Let's Talk GM/Ryan Pace

[Sugashane]

1 hour ago, The_Romen said:

Fire up the rumor mill.

Fangio eats babies, Toub kicks all of his players during warm ups.

Let's get em to Halas Hall.

This is the type of cancel culture I can really get into. Watch your back Rodgers.

 

23 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

Fangio deciding to go with Bridgewater as his QB on a good roster was stupid.

Bridgewater is bad.  Really bad.

Bridgewater seems like a great guy and a crap QB to have as a starter. IDK if Fangio thought he was going to get his team to match up to the 2000 Ravens or what but its odd we have two back ups that cost more than Bridewater. While that means Pace and Nagy overestimated the worth of Dalton and Foles it also shows that DEN really overestimated what they were getting out of a $4.5 mil free agent. Surprised Paton and Elway would think this would work.

[dll2000]

1 hour ago, Sugashane said:

This is the type of cancel culture I can really get into. Watch your back Rodgers.

 

Bridgewater seems like a great guy and a crap QB to have as a starter. IDK if Fangio thought he was going to get his team to match up to the 2000 Ravens or what but its odd we have two back ups that cost more than Bridewater. While that means Pace and Nagy overestimated the worth of Dalton and Foles it also shows that DEN really overestimated what they were getting out of a $4.5 mil free agent. Surprised Paton and Elway would think this would work.

Ravens and '85 Bears and Tampa Bucs formula requires a great running game to compliment. Too many new penalties that can be called on a defense now for that to ever work again anyway.  You can score off flags alone.  

Fangio thought he could win with a game manager who didn't turn it over.   Backward thinking.  He should have drafted Fields and begged for extra time to develop him. 

 

[Sugashane]

6 hours ago, dll2000 said:

Ravens and '85 Bears and Tampa Bucs formula requires a great running game to compliment. Too many new penalties that can be called on a defense now for that to ever work again anyway.  You can score off flags alone.  

Fangio thought he could win with a game manager who didn't turn it over.   Backward thinking.  He should have drafted Fields and begged for extra time to develop him. 

Agreed, but I also think he was sure he could get his hands on Rodgers too. Otherwise I see no reason for him to pass on a QB. 

[dll2000]

12 hours ago, Sugashane said:

Agreed, but I also think he was sure he could get his hands on Rodgers too. Otherwise I see no reason for him to pass on a QB. 

 I believe he would have wanted Rodgers, but he had a draft day deadline to get that done and didn’t.  

He made a free choice to go with top draft corner and Bridgewater and roll. 

[Madmike90]

https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/bears/ct-cb-chicago-bears-brad-biggs-10-thoughts-20211221-rxz7gfm7djdtjio62ku5oplzh4-story.html

Here’s a look at the list of the Bears’ top cap figures this season and their contract status:

• Allen Robinson: $17.98M, unrestricted free agent
• Khalil Mack, $14.65M*, signed through 2024
• Akiem Hicks, $12M, unrestricted free agent
• Robert Quinn, $11.29M*, signed through 2024
• Eddie Goldman, $7.8M, signed through 2023
• Nick Foles, $6.67M, signed through 2022
• Roquan Smith, $6.05M, – signed through 2022
• Jimmy Graham, $5.34M*, unrestricted free agent
• Cody Whitehair, $5.2M*, signed through 2024
• Eddie Jackson, $5.09M*, signed through 2024
• Andy Dalton, $5M, unrestricted free agent
• Danny Trevathan, $5M, signed through 2022

Italics denotes player is on injured reserve, * denotes the team restructured the contract in 2021 to lower the cap hit to this figure and push more money into future years

That list is why Ryan Pace shouldn't be our GM next year...and this list of next years' cap figures is why he probably should have been out before even now...

• Khalil Mack: $30.12 million
• Robert Quinn: $17.1 million
• Eddie Jackson: $15.1 million
• Cody Whitehair: $12.3 million
• Eddie Goldman: $11.8 million
• Nick Foles: $10.7 million
• Roquan Smith: $9.7 million
• Danny Trevathan: $5.9 million
• Tarik Cohen: $5.8 million
• Andy Dalton: $5 million

Edited December 22, 2021 by Madmike90

[beardown3231]

1 hour ago, Madmike90 said:

https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/bears/ct-cb-chicago-bears-brad-biggs-10-thoughts-20211221-rxz7gfm7djdtjio62ku5oplzh4-story.html

Here’s a look at the list of the Bears’ top cap figures this season and their contract status:

• Allen Robinson: $17.98M, unrestricted free agent
• Khalil Mack, $14.65M*, signed through 2024
• Akiem Hicks, $12M, unrestricted free agent
• Robert Quinn, $11.29M*, signed through 2024
• Eddie Goldman, $7.8M, signed through 2023
• Nick Foles, $6.67M, signed through 2022
• Roquan Smith, $6.05M, – signed through 2022
• Jimmy Graham, $5.34M*, unrestricted free agent
• Cody Whitehair, $5.2M*, signed through 2024
• Eddie Jackson, $5.09M*, signed through 2024
• Andy Dalton, $5M, unrestricted free agent
• Danny Trevathan, $5M, signed through 2022

Italics denotes player is on injured reserve, * denotes the team restructured the contract in 2021 to lower the cap hit to this figure and push more money into future years

That list is why Ryan Pace shouldn't be our GM next year...and this list of next years' cap figures is why he probably should have been out before even now...

• Khalil Mack: $30.12 million
• Robert Quinn: $17.1 million
• Eddie Jackson: $15.1 million
• Cody Whitehair: $12.3 million
• Eddie Goldman: $11.8 million
• Nick Foles: $10.7 million
• Roquan Smith: $9.7 million
• Danny Trevathan: $5.9 million
• Tarik Cohen: $5.8 million
• Andy Dalton: $5 million

Not sure lumping Quinn, Mack and Smith into the bottom category is fair. They are arguably the 3 best players on the team. They are 3 really good players

But yes, the rest of the list is a disaster. f*** Ryan Pace

[WindyCity]

I am glad we all got to the same place.

His management of the roster and salary cap has been a disaster.

[beardown3231]

17 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

I am glad we all got to the same place.

His management of the roster and salary cap has been a disaster.

Hopefully they remember us as the ones who blazed the trail

[dll2000]

Going back to 2016 I have a huge gripe with Pace's draft.  He screwed the pooch on that one.

This is not hindsight because I played a GM draft game that year and heavily scouted that class.   More so than I did any other year.

He traded up for Floyd.  Up.  For an off ball LB.   Which is low positional value.   Then he made it even lower by changing his position to edge which he is not his best position.   Giving up a 4th rounder.

What is more he did this with known at time really good football players on the board:

1) Tunsil was thought of by many to be best prospect in the draft.   He didn't turn out to be that good, but he is a fine player at a high value position and Miami ended up trading him for a boat load of high picks.   Even in 2016 few people were caring about pot any more.   That was stupid.  I was targeting Conklin pre-draft - but would have been really happy with Tunsil.    

2) Chris Jones - was to me an easy choice to be a pro bowl 3 tech.   A monster of a man and athlete.   Really hard to bust on a guy with this size and speed and tape.    What's more is many people had him as 2nd rounder.   To me he was clearly first round value (I got him in my draft in 2nd).   Pace could have traded down and still got a high first value in this guy.

3) Xavien Howard was easily a first round corner based on college tape and another player who was overlooked and could have been traded down for.  

4) Austin Hooper was a 2nd round caliber TE who people were overlooking and fell to 3rd.   (I got him in my draft in 3rd).

5) Tyreek Hill - another character concern so I can excuse this.   But his tape had him as a 2nd rounder at least just as an athlete and he well over exceeded that in his career.    Problem was he beat his GF or something.   You could have drafted him in later rounds and cut him if he did something stupid.   Just like KC did.   Another case of Bears not taking the necessary chances and risks to win.  

To me the greater risks are guys who aren't coachable, stupid, don't work hard, are emotionally/mentally unstable, radical activists or quitters.  

I think everyone should get one strike on an emotional GF/BF physical altercation when young.  

 

 

 

 

 

[dll2000]

4 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

Going back to 2016 I have a huge gripe with Pace's draft.  He screwed the pooch on that one.

This is not hindsight because I played a GM draft game that year and heavily scouted that class.   More so than I did any other year.

He traded up for Floyd.  Up.  For an off ball LB.   Which is low positional value.   Then he made it even lower by changing his position to edge which he is not his best position.   Giving up a 4th rounder.

What is more he did this with known at time really good football players on the board:

1) Tunsil was thought of by many to be best prospect in the draft.   He didn't turn out to be that good, but he is a fine player at a high value position and Miami ended up trading him for a boat load of high picks.   Even in 2016 few people were caring about pot any more.   That was stupid.  I was targeting Conklin pre-draft - but would have been really happy with Tunsil.    

2) Chris Jones - was to me an easy choice to be a pro bowl 3 tech.   A monster of a man and athlete.   Really hard to bust on a guy with this size and speed and tape.    What's more is many people had him as 2nd rounder.   To me he was clearly first round value (I got him in my draft in 2nd).   Pace could have traded down and still got a high first value in this guy.

3) Xavien Howard was easily a first round corner based on college tape and another player who was overlooked and could have been traded down for.  

4) Austin Hooper was a 2nd round caliber TE who people were overlooking and fell to 3rd.   (I got him in my draft in 3rd).

5) Tyreek Hill - another character concern so I can excuse this.   But his tape had him as a 2nd rounder at least just as an athlete and he well over exceeded that in his career.    Problem was he beat his GF or something.   You could have drafted him in later rounds and cut him if he did something stupid.   Just like KC did.   Another case of Bears not taking the necessary chances and risks to win.  

To me the greater risks are guys who aren't coachable, stupid, don't work hard, are emotionally/mentally unstable, radical activists or quitters.  

I think everyone should get one strike on an emotional GF/BF physical altercation when young.  

 

 

 

 

 

A lot of KC success is tied to Jones and Hill from this draft.   Not just Mahomes in 2017.   They have been key and KC would be much worse without them.  No super bowls.   

Imagine if Pace had played this board and picked up Tunsil, Jones and Hill.  Whole different team now. 

Or maybe not.   If its Bears they probably give up on Tunsil after he looks bad early and he flames out.   

 Jones they  play at edge or NT and get frustrated with him.   They move Hill to CB and cut him after 3 years.

 

[WindyCity]

36 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

Hopefully they remember us as the ones who blazed the trail

I was always saving space on the bus for everyone.

[dll2000]

50 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

Hopefully they remember us as the ones who blazed the trail

@WindyCity

You guys were on it early.   

I soured on Nagy after I went to a practice in 2019 which I thought was going to be a big year after 2018.

Pace while I didn't agree with what he was doing, I could see the logic in a lot of it.   

In an early interview he said he was going to target QB, Edge, Ball Hawking safety, OT and CB.   He was going to build teams around that philosophy and put resources into getting those positions right.     That really sold me on him because I agreed with it 100%.   Still do.

Then he didn't implement it.  At all.   But I had to believe he believed it, since he was one who said it.   That wasn't even the question - he just started talking about it.   I am not sure why.    

I wanted to give him more of a learning curve to get better.   But he never did.   Until this year.  But its too little, too late.

He should have been fired last off season.  He had a fair shake.  

 

[Sugashane]

8 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

@WindyCity

You guys were on it early.   

I soured on Nagy after I went to a practice in 2019 which I thought was going to be a big year after 2018.

Pace while I didn't agree with what he was doing, I could see the logic in a lot of it.   

In an early interview he said he was going to target QB, Edge, Ball Hawking safety, OT and CB.   He was going to build teams around that philosophy and put resources into getting those positions right.     That really sold me on him because I agreed with it 100%.   Still do.

Then he didn't implement it.  At all.   But I had to believe he believed it, since he was one who said it.   That wasn't even the question - he just started talking about it.   I am not sure why.    

I wanted to give him more of a learning curve to get better.   But he never did.   Until this year.  But its too little, too late.

He should have been fired last off season.  He had a fair shake.  

 

The Be the GM game was fun. I haven't done nearly the digging over the last 2-3 years though, this year being by far the worst. This upcoming draft I'm going to really suck   lol

I soured on Nagy's playcalling early, the first game he had a big gain to Gabriel then lost 6 yards total on 4 more screens. Thought he would learn and improve since he only had a few games experience as a playcaller but he never really did.  Here and on another forum I mentioned how he was a mediocre playcaller. Pace I got the swings he took for a lot of the time but I've complained about a lack at attacking at OT specifically. To me you could settle for Leno or Massie, not do both. He lack of attention to OT in the draft forced his hand to re-sign both.

Pace may have learned a bit from this last draft but Nagy seems to have somehow gotten worse. His players regress the longer they are with him, and while not all of our issues are his fault a LOT stem from him allowing mishaps to constantly happen in practice and not correcting it  - or enforcing it. Leno and Massie - I think @JAF-N72EX mentioned? - appear to be doing better after leaving here (besides Leno ending Fitzpatrick's season early on). That may just be proof of how terrible Castillo and Nagy are with their OLs. As an OL coach the dead body flops Leno did while trying to cut would be my screensaver on the projection screen to shame him for that lack of effort. Clearly something changed when he left this team and hopefully we don't ruin Jenkins or Borom by infecting them with the acceptance of mediocrity.

As for Tunsil, I doubt they give up on him, Mustipher was average at his best last year and garbage this year and still has not had competition or consequence. Nagy's lack of balls would have worked out in our favor once at least.

[WindyCity]

Pace built a middle tier roster with QB issues, hopefully solved now, and the torpedoed his flawed roster with a terrible HC hire.

[BACK2MACKSACK]

I wanted to remain skeptical but it's finally time for Pace to go.

From the looks of it we have a mediocre roster without any real cornerstone players that we've had during the Urlacher regime. Aside from Roquan Smith, are there any players on our team that we've drafted that are flat out studs? Before we had players like Urlacher, Tommie Harris, Lance Briggs, Mike Brown, and Charles Tillman that we've drafted on defense. We've also never drafted any players of the caliber of Jeffery and Matt Forte on offense. I'm talking about playmakers that can get Touchdowns. Mooney does look pretty good though but that's just a small blip on the radar.

Pace has been extremely careless with our draft capital in order to field a mediocre team. He is good with his mid round draft picks but we've simply need more. Even though I think Fields can be good with the right coaching changes, the amount of first round draft picks he's given away is too much. We could've used these picks to infuse some talented youth into our team on either offense and defense.

He has been able to acquire some good players in Free Agency like Quinn, Trevethan, Hicks, and A-Rob but it's simply not good enough.

List of blunders: Kevin White, Leonard Floyd, Adam Shaheen, Mitchell Trubisky (finding a QB is hard but you definitely don't need to trade up to make this move), method of acquiring Justin Fields (giving away a 2022 high 1st round draft pick is a tough pill to swallow).

On a positive note, you can say that he is improving on the picks but he's left us in such a crippling position to build a strong contender. At times he has picked solid players but no real franchise cornerstones aside from Roquan and maybe Eddie Jackson if he could be more consistent.

Ryan Pace has no idea what the value of a high end draft pick and has been too casual in trading away high end draft capital.