The Raider Depreciation Thread 📉

[Rolni]

They should have tried harder to improve a pretty average OL

They should have worked harder to get JJ under contract before TC, so this out of form JJ would never be an issue

They should have thought about Jimmy G's deep ball issues and the consequence of that regarding the stacked boxes

 

This is on the FO and the coaching staff if you ask me.

More or less every fan asked for upgrade at least for the interior OL

Most fans wanted to sign JJ either long term or to a higher 1 year deal to avoid this situation

Most fans had their issues with Jimmy's medical history and his reluctancy to throw it deep

 

They should have moved Parham to OC, let Andre walk and bring in 2 OG's with some strength.

They should have give this deal to JJ early in the summer, so he can train with the boys.

JMD and the staff should have prepared plays, shots which are safe to throw, but would keep the defenses honest. Don't have to be long go routes all the time, but deeper crossers etc...Jimmy should be able to throw a few of those without issue. That would give more room for JJ and the running game.

 

Don't even let me start with the Defense, where most of us screemed for DT help!

[Jeremy408]

2 hours ago, Rolni said:

They should have tried harder to improve a pretty average OL

They should have worked harder to get JJ under contract before TC, so this out of form JJ would never be an issue

They should have thought about Jimmy G's deep ball issues and the consequence of that regarding the stacked boxes

 

This is on the FO and the coaching staff if you ask me.

More or less every fan asked for upgrade at least for the interior OL

Most fans wanted to sign JJ either long term or to a higher 1 year deal to avoid this situation

Most fans had their issues with Jimmy's medical history and his reluctancy to throw it deep

 

They should have moved Parham to OC, let Andre walk and bring in 2 OG's with some strength.

They should have give this deal to JJ early in the summer, so he can train with the boys.

JMD and the staff should have prepared plays, shots which are safe to throw, but would keep the defenses honest. Don't have to be long go routes all the time, but deeper crossers etc...Jimmy should be able to throw a few of those without issue. That would give more room for JJ and the running game.

 

Don't even let me start with the Defense, where most of us screemed for DT help!

Think about this: since the new regime took over, what is one need from the old regime that they fixed?

[Rolni]

1 hour ago, Jeremy408 said:

Think about this: since the new regime took over, what is one need from the old regime that they fixed?

Great point man!

We wanted better QB play and the QB guru JMD wasn't able to deliver it. Neither with Carr, nor with Jimmy.

We wanted better OL play and while last year the OL improved, so far this year this run blocking is killing it...

We wanted better DL play, but the only Mad Maxx plays better and I'm pretty sure it is not the product of in house coaching...

We wanted better LB play and while we might have it, we can't really see it because of the abysmal DT play

We wanted better coverage at the back end and while we might have it, we can't see it because of the DL play...

 

Under Gruden we had a frustrating, but occasionally good O play and horrible D play.

Now we have a frustrating and struggling O play and still really bad D play.

 

By now, by the 2nd year we should see how our schemes are putting the players in places to make plays...either the schemes are bad or they haven't find the players for it, but at this points it's on them with two offseason behind them...

[big_palooka]

30 minutes ago, Rolni said:

Great point man!

We wanted better QB play and the QB guru JMD wasn't able to deliver it. Neither with Carr, nor with Jimmy.

We wanted better OL play and while last year the OL improved, so far this year this run blocking is killing it...

We wanted better DL play, but the only Mad Maxx plays better and I'm pretty sure it is not the product of in house coaching...

We wanted better LB play and while we might have it, we can't really see it because of the abysmal DT play

We wanted better coverage at the back end and while we might have it, we can't see it because of the DL play...

 

Under Gruden we had a frustrating, but occasionally good O play and horrible D play.

Now we have a frustrating and struggling O play and still really bad D play.

 

By now, by the 2nd year we should see how our schemes are putting the players in places to make plays...either the schemes are bad or they haven't find the players for it, but at this points it's on them with two offseason behind them...

I think you nailed it. It comes down to the trenches.

Gruden purged the vet Oline if you recall. And we've been calling for them to improve it since. And the Dline has been an issue for a long time. 

This regime has drafted for both lines. The problem is, nobody is standing out. And they've spent (minimally) in FA to fix both sides and nothing has improved.

Outside trading for a marque DT, I don't see how you fix it outside keep drafting and hoping someone develops. 

[Jeremy408]

4 hours ago, big_palooka said:

I think you nailed it. It comes down to the trenches.

Gruden purged the vet Oline if you recall. And we've been calling for them to improve it since. And the Dline has been an issue for a long time. 

This regime has drafted for both lines. The problem is, nobody is standing out. And they've spent (minimally) in FA to fix both sides and nothing has improved.

Outside trading for a marque DT, I don't see how you fix it outside keep drafting and hoping someone develops. 

The problem, though, as they haven't really invested in the Oline, & they've been wrong about all of the Dline investments thus far. Which is why I asked the question of what have they actually fixed that was previously broken.

[ronjon1990]

6 hours ago, Jeremy408 said:

Think about this: since the new regime took over, what is one need from the old regime that they fixed?

Well, Spillane and Deablo are 14 and 15 in tackles this year....

Of course that's due in large part to the fact our DL is simply non-existent, but we don't wanna rain on anyone's parade or anything negative like that. Smoke the plant, trust the process and whatever.

Edited September 27, 2023 by ronjon1990

[Jeremy408]

Just now, ronjon1990 said:

Well, Spillane and Deablo are 14 and 15 in tackles this year....

Of course that's due in large part to the fact our DL is simply non-existent, but we don't wanna rain on anyone's parade or anything negative like that. Smoke the plant, trust the process amd whatever.

I like Diablo but he was on the team already from the previous regime. Spillane can't cover. He's basically just another Kwiatkoski(and no I'm not just saying that because he's white) 

[ronjon1990]

17 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said:

The problem, though, as they haven't really invested in the Oline, & they've been wrong about all of the Dline investments thus far. Which is why I asked the question of what have they actually fixed that was previously broken.

Nothing. Nada. Zilch. 

Our contracts situations are an abysmal mess too. I remember the days where we complained about how much they paid Ryan Nassib. Hell, I'd take that deal in a heartbeat at this point. 

I've been yelling about the mismanagement of assets for a while now. Whether draft picks, re-signings, new deals, FA signings, trades, etc- they've pretty well whiffed on them all with respect to any long term outlook. 

I said before I felt that McDaniels picked us because we were a playoff team with the core elements in place and he wanted to just waltz in, ride the coattails, repair his reputation, and run off back to New England once Bill goes out to the coach pasture. He thought it would be an easy gimme- that what was already here would be good enough to be 2nd best behind the Chiefs. The minute it became apparent that with the scheme changes and such there was actual work to be done and it wasn't a matter of plug and play continuation style, he lost the plot. 

Josh, at his best, is an X's and O's guy and even that is questionable. He's not a CEO. And Dave Zeigler is at best in over his head and wouldn't have been hired as a GM without McDaniels getting the HC gig. Zeigler may someday make a solid GM, but I won't hold my breath. The Pats bad drafting and his history with Josh in Denver was a red flag from day one for me. Neither has any real clue what they're doing, they're winging it, and it's obvious. And they're doing so because the ready-made situation they assumed they were being gifted wasn't that. 

Mark Davis is to blame as well for not seeing the forest for the trees. Maybe Josh could step into an already good situation and keep it going. Maybe Dave could be his GM effectively for a while. But we weren't that and we aren't that. We were at best looking at a partial renovation and a total demo at worst. Nobody in their right mind would hire these jokers to oversee that- hence why for all thr hoopla about McDaniels, New England never blocked him and the only other team over the last decade to even consider him was the franchise headed up by the city's resident coke head. 12 years is a loooooooong time for a supposed wunderkind to toil around without a HC offer. All the openings that have come and gone, all the retreads who landed on their feet relatively quickly, and yet this supposed  genius sat in New England for the better part of a decade waiting for shot number 2? Yeah, that says a lot about how the rest of the league really felt about him. 

[Jeremy408]

4 hours ago, ronjon1990 said:

McDaniels picked us because we were a playoff team with the core elements in place and he wanted to just waltz in, ride the coattails, repair his reputation

And all of the decisions they made supported that which was why it should've been a red flag in the first place. 
 

Remember, when the apologist were trying to argue that it was supposed to be a rebuild the whole time, despite trading a first and a second for Davante Adams

Edited September 28, 2023 by Jeremy408

[big_palooka]

Everything really comes down to the fact they went all in on Derek Carr. And Derek Carr let them down. 

That was the catalyst in all of this. You can like a player outside looking in, but different when you get them on the grass. 

They went all in thinking they had the QB and Carr was a let down. It sucks, but that is the reality. Devante, Hunter, Waller were all decisions resulting from the belief they had the QB in place.

You could tell early on last season they knew they made a mistake. They took the ball out of Carr's hands and started running the offense through Jacobs. He became the focal point of the offense that made it go, not the QB they bought in to. 

The rest is history... Carr was mediocre. They thought they could get Tom Brady made rash decisions as a result. And now the regime is unraveling around their QB decision. 

There are other components, mainly the defense. But it all starts and ends with do you have the guy at QB. They didn't, still don't and will like lose jobs over it in the end. 

[bucksavage1]

11 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

Everything really comes down to the fact they went all in on Derek Carr. And Derek Carr let them down. 

That was the catalyst in all of this. You can like a player outside looking in, but different when you get them on the grass. 

They went all in thinking they had the QB and Carr was a let down. It sucks, but that is the reality. Devante, Hunter, Waller were all decisions resulting from the belief they had the QB in place.

You could tell early on last season they knew they made a mistake. They took the ball out of Carr's hands and started running the offense through Jacobs. He became the focal point of the offense that made it go, not the QB they bought in to. 

The rest is history... Carr was mediocre. They thought they could get Tom Brady made rash decisions as a result. And now the regime is unraveling around their QB decision. 

There are other components, mainly the defense. But it all starts and ends with do you have the guy at QB. They didn't, still don't and will like lose jobs over it in the end. 

Another Regime tied themselves to a mid QB Carr and it might be their downfall 

[jpaulthe1st]

7 minutes ago, bucksavage1 said:

Another Regime tied themselves to a mid QB Carr and it might be their downfall 

Carr is a Coach killer. Dennis Allen is next up (for the 2nd time). 

[Jeremy408]

30 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

Everything really comes down to the fact they went all in on Derek Carr. And Derek Carr let them down. 

That was the catalyst in all of this. You can like a player outside looking in, but different when you get them on the grass. 

They went all in thinking they had the QB and Carr was a let down. It sucks, but that is the reality. Devante, Hunter, Waller were all decisions resulting from the belief they had the QB in place.

You could tell early on last season they knew they made a mistake. They took the ball out of Carr's hands and started running the offense through Jacobs. He became the focal point of the offense that made it go, not the QB they bought in to. 

The rest is history... Carr was mediocre. They thought they could get Tom Brady made rash decisions as a result. And now the regime is unraveling around their QB decision. 

There are other components, mainly the defense. But it all starts and ends with do you have the guy at QB. They didn't, still don't and will like lose jobs over it in the end. 

What about now? Is that why we can't play offense or defense unless we're playing the broncos?

[BackinBlack]

2 hours ago, big_palooka said:

Everything really comes down to the fact they went all in on Derek Carr. And Derek Carr let them down. 

That was the catalyst in all of this. You can like a player outside looking in, but different when you get them on the grass. 

They went all in thinking they had the QB and Carr was a let down. It sucks, but that is the reality. Devante, Hunter, Waller were all decisions resulting from the belief they had the QB in place.

You could tell early on last season they knew they made a mistake. They took the ball out of Carr's hands and started running the offense through Jacobs. He became the focal point of the offense that made it go, not the QB they bought in to. 

The rest is history... Carr was mediocre. They thought they could get Tom Brady made rash decisions as a result. And now the regime is unraveling around their QB decision. 

There are other components, mainly the defense. But it all starts and ends with do you have the guy at QB. They didn't, still don't and will like lose jobs over it in the end. 

How come you give Graham a pass for no talent at every possibility, but then also take every chance to mention Carr let them down?
Outside of DA, what did you realistically expect Carr to do throwing to Mack Hollins, Moreau and Keenan Cole?
If you were a DC would you not Bracket DA and make the other WRs beat you? That literally happened every game. 
Yes fans screamed, Carr is ignoring DA, but teams literally knew he was our only passing option. 

On top of that, our run game was historically bad outside of Jacobs last year. (0 TDS outside of Jacobs) 
If Jacobs was out on 3rd down, or whatever reason, we had literallly no threat outside of DA. 

-
The team also felt our O was lacking fire power clearly, as we brought in a big FA WR, a 3rd round WR, and a second round TE. 
That is a lot of ammo on O. 

If they felt the QB is what let them down, why did they ‘upgrade’ WR2, TE and WR4?
Do they just have no idea how to build a team in your opinion? Cause that is also a problem. 

We were what 15 or so in points scored, you claim the QB is what failed them. 
If that is the case why did they spend so much amping up the receiving core, when the DC can’t be evaluated because there is no talent there?

That is to me, terrible roster management, and reason to be let go. 
 

[RaidersAreOne]

The thing that bugs me so much too is the mismanagement of players once we commit to them. 

McD didn't have to keep Carr as he was expiring, yet we extended him.

Waller, we gave a big extension to then shipped him off right away.

Renfrow, same thing. McZ gave him a big contract then completey ignored him afterwards.

It just makes zero sense. It's one thing to come to a new team, ship guys out because they aren't "your guys", then bring new guys in. But McZ went out of their way to RETAIN Carr/Renfrow/Waller, then they pulled the plug right off the bat.

It makes absolutely no sense. Their coaches/scouts are clearly out to lunch if they can't properly evaluate in-house players.