Philip Rivers retiring

[ronjon1990]

1 hour ago, biggie. said:

Absolutely not. He never won MVP, never won a Super Bowl and at no point in his career was he considered among the best. Chargers Ring of Honor easily.

That really isn't true. Unless you narrow it down to just Brady and Manning as potential GOATs, Rivers was decidedly in the upper echelons of NFL QBs for a pretty good while. 

[Xenos]

44 minutes ago, ronjon1990 said:

That really isn't true. Unless you narrow it down to just Brady and Manning as potential GOATs, Rivers was decidedly in the upper echelons of NFL QBs for a pretty good while. 

Should have won MVP in 2008 IMO. If the defense hadn’t blown the first two games, record would have been a respectable 10-6.

Edited January 21, 2021 by Xenos

[43M]

3 hours ago, biggie. said:

Absolutely not. He never won MVP, never won a Super Bowl and at no point in his career was he considered among the best. Chargers Ring of Honor easily.

He played in an era with possibly 4 of the best QBs ever (Brady, Manning, Brees and Rodgers), who hogged up MVP most years.

And SBs are TEAM accomplishments.   Rivers had one of the most incompetent owners in football.

Anyway....not saying he WILL make it, but Id personally put him in at some point if it were up to me.  

[Deadpulse]

 

G 242  AV 216  Cmp%59.4  Yds 61361  Y/A 7.3  TD 420  Int 252

 

G 244   AV 216   Cmp% 64.9   Yds 63440   Y/A 7.8   TD 421  Int 209

 

Neither of these QBs won a super bowl

One of them is in the HoF and no one would question it

The other one is being relentlessly questioned. 

[JAF-N72EX]

One way we have to compare quarterbacks to their contemporaries is Adjusted Net Yards Per Attempt Index, a figure that rewards touchdown scoring as well as interception and sack avoidance. An ANY/A+ of 100 is league-average, and Rivers achieved an ANY/A+ of 120 or better in 5 different seasons, something only 11 other QBs have achieved (since 1969):

9 of those 11 other QBs are either already in the HOF or are sure-fire picks who are only waiting for eligibility. Of the 19 others listed below, 15 busts have already been made, and prototypes of one other QB have already been printed. 

ANY/A isn't the end all be all, but here are the top-20 QBs who finished the regular season with an ANY/A of 120 or better sorted by number of seasons. These are the only QBs who have finished a single season with a 120 or better in 3 or more seasons--the rest have 2 or less as of now.

▲	Player	From	To	Tm	Count
1	Peyton Manning	1999	2014	IND/DEN	11
2	Drew Brees	2004	2019	LAC/NOR	9
3	Tom Brady	2007	2016	NWE	6
4	Brett Favre *	1995	2009	GNB/MIN	6
5	Dan Fouts*	1978	1985	SDG	6
6	Roger Staubach*	1971	1979	DAL	6
7	Steve Young*	1991	1998	SFO	6
8	Ken Anderson	1973	1982	CIN	5
9	Dan Marino*	1983	1996	MIA	5
10	Philip Rivers	2008	2018	LAC	5
11	Aaron Rodgers	2009	2020	GNB	5
12	Tony Romo	2006	2014	DAL	5
13	Boomer Esiason	1985	1989	CIN	4
14	Trent Green	2000	2004	STL/KAN	4
15	Joe Montana*	1983	1989	SFO	4
16	Troy Aikman*	1993	1998	DAL	3
17	Billy Kilmer	1972	1974	WAS	3
18	Patrick Mahomes	2018	2020	KAN	3
19	Fran Tarkenton*	1973	1976	MIN	3
20	Kurt Warner*	1999	2001	STL	3

FWIW: Here is 21-41

21	Terry Bradshaw*	1978	1981	PIT	2
22	Daunte Culpepper	2000	2004	MIN	2
23	John Elway*	1987	1998	DEN	2
24	Jim Everett	1988	1989	RAM	2
25	Doug Flutie	1998	2000	BUF	2
26	Roman Gabriel	1969	1973	RAM/PHI	2
27	Rich Gannon	2000	2002	OAK	2
28	Jeff Garcia	2000	2001	SFO	2
29	Jared Goff	2017	2018	LAR	2
30	Bob Griese*	1971	1973	MIA	2
31	Jim Kelly*	1990	1991	BUF	2
32	Dave Krieg	1988	1994	SEA/DET	2
33	Donovan McNabb	2004	2006	PHI	2
34	Scott Mitchell	1993	1995	MIA/DET	2
35	Warren Moon*	1988	1990	HOU	2
36	Craig Morton	1969	1970	DAL	2
37	Joe Namath*	1969	1972	NYJ	2
38	Carson Palmer	2005	2015	CIN/ARI	2
39	Dak Prescott	2016	2019	DAL	2
40	Ben Roethlisberger	2005	2014	PIT	2
41	Matt Ryan	2016	2018	ATL	2

IMO, He should get into the HOF eventually but I don't know about 1st ballot. 

Edited January 21, 2021 by JAF-N72EX

[biggie.]

1 hour ago, Deadpulse said:

 

G 242  AV 216  Cmp%59.4  Yds 61361  Y/A 7.3  TD 420  Int 252

 

G 244   AV 216   Cmp% 64.9   Yds 63440   Y/A 7.8   TD 421  Int 209

 

Neither of these QBs won a super bowl

One of them is in the HoF and no one would question it

The other one is being relentlessly questioned. 

Except Dan Marino consistently spent his career considered as a top 3 quarterback.

[biggie.]

1 hour ago, 43M said:

He played in an era with possibly 4 of the best QBs ever (Brady, Manning, Brees and Rodgers), who hogged up MVP most years.

And SBs are TEAM accomplishments.   Rivers had one of the most incompetent owners in football.

Anyway....not saying he WILL make it, but Id personally put him in at some point if it were up to me.  

Sorry, but Super Bowl wins are pretty big on quarterback resumes. Granted you don't NEED it, but there's a reason why most people are going to say Joe Montana was better than Dan Marino.

Rivers had plenty of talented teams to work with and he never got it done in the playoffs.

[Deadpulse]

29 minutes ago, biggie. said:

Except Dan Marino consistently spent his career considered as a top 3 quarterback.

So your argument is that Rivers had stiffer competition and still had a better career statistically than Marino? Wouldn't that be in Rivers's favor? Bad argument is bad. 

[biggie.]

15 minutes ago, Deadpulse said:

So your argument is that Rivers had stiffer competition and still had a better career statistically than Marino? Wouldn't that be in Rivers's favor? Bad argument is bad. 

Besides the fact that Marino played in a different era, you have to be a complete dumbass to even compare the two. One is one of the greatest pure passers of all time...the other was an above average.

[Leoric]

9 hours ago, Malik said:

Rivers was a very good QB for a long time. He had a quality career that most players in the NFL would be envious to have. The only thing I dislike about him is that people act like he was carrying under talented his whole career like he didn't have hall of fame teammates, all pro, and pro bowl guys his entire career outside.

It really isn’t an argument that the teams weren’t talented. It’s the argument that when you have Norv Turner and Mike McCoy as your coach... it’s hard to succeed. 

[Deadpulse]

7 hours ago, biggie. said:

Besides the fact that Marino played in a different era, you have to be a complete dumbass to even compare the two. One is one of the greatest pure passers of all time...the other was an above average.

And yet.... River's had better passing numbers. Even career completion percentage was a good bit higher. 

[biggie.]

1 hour ago, Deadpulse said:

And yet.... River's had better passing numbers. Even career completion percentage was a good bit higher. 

Learn to read and pay attention to details. Marino played in a different era. If we're going to say Rivers is better than Marino on pure stats alone, then he was better than practically every Hall of Famer.

Edited January 21, 2021 by biggie.

[Mox]

1 hour ago, Deadpulse said:

And yet.... River's had better passing numbers. Even career completion percentage was a good bit higher. 

They are more comparable than I thought but if you look through the numbers Marino was further ahead of his peers in most categories including comp%. When Marino entered the league the league average comp% was 56.9% and when he left it was 57.1%. When River started it was 59.8% and when he left it was 65.2%. Same for passer rating. League average was 75.9 when Marino came in and 77.1 when he left. Those numbers are 82.8 and 93.6 for Rivers' career. If anything, that shows how inflated passing stats have become the last 15 years.

[OkeyDoke21]

11 hours ago, Deadpulse said:

 

G 242  AV 216  Cmp%59.4  Yds 61361  Y/A 7.3  TD 420  Int 252

 

G 244   AV 216   Cmp% 64.9   Yds 63440   Y/A 7.8   TD 421  Int 209

 

Neither of these QBs won a super bowl

One of them is in the HoF and no one would question it

The other one is being relentlessly questioned. 

Context of time is also important.  One was retired from professional football while the other was in high school.

[minutemancl]

12 hours ago, Deadpulse said:

 

G 242  AV 216  Cmp%59.4  Yds 61361  Y/A 7.3  TD 420  Int 252

 

G 244   AV 216   Cmp% 64.9   Yds 63440   Y/A 7.8   TD 421  Int 209

 

Neither of these QBs won a super bowl

One of them is in the HoF and no one would question it

The other one is being relentlessly questioned. 

That's because it isn't the hall of stats. Besides ignoring the entirely different eras in which these players played, we are also not including the individual awards and records these players achieved during their careers. Marino blows Rivers out of the water in both of those categories.

Good stats and pro bowls doesn't make a QB a HOFer in this era.