Grade the Packers Draft

[ChaRisMa]

3 hours ago, coachbuns said:

LOL .. dogs balls, must be a big dog?  Thinking you don't like anybody disagreeing with your thoughts; that's to bad.  I enjoy the 95% trash on this forum - it was a long winter in Wisconsin.   

I completely appreciate people disagreeing with me as that is how you learn.

There’s no one learning here because any take that doesn’t follow party lines is mocked. This is what an echo chamber looks like. A pile of people with the same opinion telling anyone with something different to be quiet. And if the DMs I’m getting on here and Twitter are any signal—A LOT of you that lurk and don’t post agree with me. Half of the posters need to post less and read more. The worst trait a person can have is to think they know everything. And plenty of people here think because they post a lot that they actually know something. 

[15412]

I really liked the fact we spent our two 1st rounders on defense.  I question the first pick partially because I don't know enough about him (so many good players on that Georgia defense it's hard to put a grade on him, he was surrounded by play makers) and also because this in my opinion was a very deep ILB draft.  We  could have had some top talent at the position in rounds 2 and 3.  This is one to watch, especially with JJ going after this pick.  I will say this, the Ravens traded up to 23 a bit earlier.  When McDuffie went 21 to KC and then we took Quay they traded that pick to the Bills.  They wanted one of these two.  

I like Watson, do not like what we gave for him.  They obviously graded him late 1st round and had to have him over the other options that would have been there or been far cheaper to move for in round 2.  We'll see.

Can't argue with the O-Linemen taken.  Thought the Edge we took round 5 was a steal.  With undrafted prospects shying from GB to a degree it was nice to have 4 7th's.  I was shocked to see Rasheed Walker still there character concerns and all.  A couple of these late picks are going to shine in camp and pre-season.

They obviously loved Quay and Watson.  They will do much to define this draft.  I'll trust them for now.

Solid B

[ChaRisMa]

3 hours ago, squire12 said:

@ChaRisMa

Couple questions if you were drafting for GB

1.  Would you have traded up in the second to pick 34, yes/no?

If yes. What player would you have taken instead?

If no, what players would you taken at 53 and 59?

Absolutely not for a WR with so many still available. Six of the teams picking before 53 took WR round 1. It was easy to deduce one of Watson/Pickens/Pierce/Metchie would be available. Hell, Jalen Tolberts tools aren’t far off from Watson if we’re drafting speed guys that need to develop a route tree.  I don’t see how anyone can think Watson was worth 53 and 59 when all 4-5 of those guys are .1 seconds of a 40 time slower but better in other ways to more than make up for it. Any of them can get open deep when left untouched to run deep. That’s how Watson had success. Same skill MVS had coming out—he never developed a route tree but I do like Watson’s build a lot better than his, especially his lower half which is going to help him develop his routes. He’s smoother and has more bend than MVS already. Plenty of reason for optimism for the player. He will be better than MVS last year.

But I’d have tried to trade up into the mid-late 40s and taken Pickens. If I wasn’t able to I’d have gladly taken Pierce at 53 like the Colts did. 59 I’d have taken Enagbare funny enough. Guess we get to see how that pans out.

 

[TheEagle]

30 minutes ago, ChaRisMa said:

 Hell, Jalen Tolberts tools aren’t far off from Watson if we’re drafting speed guys that need to develop a route tree.

 

Not if you are going off measurables (Watson is 3 inches taller and 15 pounds heavier and beat Tolbert in every combine test) or how they performed at the Senior Bowl. Watson was much better than Tolbert there--with his route running and ability to beat press.

[Packerraymond]

17 hours ago, wgbeethree said:

I'm not foolish enough to think my opinion matters or makes them facts.

I'm just saying that I find it odd that Gute went against the grain on a lot of things this board and the Packers front office has held fast to previously and it surprises me everyone else seemingly is super happy with it. That's all. 

Has sticking to that rigidity won us a SB in the last 11 years?

[Packerraymond]

35 minutes ago, ChaRisMa said:

Absolutely not for a WR with so many still available. Six of the teams picking before 53 took WR round 1. It was easy to deduce one of Watson/Pickens/Pierce/Metchie would be available. Hell, Jalen Tolberts tools aren’t far off from Watson if we’re drafting speed guys that need to develop a route tree.  I don’t see how anyone can think Watson was worth 53 and 59 when all 4-5 of those guys are .1 seconds of a 40 time slower but better in other ways to more than make up for it. Any of them can get open deep when left untouched to run deep. That’s how Watson had success. Same skill MVS had coming out—he never developed a route tree but I do like Watson’s build a lot better than his, especially his lower half which is going to help him develop his routes. He’s smoother and has more bend than MVS already. Plenty of reason for optimism for the player. He will be better than MVS last year.

But I’d have tried to trade up into the mid-late 40s and taken Pickens. If I wasn’t able to I’d have gladly taken Pierce at 53 like the Colts did. 59 I’d have taken Enagbare funny enough. Guess we get to see how that pans out.

 

Have you ever watched the Combine? Seen the Simulcam? .1 seconds over 40 yards is like 5-7 yards. That's a massive, massive difference in speed.

[ChaRisMa]

9 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

Have you ever watched the Combine? Seen the Simulcam? .1 seconds over 40 yards is like 5-7 yards. That's a massive, massive difference in speed.

Right. I agree with that. Like I said, the other guys were far better in other ways to make up for it. It’s clear MLF wanted 4.3 speed—we’ve talked about how MVS was our only guy who could predictably blow the top off a defense.

I thought everyone wanted either a WR1 or someone who would develop into one. Was that only me? Because I don’t see Watson being more than MVS with the ability to run reverses/jet sweep for Rodgers remaining time. I do wanna point out MLF talked about how they spent time examining how far off their original year 1 offense they’d become and that they wanted to return some of the concepts—I think Watson will see some reverses and be in motion occasionally. No more watching EQ try to run inside of a blocking WR on a reverse.

[Packerraymond]

2 minutes ago, ChaRisMa said:

Right. I agree with that. Like I said, the other guys were far better in other ways to make up for it. It’s clear MLF wanted 4.3 speed—we’ve talked about how MVS was our only guy who could predictably blow the top off a defense.

I thought everyone wanted either a WR1 or someone who would develop into one. Was that only me? Because I don’t see Watson being more than MVS with the ability to run reverses/jet sweep for Rodgers remaining time. I do wanna point out MLF talked about how they spent time examining how far off their original year 1 offense they’d become and that they wanted to return some of the concepts—I think Watson will see some reverses and be in motion occasionally. No more watching EQ try to run inside of a blocking WR on a reverse.

I think they wanted a WR1, and that's why they picked one with the ceiling of Watson instead of taking one who is more immediately pro ready, but profiles as a 2-3 like Skyy Moore or Metchie.

[skibrett15]

So, does anyone have the RAS of the non-OL for all of our picks compiled?

 

https://sports.yahoo.com/athletic-packers-2022-draft-class-135329731.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAMPu1QnyGKJdkGShVXbfCDS2CmAaAvwaoUZzm8a3pGxWAfjLlJgcuE8PoMSSoP7Sa_5DAHAT3sCi7g4oih9b0M6GRYnIVqi3EK8iYKX5HvcKa9WoxyTikgUQ4_HGecqfAFZz1yZK9D_59zLcbeASDvBStO86HuYdX1I2dNO_D4oD

 

Whether or not RAS is the actual metric being used or not, it's a good approximation of what the Packers are looking for in picks.  For all you mock drafters next year (and this has been true for at least 4 years now)... STOP MOCKING BAD ATHLETES TO THE PACKERS.

 

Packers care about freak measurements more than almost any team.

Edited May 2, 2022 by skibrett15

[ChaRisMa]

24 minutes ago, TheEagle said:

Not if you are going off measurables (Watson is 3 inches taller and 15 pounds heavier and beat Tolbert in every combine test) or how they performed at the Senior Bowl. Watson was much better than Tolbert there--with his route running and ability to beat press.

The offense is set up for WR1 to draw a double while the run game is effective to the point they begin to put 8 men in the box leaving man coverage on your speed WR to be untouched running a deep route with no safety help over the top. Speed WR only has to get downfield clean and his natural speed makes him wide open—absolutely nothing fancy about the route. Literally run your best 40 and locate ball. Watson will thrive there, no doubt. That single skill isn’t pick 34 for me. And while he’s a very willing blocker, are we playing him on 1st and 2nd down over Lazard or Watkins or Cobb when the slot is part of the formation? Probably some. The speed threat helps the run game. But if he’s on the field he will have to read NFL defenses and adjust his routes. Beat players whom are faster and stronger and more skilled than he played against even at the senior bowl. Doesn’t matter if it’s Tolbert or Watson. There will be a major learning curve. Can he get it all straightened out for the playoffs? Time will tell.

[ChaRisMa]

18 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

I think they wanted a WR1, and that's why they picked one with the ceiling of Watson instead of taking one who is more immediately pro ready, but profiles as a 2-3 like Skyy Moore or Metchie.

How much importance do you feel should be placed on getting Rodgers the best team this year?

And is Watson going to provide a possession game before he’s gone?

Edited May 2, 2022 by ChaRisMa

[incognito_man]

1 hour ago, ChaRisMa said:

I completely appreciate people disagreeing with me as that is how you learn.

There’s no one learning here because any take that doesn’t follow party lines is mocked. This is what an echo chamber looks like. A pile of people with the same opinion telling anyone with something different to be quiet. And if the DMs I’m getting on here and Twitter are any signal—A LOT of you that lurk and don’t post agree with me. Half of the posters need to post less and read more. The worst trait a person can have is to think they know everything. And plenty of people here think because they post a lot that they actually know something. 

At least half this board didn't like the trade-up for Watson. But most of them were capable of explaining why without making up crap like "Carson Wentz is the best FCS player ever".

That's why you're getting trashed. There's nothing more annoying than posters who think their (relatively common) opinion is somehow unique and that's why they're getting debate.

Just make your points and try to articulately defend them when they are challenged. You have yet to intelligently defend your cracks against the FCS and NDSU staff. 

So, we're still waiting.

[Norm]

10 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

At least half this board didn't like the trade-up for Watson. But most of them were capable of explaining why without making up crap like "Carson Wentz is the best FCS player ever".

That's why you're getting trashed. There's nothing more annoying than posters who think their (relatively common) opinion is somehow unique and that's why they're getting debate.

Just make your points and try to articulately defend them when they are challenged. You have yet to intelligently defend your cracks against the FCS and NDSU staff. 

So, we're still waiting.

I'm confused why he was so mad at me when I was literally starting the rallying cry of "we don't know everything" and then he ends that post with "everyone here thinks they know everything."

And I don't care if you don't like Watson. Plenty don't.. Plenty didn't like the trade up but NDSU is better than most at putting FCS dudes in the pros than most and he also took a shot at his speed. He moved to other points which I agree with more that I wouldn't have batted an eye at if they were the original take. Like I started this with, he didn't like the pick and was throwing a tantrum. That's what it was. 

[wgbeethree]

56 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

Have you ever watched the Combine? Seen the Simulcam? .1 seconds over 40 yards is like 5-7 yards. That's a massive, massive difference in speed.

WHAT? This is so massively shockly wrong. Like wow. 

Like do you mean feet?

Edited May 2, 2022 by wgbeethree

[Packerraymond]

Just now, wgbeethree said:

WHAT? This is so massively shockly wrong. Like wow. 

Like Jeremy Shockly wrong?