Recapping the 2021 Draft (Post-Draft Talk)

[Jeremy408]

3 hours ago, reddevil said:

Mayock’s 3rd day presser was interesting. The way he answered the question about whether Gruden was at him for offensive weapons sounded like it was him leading things and Gruden offering an opinion.

Coupling this with the noise of disquiet after round 1 (plus how flat things looked in the war room at that pick), I think the suggestion that Gruden has the first rounders and then Mayock takes over later seems to have a modicum of truth to it. 

I mentioned this in another thread but the moves that the Raiders of made these last couple of years in comparison to some of the moves that was made last night made me realize some thing: The off-season moves that we make whether via draft or via free agency are very much driven by the coaches. By this I don't mean Gruden alone I mean each position coach and coordinator(it took me a while to figure out but I barely caught it this year). let me explain why:

Notice how most of the problems we have with the Raiders draft picks or Free agent signings that don’t or haven’t panned out thus far are mostly Defense. The free agents or draft picks that our offensive usually pan out(unless they get hurt or lose their mind). That’s because Gruden knows what he wants to do on offense so so they always pan out. Same thing with Tom Cable and Kolton Miller(which is actually the reason why I’m not concerned about leatherwood). Speaking of Leatherwood that also would explain why it seems like the Raiders always draft players that TV or the Internet don’t expect: because coaches don’t care about things like consensus; coaches want their guy. This I have no problem with this generally but there is a downside to it which is what I’m gonna explain that.

The problem is when you have a bad coach then giving the coach what he wants isn’t a good thing. That’s why most of our problems have been defensively even though we spent a lot of resources in that area. We allowed a defensive coordinator that’s never build a defense from scratch and is never had someone younger than 24 in the starting lineup. We had someone running a complex scheme that he didn’t create which means he doesn’t know what kind of players he needs to get in order to run it properly. 
 

that’s why it seems like now the Raiders of turned over a new leaf by drafting faster Athletic players. Like if you think about it this way do you think that if Gus Bradley we’re here from the start that we would’ve drafted Ferrell over Brian Burns or Josh Allen know because they are Leos. But instead we end up with Farrell because that Mike Zimmer style favors big defensive ends. That's not a Gruden Mayock thing that's a Paul Gunther thing.
 

That’s why I think the defense this year will be vastly improved because we're giving resources to a coach who has built two defenses in the past from scratch And has a track record for developing the talent that he’s given.

Edited May 2, 2021 by Jeremy408

[Dessie]

1 hour ago, BackinBlack said:

If we had taken Moehrig at 17, it wouldve been a 26 pick reach?

Waste of time, too much logic, you won’t get a reply on this. 

[NCOUGHMAN]

1 hour ago, BackinBlack said:

If we had taken Moehrig at 17, it wouldve been a 26 pick reach?

Why take 3 safeties I think that was kinda overkill. If I knew we’d get gill and Deablo no need for moe 

[BackinBlack]

4 minutes ago, Dessie said:

Waste of time, too much logic, you won’t get a reply on this. 

lol it is funny how we determine reaches.

I fully admit I was furious with Alex at the time, but seeing both Jok and Moehrig available after round 1 (who i wouldve taken), put me back in my place. LOL

[BackinBlack]

1 minute ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Why take 3 safeties I think that was kinda overkill. If I knew we’d get gill and Deablo no need for moe 

Hmm, do you think Gruden and Mayock knew how the later rounds would play out?
Do we not all call for BPA?

[oakdb36]

3 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Why take 3 safeties I think that was kinda overkill. If I knew we’d get gill and Deablo no need for moe 

Deablo is playing LB.

[BayRaider]

1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

A few people had Leatherwood mocked in the 1st round the day of the draft. I didn't love the pick but I'm okay with it now. At 6'5" 315 with 34.5" arms and elite athleticism, I think Leatherwood will be a good starting OT for us. He was a 3 year starter at Alabama and was the Outland Trophy winner and an All-American in his senior year there. 

 

40 Times, RAS Scores, and Next Gen Athletic scores are all bogus this year and 100% inaccurate and over-inflated because they are based on Pro Days and not the combine. 

[BayRaider]

1 hour ago, BackinBlack said:

If we had taken Moehrig at 17, it wouldve been a 26 pick reach?

I’m not sure I understand you. Moehrig was a graded 1st Rounder by every website. Just because he fell to the 2nd doesn’t mean he’s a 2nd Round talent. That would mean everyone got taken at their exact spot in the draft by that logic. Moehrig likely fell because of some minor medical issues that teams didn’t have time to look into on such short notice, but Mayock looked fully into it.

[Dessie]

14 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

lol it is funny how we determine reaches.

I fully admit I was furious with Alex at the time, but seeing both Jok and Moehrig available after round 1 (who i wouldve taken), put me back in my place. LOL

Felt exactly the same! 😂

[BayRaider]

@BackinBlack Seriously though, that logic makes no sense. That means just because a team takes someone in the 1st Round, they are a 1st Round Talent, and if they go in the 2nd Round, they are a 2nd Round Talent.

No, it doesn’t work that way. Tytus Howard was a 3rd Round Talent and 31 other teams laughed their butt off at the Texans. And Arnette and Leatherwood were Mid 2nd Round Talents at best. 

Edited May 2, 2021 by BayRaider

[Humble_Beast]

g

2 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Grades for each pick. 

17 - Alex Leatherwood | OT | Alabama: B

Definitely a reach based on the media's rankings but Leatherwood was one of the most athletic OT's in the draft and a 4 year starter at Alabama. I hated the pick but after having some time to watch some more tape of him I think that he'll be a plug and play starter with the athletic tools to be a very good RT going forward. 

43 - Trevon Moehrig | FS | TCU: A+

The best safety in the draft and a great value pick near the top of the second round. I love that Gruden and Mayock were willing to get aggressive and move up ahead of Dallas to land their guy. Moehrig projects as a plug and play starter that should be a leader and playmaker in our secondary for years to come. 

79 - Malcolm Koonce | Edge | Buffalo: B+

Teams seemed to be higher than Koonce than the media and truthfully I didn't know much about him before the draft. But as I've consistently said before the draft you can never have too many pass rusher and Koonce is a long, twitchy, edge rusher with bend that should be able to help us from day one as a rotational pass rusher. 

80 - Divine Deablo | LB/S | Virginia Tech: C 

Deablo is another guy that I wasn't too familiar with during the pre draft process but watching his tape he looks very similar to Kam Chancellor when he came out of Virginia Tech. Deablo looks like a guy that can make some plays but this kind of reminds me of the Muse pick last year as we're projecting a guy who was a former WR/SS as a LB at the next level. I think there's some upside here but we'll see.

143 - Tyree Gillespie | S | Missouri: B-

Gillespie is a versatile safety that spent a ton of time in single high as well as in the box during his time at Missouri. I think he projects as a nice third safety going forward because of his versatility but that this pick also signals how we feel about Abram going forward. Overall I like the pick because we've needed safety help for almost a decade now but I also think we had other needs that could've been addressed here. 

167 - Nate Hobbs | CB | Illinois: B

The Raiders clearly wanted to address the defense, particularly the secondary, and I think Hobbs was a decent value pick at this point in the draft. He graded out as one of the most athletic CB's to come into the draft in the last two decades, was a multi-year starter in the Big Ten, has played in a similar scheme, and has played both slot CB and on the outside. His stats in coverage weren't great last year but he definitely has the athletic profile and versatility to make the roster. 

230 - Jimmy Morrissey | C | Pitt: D

With as much as the staff has praised Andre James as the savior of the OL going forward this pick was just a little weird to me. Nick Martin projects as a solid veteran backup and if the staff really believes that James is a guy, like they signaled with his extension, do we really have a need for 3 centers? I would've preferred to use the pick on a guy at a premium position with some upside. 

I agree with most of this, but I'm just higher on on Deablo. I get why people are cynical to another LB convert after Muse. It's obvious Muse has straight line speed but no wiggle, but Deablo has that wiggle. really high on the kid

[BackinBlack]

24 minutes ago, BayRaider said:

@BackinBlack Seriously though, that logic makes no sense. That means just because a team takes someone in the 1st Round, they are a 1st Round Talent, and if they go in the 2nd Round, they are a 2nd Round Talent.

No, it doesn’t work that way. Tytus Howard was a 3rd Round Talent and 31 other teams laughed their butt off at the Texans. And Arnette and Leatherwood were Mid 2nd Round Talents at best. 

I guess my thought / thinking is that the media maybe wasn’t as informed this year because of covid restrictions. 
a lot of the media ‘first round talent ‘ fell out of the first. 
I think that’s because nfl GMs boards were different from the media’s. 

it was a reach by the media. 
trevon Moehrig would not have been a reach by the media. 

but two teams took safeties before we did, so could argue Moehrig was seen as the 3rd best safety.

just like way back in the day, media thought Bruce Campbell was going in the 1st, he wouldn’t have been seen as a reach in the 2nd, and we got him in the 4th IIRc. 

sometimes the media’s rankings don’t align.

[BackinBlack]

Also when you factor in the run on OTs after we drafted Alex, it proves even more that He likely wouldn’t of been available by our 2nd round pick.

[MrOaktown_56]

I prefer our defensive picks with Bradley's staff (richard smith, milus, etc.)

Also, a nice thread on matt bushman. Probably a PS guy this year, but could be TE3 in the years to come.

 

[Jeremy408]

4 hours ago, NYRaider said:

A few people had Leatherwood mocked in the 1st round the day of the draft. I didn't love the pick but I'm okay with it now. At 6'5" 315 with 34.5" arms and elite athleticism, I think Leatherwood will be a good starting OT for us. He was a 3 year starter at Alabama and was the Outland Trophy winner and an All-American in his senior year there. 

 

here is his video profile Per nfl.com:

https://www.nfl.com/videos/2021-nfl-draft-breaking-down-alex-leatherwood-s-college-highlights

They saw him as a first round pick(if you care about that sort of thing