Transfers & Rumors: Deadline Drama!

[Hunter2_1]

2 hours ago, PARROTHEAD said:

Didnt get Arsenals push for Luiz. Am I wrong to say I think it might be for the best they didnt get him? 

Forest with 20+ signings. Feels like an NFL expansion team. Less confident of staying up now than when it was just a dozen signings.

Looks like they’ll have to play with El Neny and Xhaka for a while again. Feels like CM is a missing piece. But Luiz is OK

forest have gone mad lol

[Dr LBC]

2 hours ago, PARROTHEAD said:

Didnt get Arsenals push for Luiz. Am I wrong to say I think it might be for the best they didnt get him? 

Forest with 20+ signings. Feels like an NFL expansion team. Less confident of staying up now than when it was just a dozen signings.

According to everything I'm hearing, there was no plan to bring in any CM until the scans of Partey and El Neny both came back as reading for more long-term absences.  Our second bid was right at about 25m, which is more than fair for a player who is in the final year of his contract, has said he's not going to sign an extension, and who has started 1 match (a cup game) this season.

It's rolling the dice a little considering the added fixture congestion coming from the damn World Cup being in the winter, but we have the versatility to make due with what we have without a major drop-off in form.  Saliba coming in and effectively locking down the RCB spot is a catalyst for that because it allows, in addition to Lokonga who always was wanting/needing for more minutes, Zinchenko to play CM (not the #6, but  based on what we've seen of him for Ukraine, he and Xhaka can double-pivot fairly easily), and what may be a shock us, Ben White actually can (and did for Brighton, for a spell) play DM.  Arsenal fans, especially Arsenal fans on Twitter, are often the embodiment of the mouse from If You Give a Mouse a Cookie, no matter how much you actually give them they're always going to be demanding more - context be damned.

[PARROTHEAD]

21 hours ago, Dr LBC said:

According to everything I'm hearing, there was no plan to bring in any CM until the scans of Partey and El Neny both came back as reading for more long-term absences.  Our second bid was right at about 25m, which is more than fair for a player who is in the final year of his contract, has said he's not going to sign an extension, and who has started 1 match (a cup game) this season.

It's rolling the dice a little considering the added fixture congestion coming from the damn World Cup being in the winter, but we have the versatility to make due with what we have without a major drop-off in form.  Saliba coming in and effectively locking down the RCB spot is a catalyst for that because it allows, in addition to Lokonga who always was wanting/needing for more minutes, Zinchenko to play CM (not the #6, but  based on what we've seen of him for Ukraine, he and Xhaka can double-pivot fairly easily), and what may be a shock us, Ben White actually can (and did for Brighton, for a spell) play DM.  Arsenal fans, especially Arsenal fans on Twitter, are often the embodiment of the mouse from If You Give a Mouse a Cookie, no matter how much you actually give them they're always going to be demanding more - context be damned.

So many other options out there. Just had a dozen non Premier teams slapped with UEFA FFP fines. So Id assume there were teams that would listen and need that revenue to come in. Why an overpriced Luiz bid at the last minute?

Didnt know Partey/Neny would be out such an extended time. But I would have cast a bigger search net rather than going all-or-nothing trying to reel in Luiz last minute.

[Dr LBC]

9 hours ago, PARROTHEAD said:

So many other options out there. Just had a dozen non Premier teams slapped with UEFA FFP fines. So Id assume there were teams that would listen and need that revenue to come in. Why an overpriced Luiz bid at the last minute?

Didnt know Partey/Neny would be out such an extended time. But I would have cast a bigger search net rather than going all-or-nothing trying to reel in Luiz last minute.

Simple answer to the first part, because finding someone who is at least of a caliber to push Thomas Partey but not replace him that's also not going to cost you a king's ransom (particularly when you can't presently offer Champions League football) is far, far easier said than done.  Trust me, I've tried.  Also, with the amount of time that Partey and El Neny are expected to miss, the club strategy was clearly, and rather sensibly, to get someone who wasn't going to require a near-month to acclimate to the PL before being able to hit the ground running - so the pool to draw from was already then shrunk down to current PL players.

One thing I've definitely noticed from watch Edu work over the past two years is that he just plain doesn't do knee-jerk reaction moves (anymore; you could make the argument that he did at the very beginning of his tenure, but he appears to have learned from that mistake).  Part and parcel to that is that their "plan" extends longer than a single window; I think the level of flexibility in the plan increases as you go further out in the project, because you can't control what other clubs are going to do.  But just as last winter, despite all the pressure to bring in an Aubameyang replacement/another striker/etc. they made overtures towards a certain tier/level of striker, but when that wasn't something that materialized they weren't just going to be content to settle for plan C, D, or E because it posed potential new barriers to the plan for the summer immediately following (namely Jesus, because City hadn't really made their intent to go after Haaland very secretive).

The "Pipe Dream" (i.e. not going to happen, but they probably have it as the pole example of where they might be looking next summer, assuming CL qualification and further progression in terms of competitiveness continues) is Jude Bellingham next summer.  We're (from the looks of it) rounding into the level of development where we won't be going after ~4 signings per summer, because there simply won't be the spots in the side for that amount, but rather going after 1-2 (3 tops) players in a major window, while still having ~90-100m outlays, with the intent that said signings stand to improve not just your senior squad on the whole, but your starting XI (with a 6-12mo allowance for bedding in).

Now, we may yet see Arsenal sign Tielemans to a pre-contract come January (I still have my doubts, to be honest), but I get why they cooled on him.  He wouldn't have been competition for Partey - he's simply not a strong enough ball-winner or having the defensive prowess; and even Partey isn't a true #6, he's just the best at the position that we've got (and, on the rarer and rarer occasions that he's healthy), one of the best in the PL (clearly second to the likes of Rodri, Silva, and Fabinho).  He's also our joint-highest wage earner so you don't do yourself any favors creating situations where you relegate that guy on your team to a squad player.  Tielemans was very likely seen as someone to push Xhaka, but given the way Xhaka has started the season the push was gained without ever buying the player.

Given that El Neny renewed on only a 1-year deal, I could see the sense in bringing in Luiz as a visible upgrade on him (who still wouldn't have had major issue if Partey returning from injury pushed him to the bench), and an El Neny replacement moving forward (since Mohammad's injury looks like it will take a couple months' chunk out of that 1-year deal in availability).  But that would have been provided that the deal wasn't an overpayment and anything over 20m, realistically, for a player of Douglas Luiz's caliber with only a year left on his contract, would have constituted an overpayment.  Had the El Neny and Partey injuries not happened literally with days of one-another, I would have argued that it would have been more logical, from a long-term prospectus, to not sign anyone at CM (I was against Tielemans once it became clear Xhaka was staying this season and once we brought in Vieira), because of the obstacle it would put to getting a signable player of requisite quality once we had qualified for CL and had more doors open to us in terms of available transfer targets.  But, effectively, my ambition towards getting that player this window (similar to my outlook on the striker/forward situation last winter, when it was known at the time that the like of David, Isak, and, at the time presumably, Jesus weren't even movement-considerably till the summer), that ambition basically dried up once Ibrahime Sangare extended with PSV.

[amac]

Sounds like Joao Felix Chelsea is on the verge of getting done

[PARROTHEAD]

Arsenal vs. Forest now.

 

[amac]

Maybe he’ll be a revelation for them but it seems like Chelsea are loaded on attacking mid/wingers who are a bit unproven at the highest level and lacking goal scorers/true #9s.

[packerstk7]

19 hours ago, PARROTHEAD said:

Arsenal vs. Forest now.

 

Not sure Arsenal will be buying Danilo if we are spending 100m on Mudryk.

Edited January 11, 2023 by packerstk7

[PARROTHEAD]

33 minutes ago, packerstk7 said:

Not sure Arsenal will be buying Danilo if we are spending 100m on Mudryk.

Saw a couple places he was Arsenal destined if the Mudryk deal fell through. Glad your deal happened so Forest could roll after Danilo. Be a great get for the defense should he come this way.

And all the Moukoko to Newcastle news. Did not see that coming. Didnt know Dortmund was in that bad of financial shape in not being able to resign him.

[agarcia34]

Sounds like the Mudryk deal should be done by tomorrow 

[Dr LBC]

On 1/9/2023 at 8:47 AM, amac said:

Sounds like Joao Felix Chelsea is on the verge of getting done

Not that I don't like Felix as a player, but damn, Chelsea are just bending over and taking it on that deal, aren't they?

That amount for a 6-month loan (on a player that, by Spanish media's own expectation, is going to take 3 months to adapt to the PL), with no buy-option, and, even to the contrary of that, the player signs a 5-year extension with Atletico to boot?  Yikes!

[Dr LBC]

1 hour ago, agarcia34 said:

Sounds like the Mudryk deal should be done by tomorrow 

Depends on the outlets you believe.  Fabrizio and James McNicholas have come out recently and quashed the "closeness" of the deal.  That said, Mudryk made it about as clear as he can, while still being a good little soldier and showing up, that he doesn't want to be there.  Won't be surprised to see Shaktar try to drag this out a little longer, but I think the reality that if the deal is going to happen this window, they want to get the guy they've tapped to be Mudryk's replacement (by all accounts at this point, that's Jeffinho) in and training with the club so he can his the ground running and integrate as seamlessly as possible ahead of their EURO round.

[packerstk7]

4 hours ago, Dr LBC said:

Depends on the outlets you believe.  Fabrizio and James McNicholas have come out recently and quashed the "closeness" of the deal.  That said, Mudryk made it about as clear as he can, while still being a good little soldier and showing up, that he doesn't want to be there.  Won't be surprised to see Shaktar try to drag this out a little longer, but I think the reality that if the deal is going to happen this window, they want to get the guy they've tapped to be Mudryk's replacement (by all accounts at this point, that's Jeffinho) in and training with the club so he can his the ground running and integrate as seamlessly as possible ahead of their EURO round.

I doubt it’s done (announced by one of the clubs) before the end of next week. These are the kinda deals Arsenal take forever to complete. In this case I don’t blame them. This is a kid with little experience from the Ukrainian league going for 60+ million guaranteed fee.

[PARROTHEAD]

1 hour ago, packerstk7 said:

I doubt it’s done (announced by one of the clubs) before the end of next week. These are the kinda deals Arsenal take forever to complete. In this case I don’t blame them. This is a kid with little experience from the Ukrainian league going for 60+ million guaranteed fee.

I just found out this morning. Arsenal has Folarin Balogun under contract, at Reims on loan (thought he had a Reims contract). Now looking to sell him for 35m.

Like your touching on. Balogun might be a touch behind in development, but both look like special talents in the making. Im not sure how Id handle this move if I already had Balogun under contract. Or if Im adding Mudryk regardless, that Id sell Balogun over others.

[Dr LBC]

1 hour ago, packerstk7 said:

I doubt it’s done (announced by one of the clubs) before the end of next week. These are the kinda deals Arsenal take forever to complete. In this case I don’t blame them. This is a kid with little experience from the Ukrainian league going for 60+ million guaranteed fee.

Really hasn't got a ton to do with Arsenal as to why it's dragging - aside from the fact that they're not willing to bend over like Chelsea just did for Felix and coalesce to ridiculous demands from Shakhtar.  Fabrizio Romano has already confirmed that the two clubs speak daily.  They're trying to find terms whereby Shakhtar who, based on the present state of Ukraine, need the money so of course they're trying to maximize the return for one of their Top 3 academy prospects (they also have a long history of digging their heels in on doing this even before Russia invaded Ukraine - see the Fred, Willian, Fernandinho, and Douglas Costa sales).  That said, they're not gonna get anything close to 100m up front or even probably 70m up front. 

Granted, I think the latest reports from Chelsea's end claiming that Shakhtar is overinflating their level of interest in Mudrk are really more a case of Chelsea trying to save face a bit, and that their heavy move on Felix was at least in part a product of Mudryk making it clear he preferred Arsenal and not Chelsea.  But Shaktar is quickly losing a lot of the leverage they had to be making demands for a specific price simply because United in the same league, arguably, overpaid for Antony.