Bears Hire Ryan Poles as GM & Matt Eberflus as HC

[soulman]

1 hour ago, topwop1 said:

Yes this is absolutely true but we can't keep harping on it. It is what it is unfortunately.

That's why these numbnuts probably need to just hire the best big name candidate there is that's willing to accept the job.

That's likely the only way they're ever going to get this right as opposed to hiring these no name guys that aren't on anyone's radar

I dunno if it's so much harping as it is like ya' gotta take the car outta park if you wanna drive it.

The Bears have been stuck in park for over 30 years.  GMcC and Teddy Bears can't fix them and the McCaskeys won't sell or put Teddy in a corner somewhere he can be seen but not heard.

It gets to the point where it all seems hopeless and at the same time fruitless to talk about expecting any meaningful changes that will alter the course this team has been on for over 30 years.

It's like having a car where you no sooner fix one major problem when something else breaks down.  The best solution for that is usually to sell it or trade it in for a different car but in this case that won't happen either.

As you can probably tell.  My apathy is in full bloom again.  I don't much care what they do.

Edited November 23, 2021 by soulman

[topwop1]

1 hour ago, Sugashane said:

Make Peyton Manning President of Football Ops and let his reputation be what helps attract people. 

 

Sounds like a joke to some I'm sure but I'd love a cerebral legend like him or Brees be involved. 

This or just hire a damn good GM & HC. I don't care how they do it, just do it!

[topwop1]

I have a feeling the Bears are going to make a hard push to get Jim Harbaugh out of Michigan. 

Say what you want about him but I just think that's the guy they will target.

I personally would welcome it. He knows the city well, played for the team, has had success as an NFL HC and with a QB similar in skill set to Fields with Kap.

I just think after all these recent failures they're going to want to make a big splash/big name hire.

[abstract_thought]

If Bears are offering a Team President position, maybe that helps attract an experienced GM in a bad situation?

Edited November 23, 2021 by abstract_thought

[Sugashane]

2 hours ago, topwop1 said:

This or just hire a damn good GM & HC. I don't care how they do it, just do it!

Same, I just don't think they have the actual chops to make such a choice. I'd trust a number of posters here far before them for this decision - and we make NOTHING for our "work" and research.

 

2 hours ago, abstract_thought said:

If Bears are offering a Team President position, maybe that helps attract an experienced GM in a bad situation?

That's why I throw it out there. The FO tried to use a bunch of OTHER OWNERS (you know, the goddamn competition) to decide on the next big decision. They brought in a football guy in Accorsi to consult and we got stuck with Pace and Fox (who I still believe was the sacrificial lamb). That didn't flop as bad as it did with him helping DET not long after in their GM search as he had a 42% win percentage under him. IDK that they can just throw money at a consultant and then hope he made the right choice, I'd rather a person have their reputation at stake.

Putting a high profile NFL legend like Manning there means instant credibility, but I'd be extremely pleased to have Rick Smith there too. Gives you a known commodity/name to attract high profile GMs and coaches. It might give another level head to re-align a GM who gets too focused on one position or problem (you think Manning allows is to settle for Leno and Massie with no investment or even competition for them? Hell no, he'd be pissed as a player and would treat it that way as an operations guy). I understand the argument about having too many chefs in the kitchen, or if I'm the one cooking the meal then I want to pick the ingredients but an organization usually needs to have clearly defined roles, delegated tasks, and someone to ensure it is running smoothly. It is the same as the CEO, COO, CFO, Practice Manager system really.

President - oversees all general operations, enforces communications between all levels and sets goals for each group

GM - makes final decisions on draft picks, FAs, re-signings, and staff hiring.

HC - dictates practices and gameday decisions, communicates roles for systems that need filled or backed up, gives GM his input on player values, positional needs, etc.

 

I know for sure having Manning wouldn't deter a good GM or HC, but could very well deter a weak or egomaniac that demands too much power.

[Sugashane]

2 hours ago, topwop1 said:

I have a feeling the Bears are going to make a hard push to get Jim Harbaugh out of Michigan. 

Say what you want about him but I just think that's the guy they will target.

I personally would welcome it. He knows the city well, played for the team, has had success as an NFL HC and with a QB similar in skill set to Fields with Kap.

I just think after all these recent failures they're going to want to make a big splash/big name hire.

I'd be a bit let down but I could definitely roll with that but I'd have some concerns. He has had a winning season in all but last year but he has lost all but his first bowl game. After all his time there and being thought of as a QB whisperer of sorts his best QB has been Shea Patterson. I mean really? The best you can do is get a guy to become an UFA that ends up in the CFL?

Hell maybe we offer him the GM role and give Greg Roman the HC gig. Actually I'm not against that very much. 

[Madmike90]

9 hours ago, soulman said:

Yup, and if it helps you just keep whistling that merry tune Mike.  But you're over looking the fact that we're most unlikely to be able to offer the right package that would attract anyone.   Ours seems to include Ted Phillips and McCaskey ownership.

I think you are massively under valuing this franchise & market...we will be one of the two biggest jobs out there is offseason.

[soulman]

44 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

I think you are massively under valuing this franchise & market...we will be one of the two biggest jobs out there is offseason.

So big that in the past decade it's attracted GMs like Phil Emery and Ryan Pace?

So big it's also attracted such coaching luminaries as Marc Trestman, John Fox, and Matt Nagy?

My question is do those interested really have the capability of assembling winning football teams or are they just looking for a top position anywhere they can get hired for one?  Look at the facts Mike, not the worn out old fantasies of working for an heirloom franchise that's been mismanaged and ignored so long the weeds hide it's winning past and walls are crumbling around the Halas heirs who have so disrespected the memory of GSH for so long they should hang their heads in shame then be hung in effigy. 

The McCaskeys have destroyed all of the Chicago Bears legends.

Edited November 23, 2021 by soulman

[Madmike90]

3 minutes ago, soulman said:

So big that in the past decade it's attracted GMs like Phil Emery and Ryan Pace?

So big it's also attracted such coaching luminaries as Marc Trestman, John Fox, and Matt Nagy?

My question is do those interested really have the capability of assembling winning football teams or are they just looking for a top position anywhere they can get hired for one?  Look at the facts Mike, not the worn out old fantasies of working for an heirloom franchise that's been mismanaged and ignored so long the weeds hide it's winning past and walls are crumbling around the Halas heirs who have so disrespected the memory of GSH for so long they should hang their heads in shame then be hung in effigy. 

The McCaskeys have destroyed all of the Chicago Bears legends.

This is purely revisionist thinking...at the time Pace was one of the hot names out there...Nagy was the hottest name of the cycle and was all set to go to Indy before we took him away...it hasn't worked out...but don't think for a second we don't have the drawing power to get a top candidate.  

[soulman]

6 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

This is purely revisionist thinking...at the time Pace was one of the hot names out there...Nagy was the hottest name of the cycle and was all set to go to Indy before we took him away...it hasn't worked out...but don't think for a second we don't have the drawing power to get a top candidate.  

Mike you live in an imaginary world.  Pace was not a top GM prospect but he was an up and coming respected personnel guy in NOLA.  Much like both JA and Phil Emery before him he came up through the scouting staff and was essentially a high ranking scout much like our Champ Kelly.

Matt Nagy was one of a half dozen top HC prospects.  We interviewed quite a few others as well including Frank Reich I believe who now helping rebuild Indy.  John DeFilippo our QB coach was also among those on the list that year as was Josh McDaniel.  There are always a half dozen or so "hot prospects".  The media sells it that way.

Revisionist?  Mike, how long you been following the Bears as closely as I have?  I can probably name every starter on the Bears '63 Championship Team.  That's how long I've been around Bears football.  I'm giving you facts as I have watched them unfold for over 50 years now. 

To be completely honest even the Bears of 50 years ago were not a highly sought after HC gig or guys like George Allen wouldn't have left because there was no upside to staying.  Halas retired and who did we get back to back?  Jim Dooley and Abe Gibron.  Look up their records.

Jack Pardee began to turn the team around in the mid '70s then left Chicago to take the same HC job with Washington.  Then came Neill Armstrong and 4 seasons about like Matt Nagy's. So who did GSH finally turn to?  Does anyone here believe that Mike Ditka was a hot HC prospect before he was hired?  He was the STC Coordinator for Tom Landry in Dallas.

You wanna know who was the hottest of hot prospects of all?  Dave Wannstadt who was Jimmy Johnson's DC during their SB years.  Look up his W/L record along with some of his personnel decisions.  Lovie Smith had only been a DC for two years before we hired him and shocked a whole lot of people who said "who"?

Doesn't it strike you as even mildly odd that the ONLY two winning HC we've had since 1981 are Mike Ditka and Lovie Smith and neither was a hot prospect.  Collectively the rest all have losing records.  Why didn't Bill Parcells ever coach the Bears.  Why didn't we hire all of those top guys who were beating a path to our door?  Why?  Because they weren't.  They were smart.

Revisionists who were never there to begin with often change facts to suit their story.  I was there for all of it Mike even living in Green Bay during the Lombardi Era and the fall from grace that followed.  In the '70s GB and the Bears battled for last place in the NFCN.  Neither team had a good HC or players.  So one thing I am not is a revisionist.  If you were there you'd know that too.

[Madmike90]

4 minutes ago, soulman said:

Mike you live in an imaginary world.  Pace was not a top GM prospect but he was an up and coming respected personnel guy in NOLA.  Much like both JA and Phil Emery before him he came up through the scouting staff and was essentially a high ranking scout much like our Champ Kelly.

Matt Nagy was one of a half dozen top HC prospects.  We interviewed quite a few others as well including Frank Reich I believe who now helping rebuild Indy.  John DeFilippo our QB coach was also among those on the list that year as was Josh McDaniel.  There are always a half dozen or so "hot prospects".  The media sells it that way.

Revisionist?  Mike, how long you been following the Bears as closely as I have?  I can probably name every starter on the Bears '63 Championship Team.  That's how long I've been around Bears football.  I'm giving you facts as I have watched them unfold for over 50 years now. 

To be completely honest even the Bears of 50 years ago were not a highly sought after HC gig or guys like George Allen wouldn't have left because there was no upside to staying.  Halas retired and who did we get back to back?  Jim Dooley and Abe Gibron.  Look up their records.

Jack Pardee began to turn the team around in the mid '70s then left Chicago to take the same HC job with Washington.  Then came Neill Armstrong and 4 seasons about like Matt Nagy's. So who did GSH finally turn to?  Does anyone here believe that Mike Ditka was a hot HC prospect before he was hired?  He was the STC Coordinator for Tom Landry in Dallas.

You wanna know who was the hottest of hot prospects of all?  Dave Wannstadt who was Jimmy Johnson's DC during their SB years.  Look up his W/L record along with some of his personnel decisions.  Lovie Smith had only been a DC for two years before we hired him and shocked a whole lot of people who said "who"?

Doesn't it strike you as even mildly odd that the ONLY two winning HC we've had since 1981 are Mike Ditka and Lovie Smith and neither was a hot prospect.  Collectively the rest all have losing records.  Why didn't Bill Parcells ever coach the Bears.  Why didn't we hire all of those top guys who were beating a path to our door?  Why?  Because they weren't.  They were smart.

Revisionists who were never there to begin with often change facts to suit their story.  I was there for all of it Mike even living in Green Bay during the Lombardi Era and the fall from grace that followed.  In the '70s GB and the Bears battled for last place in the NFCN.  Neither team had a good HC or players.  So one thing I am not is a revisionist.  If you were there you'd know that too.

Unfortunately your wrong again...no one was hotter than Nagy in that cycle and I don't remember a single person thinking we hadn't hired a top candidate in Nagy...

Again economics say this along with the Giants job will be the biggest jobs out there...the 2nd biggest sporting market in America and you think we can't draw the best candidates? That is crazy talk...you can go over irrelevant history from 50 years ago but it doesn't change the fact that we are capable of attracting the biggest names...we just need to pick the right candidate who will actually work out when he doesn't have Fangio holding him up.

[soulman]

1 minute ago, Madmike90 said:

Unfortunately your wrong again...no one was hotter than Nagy in that cycle and I don't remember a single person thinking we hadn't hired a top candidate in Nagy...

Again economics say this along with the Giants job will be the biggest jobs out there...the 2nd biggest sporting market in America and you think we can't draw the best candidates? That is crazy talk...you can go over irrelevant history from 50 years ago but it doesn't change the fact that we are capable of attracting the biggest names...we just need to pick the right candidate who will actually work out when he doesn't have Fangio holding him up.

OK, now this debate will come to an end as well.

"There ain't no good guys, there ain't no bad guys, there's only you and me and we just disagree."

^^^^With many thanks and credit to an old jam partner, Jimmy Krueger.^^^^

[dll2000]

QBs emerge in college football.   They are essentially kids.   You can't predict strength of a class unless an awesome JR. stays a year like Manning.   Sometimes when you think it is weak, it is strong.   Mahomes, Watson and Trubisky were supposed to be worst class in a generation.   If Watson didn't make goofball off field decisions he would be a top 4 QB right now.   We may never know how good Trubisky could have been with a different coach.   Not great likely, but maybe good and not a bust.  

Even then you can't predict you will out maneuver someone else to get your QB unless you are so bad you have number 1 overall pick.  

I have never really heard McDaniels speak or spoken to him.  

There is a ton of due diligence and information I do not have and no fan has really, but that being said:

1) I don't trust the media or their opinions.   They are an incestuous groupthink mob that hires only their own for most part and their opinion can be bought.   That being said their universal hatred for McDaniels moves me not at all.  It could be right or wrong, but I reserve opinion on it.   

2) My opinion on McDaniels is based on circumstantial evidence and tid bits I hear from people who know him personally and worked with him.    

3) Kraft values him highly. 

4) Brady values him highly.

5) Belichick values him highly.

6) Michael Lombardi values him highly.   I don't like Lombardi, but I have to concede, while he has some opinions I don't agree with, he makes some really good points on several football topics mostly in relation to coaching and team building philosophies.

He says McDaniels has huge breadth of knowledge.  Which is what I am looking for in a head coach.  I don't want a specialist.   I want a guy who has been there done that and has knowledge to solve schematic problems without flailing about.     I don't want a hot cooridinator who did good for a year.   

I want a guy who worked under a master for a long time and actually picked up some things.  Nagy looked to maybe be that guy, but obviously wasn't.   

Is McDaniels that guy?  I honestly don't really know without being able to do my own due diligence.   He has a good resume from 10,000 foot fan view.

All this is so much ink anyway.   Like @RunningVaccssaid.  Bears aren't hiring McDaniels IMO.  

But I never thought they would draft Fields either.   Stranger things have happened.

I think if they do hire McDaniels you have to give him room to do his thing and let him ride through media and player hate/rebellion, if any, and not get scared and bail on him.

To hire him without power is to waste your time.   Now if McDaniels is smart he will not hire a yes man like Gruden did in Mayock (presumably we don't really know what happened behind closed doors).

  He will hire a guy who will argue with him and fight him and whom opinion he respects and can sway him from time to time.   A dictator who surrounds himself with yes men is a fool.   

 

[Madmike90]

14 minutes ago, dll2000 said:

QBs emerge in college football.   They are essentially kids.   You can't predict strength of a class unless an awesome JR. stays a year like Manning.   Sometimes when you think it is weak, it is strong.   Mahomes, Watson and Trubisky were supposed to be worst class in a generation.   If Watson didn't make goofball off field decisions he would be a top 4 QB right now.   We may never know how good Trubisky could have been with a different coach.   Not great likely, but maybe good and not a bust.  

Even then you can't predict you will out maneuver someone else to get your QB unless you are so bad you have number 1 overall pick.  

I have never really heard McDaniels speak or spoken to him.  

There is a ton of due diligence and information I do not have and no fan has really, but that being said:

1) I don't trust the media or their opinions.   They are an incestuous groupthink mob that hires only their own for most part and their opinion can be bought.   That being said their universal hatred for McDaniels moves me not at all.  It could be right or wrong, but I reserve opinion on it.   

2) My opinion on McDaniels is based on circumstantial evidence and tid bits I hear from people who know him personally and worked with him.    

3) Kraft values him highly. 

4) Brady values him highly.

5) Belichick values him highly.

6) Michael Lombardi values him highly.   I don't like Lombardi, but I have to concede, while he has some opinions I don't agree with, he makes some really good points on several football topics mostly in relation to coaching and team building philosophies.

He says McDaniels has huge breadth of knowledge.  Which is what I am looking for in a head coach.  I don't want a specialist.   I want a guy who has been there done that and has knowledge to solve schematic problems without flailing about.     I don't want a hot cooridinator who did good for a year.   

I want a guy who worked under a master for a long time and actually picked up some things.  Nagy looked to maybe be that guy, but obviously wasn't.   

Is McDaniels that guy?  I honestly don't really know without being able to do my own due diligence.   He has a good resume from 10,000 foot fan view.

All this is so much ink anyway.   Like @RunningVaccssaid.  Bears aren't hiring McDaniels IMO.  

But I never thought they would draft Fields either.   Stranger things have happened.

I think if they do hire McDaniels you have to give him room to do his thing and let him ride through media and player hate/rebellion, if any, and not get scared and bail on him.

To hire him without power is to waste your time.   Now if McDaniels is smart he will not hire a yes man like Gruden did in Mayock (presumably we don't really know what happened behind closed doors).

  He will hire a guy who will argue with him and fight him and whom opinion he respects and can sway him from time to time.   A dictator who surrounds himself with yes men is a fool.   

 

I think this is a great take...

You have to judge the guy on who he is now and not what he was 4, 5 or 10 years ago because you are getting the guy from now...you also need to project who he will be in 5 or 10 years from now...from the stuff I read and listen too he has grown...how many times have you her Belichick say he has learned from one of his coaches? That is what he says about McDaniels...

If he did come here the name to keep an eye on is Dave Ziegler who is director of player personnel in NE...McDaniels tried to hire him in Denver...John Elway then tried to interview him to be Vic Fangio's GM and he turned it down to get promoted in NE...he and McDaniels are really close and he would more than like be the hand picked guy wherever he ends up as HC (if he doesn't just wait it out in NE which is entirely possible)  

[GOGRIESE]

 

We'll see if this comes true. No idea why you would even let him coach on Thursday.