnessed all those games and remembers virtually every detail, it cracks me up every time the 1973 Dolphins are asserted as superior. Yeah, the team that got taken apart by a 2-10 Colts team. Yep, that's the Dolphins team I want to hang my mantle on. 

It makes perfect sense to Strength of Schedule Simpletons. That's the hilarious aspect. They never have the slightest clue. But as long as they have a record book and a gullible public loaded with fellow simpletons, any butchering is readily available. 

If these teams were so good, why didn't they win any games?

The idea that the Dolphins played a murderer's row of teams is absurd. If the teams they played were so good, why didn't any of them make the playoffs???

[BayRaider]

6 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

If these teams were so good, why didn't they win any games?

The idea that the Dolphins played a murderer's row of teams is absurd. If the teams they played were so good, why didn't any of them make the playoffs???

That dude has to be a member of the ‘72 Dolphins. He is WAY too upset about it. 

And the SoS argument is accurate... at the end of the day if those teams were good they would of won more games that season. He is trying to say their schedule was tough before the season started, when in reality, you can’t fully judge how good or bad teams are until the season transpires. 

[Bolts223]

23 minutes ago, BayRaider said:

That dude has to be a member of the ‘72 Dolphins. He is WAY too upset about it. 

And the SoS argument is accurate... at the end of the day if those teams were good they would of won more games that season. He is trying to say their schedule was tough before the season started, when in reality, you can’t fully judge how good or bad teams are until the season transpires. 

His post was honestly way too long for me to bother reading all of it, but what I will say is I don’t think it’s fair to say that Miami team wasn’t great because of a weak schedule. Going undefeated is incredibly impressive any way you cut it. But I definitely would put SB winners like the 78 Steelers, 85 Bears, 84/89 9ers, 91 Redskins, 96 Packers and 04 Patriots ahead of them. 

[JAF-N72EX]

11 minutes ago, Bolts223 said:

His post was honestly way too long for me to bother reading all of it

Short attention spans are becoming part of an epidemic these days.

I thought it was a good read, even if I don't necessarily agree with entire premise of it was.

[BayRaider]

43 minutes ago, Bolts223 said:

His post was honestly way too long for me to bother reading all of it, but what I will say is I don’t think it’s fair to say that Miami team wasn’t great because of a weak schedule. Going undefeated is incredibly impressive any way you cut it. But I definitely would put SB winners like the 78 Steelers, 85 Bears, 84/89 9ers, 91 Redskins, 96 Packers and 04 Patriots ahead of them. 

No doubt they are still at bare minimum a Top 20 squad ever, even Top 8-10 is a respectable argument. But in no way are they better than 84/89 49ers, 85 Bears, 91 Redskins, 04 Patriots, etc. 

[AlexGreen#20]

1 hour ago, JustAnotherFan said:

Short attention spans are becoming part of an epidemic these days.

I thought it was a good read, even if I don't necessarily agree with entire premise of it was.

Unrelated tangents that don't counter the point being made in a coherent manner while also being insulting and dismissive are worth skipping

[Bolts223]

7 hours ago, JustAnotherFan said:

Short attention spans are becoming part of an epidemic these days.

I thought it was a good read, even if I don't necessarily agree with entire premise of it was.

I mean if it was something I really cared about enough I would read the whole thing.

But after reading the first bit of his post it came off more like a homer ranting to prop up a team from 50 years ago.

[FinSting]

Saw a NYPost story criticizing the Jets roster that had me surprised, realizing how the Jets are so similar to Miami: first year with new coach, young 2nd-year QB, horrid o-line, one good player on a mostly junk d-line (Christian Wilkins for Miami, Leonard Williams for NYJ). One baller in the secondary (Xavien Howard for Miami, Jamal Adams for NYJ). Woeful pass rush for both teams. Weak WR production. Miami is worst scoring team, Jets are 2nd-worst scoring team. Miami and NYJ tied for 29th in rushing average at 3.0 yds. And zero rushing TD's for either team. 

This is downright mirror image freaky. 

[Bolts223]

I think with that loss to the Redskins this team has a legit chance to go 0-16.

I don't think they can beat a healthy Jets team

I don't think they can beat the Giants.

Only real chance I think they have is late in the year against the Bengals now.

[HTTRDynasty]

They will win a couple games if they start Fitzpatrick.  That offense showed a night and day difference with him in vs Rosen.

[theJ]

22 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

They will win a couple games if they start Fitzpatrick.  That offense showed a night and day difference with him in vs Rosen.

They already did for a few games and he was bad. 

But he does give them a better shot against the Bengals. 

33 minutes ago, Bolts223 said:

Only real chance I think they have is late in the year against the Bengals now.

As of right now I'll still take the Bengals in that one. Bengals are bad, but still can do a few things well. Dolphins are just bad everywhere.