Watson and NFL settle on 11 game suspension, $5M fine

[RavensfanRD]

Damn, too bad he didn't miss both Raven games.

Anyhoo, free my mans!

[AkronsWitness]

1 hour ago, ET80 said:

I think the time away from football has skewed memories a bit.

Yes, Deshaun Watson is great at playing QB. But people are forgetting some of his flaws - holds onto the ball WAY too long, takes sacks he shouldn’t take, forces throws into coverages he shouldn’t be throwing into, locks into his target early and doesn’t look coverage off, propensity to fumble the ball a LOT - those were pretty consistent over the entirety of his career. 

To those that follow him - go ahead and start working on yelling “GET RID OF IT!” right now. You’re going to be yelling it very frequently over the course of his career.

no no no dont walk down this road. This is the same crap I heard from Seahawks fans after they traded Wilson away and it felt like it was their way to cope with having to watch a Lock/Geno camp battle. Are Watson and Wilson flawed, yes. Are they both top 8 QBs in the NFL, yes. The same things you listed that are flaws (of both players) are also the things that make them great.

Sure they take sacks and hold onto the ball, but those are also the plays where they roll out, avoid 3 rushers because neither team ever invested in their offensive line and throw a 50 yard TD falling away throwing across their body with a 240lb LB in their face.

I also vividly remember 2 years ago there was a actual real discussion of who was better between Mahomes and Watson. That was a actual thing that happened, it was like the media and NFL was trying to make Watson/Mahomes the next Manning/Brady AFC QB rivalry.

Edited August 19, 2022 by AkronsWitness

[Sacks98]

19 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

no no no dont walk down this road. This is the same crap I heard from Seahawks fans after they traded Wilson away and it felt like it was their way to cope with having to watch a Lock/Geno camp battle. Are Watson and Wilson flawed, yes. Are they both top 8 QBs in the NFL, yes. The same things you listed that are flaws (of both players) are also the things that make them great.

Sure they take sacks and hold onto the ball, but those are also the plays where they roll out, avoid 3 rushers because neither team ever invested in their offensive line and throw a 50 yard TD falling away throwing across their body with a 240lb LB in their face.

I also vividly remember 2 years ago there was a actual real discussion of who was better between Mahomes and Watson. That was a actual thing that happened, it was like the media and NFL was trying to make Watson/Mahomes the next Manning/Brady AFC QB rivalry.

The Seahawks never built Wilson a great line but those criticisms against him are valid.

[AkronsWitness]

12 minutes ago, Sacks98 said:

The Seahawks never built Wilson a great line but those criticisms against him are valid.

Not saying they aren't, he probably does hold onto the ball occasionally too long and takes sacks--Im just saying the positive that comes out of those plays outweigh the negative you have to deal with sometimes. No QB is perfect. I could very well say that Mahomes flaws are that he thinks he can make any pass and sometimes looks foolish when he throws a interception or gets killed outside the pocket because he is trying to always make the highlight play. Thats a very real thing that caught up with him the majority of last season.

Edited August 19, 2022 by AkronsWitness

[ET80]

27 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

no no no dont walk down this road.

I’ve only watched every single snap the guy has played in the NFL (preseason, regular season, playoffs). Seen him live in practice. Watched him live in games (again - preseason, regular season, playoffs). I like to think I know what I’m talking about with the sport in general, as well as specific to the Houston Texans (the last team Watson took a meaningful snap for).

But, don’t believe me if you don’t wanna.

28 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

Are Watson and Wilson flawed, yes. Are they both top 8 QBs in the NFL, yes. The same things you listed that are flaws (of both players) are also the things that make them great.

I never really denied any of this - it’s equally a risk as well as a strength. But to ignore the risk is just as flawed as ignoring the reward (which I didn’t really do).

32 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

I also vividly remember 2 years ago there was a actual real discussion of who was better between Mahomes and Watson.

Odds are …I started that thread.

That thread was started before Mahomes hung up 51 while Watson could only muster up 7 in Q2-Q4 of their last playoff game. That game altered the narrative. 

Yes, that game was largely on Bill O’Brien making horrible in-game decisions. But, do elite QBs let bad coaching hang them out to dry THAT much?

15 minutes ago, Sacks98 said:

The Seahawks never built Wilson a great line but those criticisms against him are valid.

Meanwhile, the Texans went out of their way to invest in the OL. Yet… Watson still found himself getting sacked.

[seriously27]

9 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

Not saying they aren't, he probably does hold onto the ball occasionally too long 

I've also heard he holds on to his ball for way too long. I've also heard he often extends it out to the opposing team when that isn't in the playbook either. It would probably be a good idea to get him into a room by himself for a couple years so he can really learn the playbook, and to make sure he knows the right way to play. 

[seminoles1]

9 hours ago, SkippyX said:

The last MVP was a serial plague spreader who lied about his vaccine status and repeatedly failed to wear a mask risking possible exposure to others. The league added up all the incidents of this lying and blatant disregard of others and of the rules. They treated the 10-25 times as 1 time and gave him a small fine instead of 1 or 2 games that probably deserved as a serial offender (of that rule)

One guy said he would not vote for him and that guy was annihilated by just about everyone..

 

That being said, I think Watson will be blocked from winning because this is very different behavior. I'm not saying never, but it would have to be like 2035 after he spent the last 12 years doing as much good as possible. If he has a Marino '84 in 2024, I still think they pick someone else.

Kobe was 2007-08 NBA MVP (about 5 years after)

Ray Lewis won DPOY and SB MVP the season after the white suit went missing. (Disney went with Dilfer for the commercial)

Santonio may have deserved the MVP of SB XLIII anyway but it may have been easy for writers to not vote for Ben.

I agree. After 5 years or so then I could see it happen, but if it ever did there'd have to be no other decent candidate.

I also agree about next year. I don't care if he breaks the record for TDs and yards: the optics of him winning MVP in his first season back would be so awful.

[AkronsWitness]

18 minutes ago, ET80 said:

I’ve only watched every single snap the guy has played in the NFL (preseason, regular season, playoffs). Seen him live in practice. Watched him live in games (again - preseason, regular season, playoffs). I like to think I know what I’m talking about with the sport in general, as well as specific to the Houston Texans (the last team Watson took a meaningful snap for).

But, don’t believe me if you don’t wanna.

I never really denied any of this - it’s equally a risk as well as a strength. But to ignore the risk is just as flawed as ignoring the reward (which I didn’t really do).

Odds are …I started that thread.

That thread was started before Mahomes hung up 51 while Watson could only muster up 7 in Q2-Q4 of their last playoff game. That game altered the narrative. 

Yes, that game was largely on Bill O’Brien making horrible in-game decisions. But, do elite QBs let bad coaching hang them out to dry THAT much?

Meanwhile, the Texans went out of their way to invest in the OL. Yet… Watson still found himself getting sacked.

Not saying that your criticisms aren't right. I just hate when fans pull the whole 'yeah well he wasn't really that good anyways and here is why...enjoy watching that' card whenever a good player leaves their team. Browns fans got castrated for doing this for 5 months of Baker trade news.

 Ive watched him, he is a helluva talent but I agree with the fact that he holds onto the ball for too long sometimes always trying to make a play. He is almost identical to Wilson in that respect, but I dont think that is some super hindering thing in his game. I also think scheme with Carroll/BoB always wanting to push the ball downfield because of their WR personnel could have factored into that as well.

As far as the Mahomes/Watson thing, that wasnt just here on these boards. That was in national media on ESPN, FS1, SNF Pre Game shows, ect. That was very much a national discussion away from these boards.

Im not sure where you think the Texans ever invested in the OL came from outside of paying a boatload of money/assets for Tunsil. The Texans OL ranked #23, #20, #27 and #29th during Watsons 4 years playing with the team. If you call that investing in your offensive line then consider me Miles Davis.

Edited August 19, 2022 by AkronsWitness

[ThatJerkDave]

Texans vs Watson is going to be delicious.  Must watch game.  Same as Baker vs Browns.

Cleveland has possibly my most anticipated games between teams that won't make the playoffs.

[DontTazeMeBro]

I have a feeling the first time it looks like Cleveland might go to a Super Bowl their playoff officiating is going to be brutal.

[ET80]

52 minutes ago, AkronsWitness said:

Im not sure where you think the Texans ever invested in the OL came from outside of paying a boatload of money/assets for Tunsil. The Texans OL ranked #23, #20, #27 and #29th during Watsons 4 years playing with the team. If you call that investing in your offensive line then consider me Miles Davis.

There was also using 1/2 round picks on T Tytus Howard and G Max Scharping in 2019, drafting C Nick Martin in the 2nd round in 2016 (a year before Watson was drafted). 

I don’t know how else you could categorize that other than an investment - even if you removed the ridiculous amount of assets on Laremy Tunsil, the Texans burned three premium picks on a LT, LG and C in three years. 

[SkippyX]

For your own health take a while to process this and then move on from the bad capitalist still profiting. It’s not unique to him. I suggest adding up all the money he loses from everything and also thinking about the good the NFL can do. If anything be mad that the Browns and the NFL did not match the funds but either way you can’t change this. The fine is staggeringly record setting and unprecedented but no realistic number would really make you happy if your goal is to make a guy with a fair market value 320 million dollar contract based on his skill and past performance feel a financial burden.

[Hunter2_1]

3 hours ago, TXsteeler said:

Yeah that's something most people tend to forget about NFL owners when discussing decisions the league makes. Your average NFL owner had a great grandpa that was rich. They are 3 generations deep into "can't screw it up" levels of wealth. They aren't special business people or smarter than your average college grad and if you were to adjust for their opportunities, most have done worse than an average person would being born into their situation.

The majority of them have a business or law degree. Woopdie doo. We have people that post on this forum with those credentials and they weren't born with a dad rich enough to get them private tutors and buy their way into school even with a C average.

Yep. From what I've read (and I've tried to get sources from the spectrum), the overwhelming majority of billionaires had a massive MASSIVE leg up. Those who take their advice should do so with a pinch of salt. 

[Hunter2_1]

3 hours ago, ET80 said:

I think the time away from football has skewed memories a bit.

Yes, Deshaun Watson is great at playing QB. But people are forgetting some of his flaws - holds onto the ball WAY too long, takes sacks he shouldn’t take, forces throws into coverages he shouldn’t be throwing into, locks into his target early and doesn’t look coverage off, propensity to fumble the ball a LOT - those were pretty consistent over the entirety of his career. 

To those that follow him - go ahead and start working on yelling “GET RID OF IT!” right now. You’re going to be yelling it very frequently over the course of his career.

I do remember the holding on to the ball. Maybe I am biased, because he killed us every time he played us, but he can really dissect a defense. Stat-heavy, dangerous QB but also does stuff to lose games. That fair?

[AkronsWitness]

12 minutes ago, ET80 said:

There was also using 1/2 round picks on T Tytus Howard and G Max Scharping in 2019, drafting C Nick Martin in the 2nd round in 2016 (a year before Watson was drafted). 

I don’t know how else you could categorize that other than an investment - even if you removed the ridiculous amount of assets on Laremy Tunsil, the Texans burned three premium picks on a LT, LG and C in three years. 

In that case I should have said "Investing in OL who can make a impact on the field"