Future QB Discussion

[Heinz D.]

On 1/19/2021 at 7:16 PM, RunningVaccs said:

Ye gods..  I leave for a while and we're talking ourselves into Minshew?

No "talking ourselves into" about it. 

Minshew will be available (most likely) because the Jags gave up on him too early. 

Seriously, what is there not to like about Minshew? 

On 1/19/2021 at 7:33 PM, Uncle Buck said:

Would the Bears be willing to give up their first round picks for the next three years for Deshaun Watson? 

Yeah, they would. But the deciding factors there are the Bears pick this year (#20), and Watson's desire to play in Chicago. Makes it seem like all the trade talk is ridiculous, to me. 

5 hours ago, Nads786 said:

If we were to get Minshew, we should talk about this trade with Foles. We want to make sure his feelings aren't hurt, George made it clear the culture of this organization is about feelings and friendship. Winning is a result of the friendships you make along the way.

2 hours ago, beardown3231 said:

Not that Dwayne Haskins will likely ever amount to anything, but it's hilarious how an organization like Pittsburgh brings him aboard in a win-win situation for them but the Bears don't. Foles in 2021!

To think Haskins is a known commodity is goofy. Which is why a much more savvy organization than the Chicago Bears picked him up...

2 hours ago, WindyCity said:

Louis Riddick, who is close with Matt Nagy, just said on ESPN radio that Pace/Nagy are in on trying to get Watson to Chicago.

Let's hope it's true. Too bad Riddick isn't Nagy's GM. 

30 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

They can't gut team and pay him top dollar and win.

Just like how the Packers, Chiefs, and Buccaneers can't "win", right? 

[topwop1]

27 minutes ago, CBears019 said:

I can’t begin to imagine what it would cost for the bears to get Watson considering what NYJ and MIA have to offer.

This is assuming that both the Jets and Dolphins even want Watson and want to give up all the draft capital required to get him...

[WindyCity]

15 minutes ago, topwop1 said:

This is assuming that both the Jets and Dolphins even want Watson and want to give up all the draft capital required to get him...

Not a huge leap. He is a top 5 QB.

[topwop1]

1 hour ago, WindyCity said:

Not a huge leap. He is a top 5 QB.

Right but not every team thinks they need to trade the farm for one player no matter how good he is.

Personally I don't think the Jets will be close to a SB if they were to trade multiple high picks for Watson today. There still 2-3 years away at the least and that's contingent on good drafting and their coach panning out also. 

The case is made easier for the Dolphins who have a better roster as of right now but they also just drafted a QB 5th overall last year. I'm not sure they've seen enough of Tua to give up on that plan.

I'm just saying everyone shouldn't be assuming these two teams are the most interested as of today. Obviously the Texans are going to want to create the illusion that there's a big market for Watson whether it's true or not

[topwop1]

If Pace and Nagy are truly interested in Watson then they should make the Texans a good enough base offer to let them know they're serious but they should also set a limit on how much they're willing to pay to get a deal done.

Pace has a history of bidding against himself so that has to be a little worrisome...

[beardown3231]

2 hours ago, dll2000 said:

Name a below average team with a great QB that is a contender for a title ... ever - hint one of them wasn't 2020 Houston Texans.

Seahawks have a ton of upper echelon studs, but due to a few holes here and there can't compete.   

You need a good QB AND a good team.   Bears can't have both if they move for Watson because of what it will cost them.  I don't see it.   All you will do is spin your wheels for next 7 years.

 

 

 

 

Not necessarily. Patriots, Packers, Steelers, Saints, and a few others pay their QB's top dollar and still figure it out. Seattle is a weird example for you to use to prove your point. They've been to the playoffs 8 years in a row or something. They still find a way to pay really good players a ton of money.

I'm going to take my chances with the Bears trading for Watson. I don't trust Pace to find a QB better than him. I don't trust any Bears GM to ever find a god damn QB. In fact the only time I trust Pace is in rounds 2-7.

[topwop1]

2 hours ago, dll2000 said:

Pace is pretty good drafter past first round ... okay and second.   

But if he trades all draft capital for Watson you will have to rely on him to pick bargain FAs to mold into a championship team around Watson.

What are odds of that?  

Lets review his FAs, this without paying a QB top dollar much of time:

2015: LB Sam Acho, CB Tracy Porter, LB Pernell McPhee, S Antrel Rolle, WR Eddie Royal, DE Ray McDonald

2016: DE Akiem Hicks, LB Danny Trevathan, RT Bobby Massie, LB Jerrell Freeman

2017:  CB Prince Amukamara, QB Mike Glennon, S Quintin Demps, TE Dion Sims, WR Markus Wheaton (but for Prince, this may be one of worst FA classes of all time).  

2018:   WR Allen Robinson, WR Taylor Gabriel, K Cody Parkey, TE Trey Burton

2019: KR Cordarrelle Patterson, CB Buster Skrine, S Ha Ha Clinton-Dix, LB Kevin Pierre-Louis, RB Mike Davis

2020: Edge Quinn, OL Ifedi, edge Mingo, CB Burns and TE Graham.  

Who is even still here?   Who was a key difference maker?  Not many.  

 Hicks, Robinson and Prince.   3 difference makers in 6 years.  

Rest of them are just role players or plain suck and some of suck was quite pricey.   Patterson is a standout special teamer, I'll give him that.

 

 

I'd add Trevathan as a true difference maker. People forget just how good he was for us before this past season.

But yeah obviously some of these didn't work out and some were real head scratchers.

This past FA class has to be one of the worst for me just because of the dollar amount invested in Quinn and Danny T that will have implications to future cap years.

In hindsight Pace should have kept Floyd on the 1 year tender and  re-signed Kwit instead of Trevathan. Oh well what can you do?

[Madmike90]

Anyone else glad Ragone is gone? I feel we badly need a new voice in the room when it comes to the pass game design...get a QB coach from the Norv Turner tree and let's gets some better designed vertical shots in the playbook for the next QB.

Edited January 22, 2021 by Madmike90

[G08]

1 hour ago, Madmike90 said:

Anyone else glad Ragone is gone? I feel we badly need a new voice in the room when it comes to the pass game design...get a QB coach from the Norv Turner tree and let's gets some better designed vertical shots in the playbook for the next QB.

If I'm not mistaken, Lazor has Air Coryell in his background (just like Norv Turner).

[WindyCity]

2 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

Anyone else glad Ragone is gone? I feel we badly need a new voice in the room when it comes to the pass game design...get a QB coach from the Norv Turner tree and let's gets some better designed vertical shots in the playbook for the next QB.

Ragone is clearly respected. We promoted him, the Falcons promoted him.

But we know who designs this offense and who calls most of it. We don’t need 4-6 guys in a room coming up with passing plays.

[JAF-N72EX]

10 hours ago, Nads786 said:

If we were to get Minshew, we should talk about this trade with Foles. We want to make sure his feelings aren't hurt, George made it clear the culture of this organization is about feelings and friendship. Winning is a result of the friendships you make along the way.

Foles was Nagy's guy. Don't you dare leave him out of this meeting. Nagy's are people too. 

[JAF-N72EX]

22 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Ragone is clearly respected. We promoted him, the Falcons promoted him.

But we know who designs this offense and who calls most of it. We don’t need 4-6 guys in a room coming up with passing plays.

All coaches give their input on schemes/play designs. Even DC's and ST coaches. More than people think actually.  Toub talked about this a lot years ago. 

Edited January 22, 2021 by JAF-N72EX

[JAF-N72EX]

2 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

Anyone else glad Ragone is gone? I feel we badly need a new voice in the room when it comes to the pass game design...get a QB coach from the Norv Turner tree and let's gets some better designed vertical shots in the playbook for the next QB.

What we need is a OC who is actually going to come up with a solid offensive plan, create a blueprint for it, and not stray away from it no matter what! Enough of this, 1 or 2 weeks doing this. The next 3 weeks doing that. The next 4 weeks trying this. It just creates more problems than it does solutions.

[topwop1]

9 hours ago, JAF-N72EX said:

What we need is a OC who is actually going to come up with a solid offensive plan, create a blueprint for it, and not stray away from it no matter what! Enough of this, 1 or 2 weeks doing this. The next 3 weeks doing that. The next 4 weeks trying this. It just creates more problems than it does solutions.

Ya well tell that to Nagy.

When Lazor was supposedly calling the shots during that late 3 game winning streak and also in the home loss to Detroit, the offense was humming along pretty good, although you can make the argument it was against weak defenses..

And then we heard after the losses against the Packers in the season finale and playoff game against the Saints that Nagy became more involved again in the play calling.

So what's the issue here?  It appears Nagy can't help but be super involved even when it's to the detriment of the offense.

[WindyCity]

10 hours ago, JAF-N72EX said:

All coaches give their input on schemes/play designs. Even DC's and ST coaches. More than people think actually.  Toub talked about this a lot years ago. 

Collaboration is great. It is not great when your offense looks like a mashup version of Shannahan and KC and it changes every other week and in game.