Geezy Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 3 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said: I agree but I also don’t think carr would give a guy like theilen opportunities to show how good of a wr he is cause carr is picky Theilan knows how to get open and catches the ball, much like Waller and Renfrow who seem to get targeted a lot. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 18 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: I do agree Carr is picky, but Theilen is like Renfrow on steroids lol. He just catches the ball. Carr has shown that if you catch the ball he will feed you. Crabtree, Renfrow, Waller. Its the players who struggle with consistency catching that Carr starts to ignore. . . Hello Amarii Theilien is one of the best receivers in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 28 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: Thank you! By all means, move the guy. I'm not David Carr, so I'm not going to be personally offended. But when you do, at least be intelligent in what you do with the haul. Lumping 3 1st rounders together to move up is, frankly, never the intelligent thing to do. Especially considering this years QB class is probably the weakest in recent draft history. You can afford to make moves like that if you're already a contending team but we have holes across the roster. If you're moving Carr for picks the only reason it even makes sense is so that you can accelerate a rebuild and then whoever we do bring in at QB will have a much more talented team around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, Geezy said: Theilan knows how to get open and catches the ball, much like Waller and Renfrow who seem to get targeted a lot. Carr has always had his guys and would/will almost target them exclusively. We saw it with Amari, once Carr lost faith in him he stopped getting targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dante9876 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 36 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: " Say we go 6-11 and end up picking 10th. We would be in a great position to package that pick along with the two 1sts to get into the top 2-3. " Probably because that is what the stated goal in the conversation was..... Well thats dumb I agree with you there. I came in on you saying go nate Peterman route ant try to go full tank. I dont think thats a sound strategy either. I'm not sure how in one sentence we can say the roster is so bad than in the next sentence say a bridge qb that's 2 tiers lower than carr might get us 7 to 8 wins by accident. You don't have to purposefully tank of this roster is as bad as everybody says it Is. You bringing in Peterman would set a bad precedent for the new gm and coaching staff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonGruber Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 20 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: I do agree Carr is picky, but Theilen is like Renfrow on steroids lol. He just catches the ball. Carr has shown that if you catch the ball he will feed you. Crabtree, Renfrow, Waller. Its the players who struggle with consistency catching that Carr starts to ignore. . . Hello Amarii Amari dropping passes irked a lot of fans I get it and Carr as well but look at say Diontae Johnson how many passes he drop last year and Big Ben kept feeding him and he’s still integral part of the offense Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronjon1990 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: Especially considering this years QB class is probably the weakest in recent draft history. You can afford to make moves like that if you're already a contending team but we have holes across the roster. If you're moving Carr for picks the only reason it even makes sense is so that you can accelerate a rebuild and then whoever we do bring in at QB will have a much more talented team around him. Yep. There are a couple of guys in this class I wouldn't mind snagging and building around. But there isn't a single one I would trade up for if it required anything close to multiple high picks. None of them are the type of talent that would elevate what we currently have and would be essentially stuck to having. The potential FAs at key spots aren't interested in a long rebuild. Adams, Gallup, Robinson, etc, they're not looking to be on a team that might be good in 3, 4, 5 years. Kiss them goodbye if you use a ton of picks to move up for a rookie QB. They'd probably play with one, but they're smart enough to know them and a rookie isn't enough to make a run. Of you're going to rebuild, you have to have more than just a QB lol 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Just now, ronjon1990 said: Yep. There are a couple of guys in this class I wouldn't mind snagging and building around. But there isn't a single one I would trade up for if it required anything close to multiple high picks. None of them are the type of talent that would elevate what we currently have and would be essentially stuck to having. The potential FAs at key spots aren't interested in a long rebuild. Adams, Gallup, Robinson, etc, they're not looking to be on a team that might be good in 3, 4, 5 years. Kiss them goodbye if you use a ton of picks to move up for a rookie QB. They'd probably play with one, but they're smart enough to know them and a rookie isn't enough to make a run. Of you're going to rebuild, you have to have more than just a QB lol I like Kenny Pickett but definitely wouldn't leverage our future to move up and grab him. If we draft a rookie QB I can't see us being a player for Adams/Robinson. Adams is in his prime and wants to win a Super Bowl. Robinson is having by far the worst season of his career playing with a rookie QB. 100%, Carr is solid but as he has shown being solid at QB doesn't mean much if the defense sucks or you don't have talent around you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpaulthe1st Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 (edited) 46 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said: " Say we go 6-11 and end up picking 10th. We would be in a great position to package that pick along with the two 1sts to get into the top 2-3. " Probably because that is what the stated goal in the conversation was..... This is based on my assertion that Bryce Young is a franchise QB. If I’m right about that then 3 1st rounders is a great price to pay considering it would equate to a 32-year old Derek Carr and a 1st rounder for a 22-year old future franchise QB on a rookie deal. It’s certainly a risk but I would take that deal all day if Young is who I think he is. Edited December 10, 2021 by jpaulthe1st Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 18 minutes ago, jpaulthe1st said: This is based on my assertion that Bryce Young is a franchise QB. If I’m right about that then 3 1st rounders is a great price to pay considering it would equate to a 32-year old Derek Carr and a 1st rounder for a 22-year old future franchise QB on a rookie deal. It’s certainly a risk but I would take that deal all day if Young is who I think he is. Ideally we'd trade Carr for a 1st this season and then would likely be pretty meh next year so we wouldn't need to give up 3 1sts to move up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpaulthe1st Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 5 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Ideally we'd trade Carr for a 1st this season and then would likely be pretty meh next year so we wouldn't need to give up 3 1sts to move up. I think Carr would fetch 2 1sts on the open market Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 54 minutes ago, NYRaider said: I like Kenny Pickett but definitely wouldn't leverage our future to move up and grab him. If we draft a rookie QB I can't see us being a player for Adams/Robinson. Adams is in his prime and wants to win a Super Bowl. Robinson is having by far the worst season of his career playing with a rookie QB. 100%, Carr is solid but as he has shown being solid at QB doesn't mean much if the defense sucks or you don't have talent around you. This is the reality. I want to build a juggernaut on offense with weapons/talent and if we want to trade the qb, so be it. But give the rookie somewhere to develop with talent around them. We need to add a 1st round receiver or Robinson/Gallup into this offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 15 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said: This is the reality. I want to build a juggernaut on offense with weapons/talent and if we want to trade the qb, so be it. But give the rookie somewhere to develop with talent around them. We need to add a 1st round receiver or Robinson/Gallup into this offense. When you look at basically every good QB in the league, they all stepped into good situations as young starters. Patrick Mahomes - Good OL, Kelcee, Hill, Hunt Dak Prescott - Elite OL, elite run game, good defense Russell Wilson - Good OL, elite defense, elite run game Justin Herbert - Good OL, Ekler, Williams, Keenan Joe Burrow - Decent OL, Mixon, Chase, Higgins, Boyd 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrOaktown_56 Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 Just now, NYRaider said: When you look at basically every good QB in the league, they all stepped into good situations as young starters. Patrick Mahomes - Good OL, Kelcee, Hill, Hunt Dak Prescott - Elite OL, elite run game, good defense Russell Wilson - Good OL, elite defense, elite run game Justin Herbert - Good OL, Ekler, Williams, Keenan Joe Burrow - Decent OL, Mixon, Chase, Higgins, Boyd Carr: greg olsen, rod streater, andre holmes 😂 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted December 10, 2021 Share Posted December 10, 2021 49 minutes ago, jpaulthe1st said: I think Carr would fetch 2 1sts on the open market What team do you think would realistically give up 2 firsts for him? Realistically the only team I could see giving up a haul would be the Saints because their core offensive players are in their prime and he fits their system to a tee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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