State of the Steelers

[August4th]

I want to hold off on making the "Splash trade for a pro bowl vet". I'd do a trade like that if it could get us over the top, not sure this team is their yet.

[AFF]

3 minutes ago, August4th said:

I want to hold off on making the "Splash trade for a pro bowl vet". I'd do a trade like that if it could get us over the top, not sure this team is their yet.

Especially with them being in very good shape cap wise after the 2023/24 season…

Figure out which young players aren’t the answer and go from there.

[warfelg]

28 minutes ago, AFF said:

Especially with them being in very good shape cap wise after the 2023/24 season…

Figure out which young players aren’t the answer and go from there.

The more I look back at this past season the more and more I’m frustrated by it. We should not have done much and focused on setting up the next GM if you weren’t going to retire before the offseason.
 

Instead we got a team that was designed to be just good enough which prolongs the roster overhaul we needed. So we need another year to see if we like what we have and we have a defense with a lot of questions in the future. 

[warfelg]

39 minutes ago, August4th said:

I want to hold off on making the "Splash trade for a pro bowl vet". I'd do a trade like that if it could get us over the top, not sure this team is their yet.

I’ll add that if they do it needs to be to Picketts benefit. I’m willing to bet it’s Tomlin but this attitude that defensive guys can be playmakers that can help the offense needs to be tempered a bit. 

[3rivers]

1 minute ago, warfelg said:

I’ll add that if they do it needs to be to Picketts benefit. I’m willing to bet it’s Tomlin but this attitude that defensive guys can be playmakers that can help the offense needs to be tempered a bit. 

they already have the most expensive defensive unit, and while I like defence, this might be going a bit far especially if they also signed Highsmith.  Maybe if they traded johnson (read this somewhere) to the rams  it helps a bit , but then they need to replace him . 

It's going to be a task for Khan, I look forward to this for a change. It's been a few years since I really cared this much or hoped I suppose you could say. The potential appears to be there, the 2022 draft looks  good and they have a bit of room after some cuts . 

What if we started KP day 1 and TJ never got hurt?

[warfelg]

1 minute ago, 3rivers said:

they already have the most expensive defensive unit, and while I like defence, this might be going a bit far especially if they also signed Highsmith.  Maybe if they traded johnson (read this somewhere) to the rams  it helps a bit , but then they need to replace him . 

It's going to be a task for Khan, I look forward to this for a change. It's been a few years since I really cared this much or hoped I suppose you could say. The potential appears to be there, the 2022 draft looks  good and they have a bit of room after some cuts . 

What if we started KP day 1 and TJ never got hurt?

You know who's defenses cost almost as much as ours? Cincinnati, Philadelphia, San Francisco.

You know who's offenses cost almost double what ours does? Cincinnati, Philadelphia, San Francisco, and Kansas City.

The issue isn't that they shouldn't spend more on defense.  It's they should be spending more on offense.

 

Also FWIW - they should pay Highsmith at about the 20th highest paid EDGE.  Likely Cam's cap hit will go down soon, and having Witherspoon and Jackson gone, Alualu off the cap, and we're not even top 5 most expensive defenses.  The reality of this "highest paid defense" is most the money is in 4 guys. 

[3rivers]

54 minutes ago, warfelg said:

Also FWIW - they should pay Highsmith at about the 20th highest paid EDGE.  Likely Cam's cap hit will go down soon, and having Witherspoon and Jackson gone, Alualu off the cap, and we're not even top 5 most expensive defenses.  The reality of this "highest paid defense" is most the money is in 4 guys. 

and as good as the 4 guys are, it's not as balanced as we would like.  

so if we make the cuts you expect, AND sign Highsmith, would we still be top 4 highest paid if the other teams stay similar?  The mention of highest paid was something I recently watched and though as a result the team will be more reserved in spending on defence. Then I saw the Ramsey trade rumour/talk 

57 minutes ago, warfelg said:

 It's they should be spending more on offense.

OL and perhaps WR (Marvin Jones for example) . Is there any chance Jackson stays if he gets /stays healthy? Acquiring him just leaves me questioning the FO, really made no sense overall especially considering his cap cost. 

 

1 hour ago, warfelg said:

You know who's defenses cost almost as much as ours? Cincinnati, Philadelphia, San Francisco.

so defence  is still important in january football it seems, interesting. Who would have though.

I don't  have an offseason mock or wishlist made up (yet)  but if they can trade for Becton that sure would worth the try.  For WR Jones could be good.

[Dcash4]

2 hours ago, warfelg said:

We should not have done much and focused on setting up the next GM if you weren’t going to retire before the offseason.

I know you hate Kevin Colbert, but I don’t know how you would be upset about last off-season. They didn’t strap a new regime with anything debilitating and provided a ton of flexibility in the deals they made. They raised the floor in some key areas like C, RG, and CB and nailed their rookie class to this point. 

I would have been far more upset if they swung massive draft day trades to go get a guy like Kenny at 10 or signed big FA deals that the next regime wouldn’t like. They didn’t do anything like that. Now we have cash, flexibility, draft capital, and some really useful 2nd year players for 2023. 

I guess I don’t get the “we should have set up the next GM”. I honestly think that’s the thing the did best. 

[warfelg]

Did just enough to be just good enough to just sniff the playoffs and get people to blame coaching.

[Chieferific]

15 hours ago, warfelg said:

Ran a mock on PFF.  Going though the draft I'm really happy with how some people will feel about certain aspects.

TRADE PICK 17 TO LAC FOR 21, 158, 2024 2ND, B+ PFF grade

Come around to 17 and no one I loved was available.  Tops on the board were Jaxon Smith-Njigba, Nolan Smith, Quentin Johnston, and Anton Harrison.  I felt comfortable with this value, and was willing to move down without someone I loved being there.

PICK 21 - Jordan Addison, WR, USC, 6' 175lbs, B PFF grade

This is the pick I know is going to get heat.  "No more early 1sts" and "stop spending premium picks on WR".  That's what this is to end the cycle of.  Like if or not, between 2023/2024 drafts one WR is going to have to go high to this team.  I don't think Johnson is going to get a C3 from us or he wants to move on with C3.  I look at Addison as his replacement and with Addison, Pickens, Austin you have a good potential group.

Also considered: Broderick Jones (23), O'Cyrus Torrance (27), Antonio Johnson (28)

PICK 32 - Trenton Simpson, ILB, Clemson, 6'3" 240lbs, A PFF grade

I really like the value here with Simpson.  I don't think he's a day 1 starter, and would require us to retain Jack and possible Spillane.  But breaking him in by rotating in on passing downs and making him the dime backer with the long term being starting ILB is a great value.

Also considered: Cam Smith (33), Eli Ricks (38), Drew Sanders (39)

PICK 49 - Emmanuel Forbes, CB, Mississippi State, 6' 180lbs, A PFF grade

Seems more and more lately that some of the better CB's are coming out of the mid/early 2nd round once you go outside the top 10.  And that's exactly how I feel about Forbes here.  MSU's pass defense was really good and he's SEC tested against some of the best.

Also considered: JL Skinner (50), Cody Mauch (52), Darnell Washington (53)

PICK 80 - Isaiah Foskey, EDGE, Notre Dame, 6'5" 265lbs, C+ PFF grade

I get that EDGE in the 4th might seem like a bit of a luxury, but we need a better 3rd pass rusher option and Foskey gives that to you.  I do think that that he's got starter upside with rotation ability off the bat.  He's also kinda like Leal in that he's a 7T with the ability to slide into 5T or rush off the edge.

Also considered: Blake Freeland (83), Kobie Turner (87), Steve Avila (88)

PICK 120 - Zacch Pickens, IDL, South Carolina, 6'4" 310 LBS, B PFF grade

I think that he's going to be a guy you look at down the road and see as a good value.  I don't think he has starter upside, but he has the ability to be a long term rotational guy.  His size can do some 0T and 3T.  But he's going to be mostly a run stuffing IDL, which would be good in a role.

Also considered: Kyu Blu Kelly (121), Joe Tippmann (127), Sedrick Van Pran (128)

PICK 158 - Yasir Abdullah, EDGE, Louisville, 6'2" 242lbs, B PFF grade

I know I have him listed as an edge linebacker, but I would like to see him used differently than just and edge rusher.  I would want him to play more as an off ball linebacker in normal dinner, but on pass downs he becomes a pass rusher off the edge.  I think of the way that Dallas uses Parsons and Philly uses Reddick.

Also considered: Thomas Income (159), Ventrell Miller (163), Mekhi Garner (167)

PICK 195 - Austin Stogner, TE, South Carolina, 6'5" 250lbs

I think he has the possibility to be a good blocker and contribute some as a pass catcher.  For him to be a 2nd/3rd TE that's what you want.  He's a big body in the way that Baby Heyward isn't and could create a really nice dynamic where you can put both on in place of Freiermuth and have something interesting.

Also considered: Aubrey Miller Jr (201), Asim Richards (203), Darrell Luter Jr (214)

PICK 236 - Richard Gouraige, OT, Florida, 6'5" 308lbs, B PFF grade

I think this guy has the ability to play OT/OG.  Best case he's a swing tackle, worst case he's a swing guard.

Also considered: TJ Bass (243), Jalen Wayne (246), Taron Vincent (249)

 

OVERALL PFF GRADE:: A

I'm good with the Addison pick (especially with the trade down) and I'm Team Simpson.  Forbes is a good get.  Pickens would be a great addition that doesn't require a lot of draft capital.  "A 2 Birds. 1 Stone" type of player that would help the DL tremendously.  I know you have 2 Edge OLBs but I would love to somehow get my hands on Keion Clark.  He is the EPITOME of a freakish ball of clay waiting to be molded.  Obviously OL was neglected (sans last pick) and I could see that being the Steelers approach but give me Vorhees or "insert 3rd Rd OT/OG here" at pick 80.

*Just did a PFF as well.  They really don't like Tuli.  I took him at #49 and got a C- 😕.  They may dislike Vorhees even more (#80 got me a D).  I tried to get  Clark but it would have taken #49 on a developmental player.  PFF is way off or I've become out of touch 🤷‍♂️.  Honorable mentions...Jerrod Clark for my "fat guy in the middle" and Salvideri as my OT/OG Swing.

Edited January 29, 2023 by Chieferific

[3rivers]

what if Kancey is there at 17? 

[warfelg]

2 hours ago, Chieferific said:

*Just did a PFF as well.  They really don't like Tuli.  I took him at #49 and got a C- 😕.  They may dislike Vorhees even more (#80 got me a D).  I tried to get  Clark but it would have taken #49 on a developmental player.  PFF is way off or I've become out of touch 🤷‍♂️.  Honorable mentions...Jerrod Clark for my "fat guy in the middle" and Salvideri as my OT/OG Swing.

It’s not that they don’t like Tuli - it’s that edge isn’t enough of a need to get one early. 

[43M]

8 hours ago, Dcash4 said:

I know you hate Kevin Colbert, but I don’t know how you would be upset about last off-season. They didn’t strap a new regime with anything debilitating and provided a ton of flexibility in the deals they made. They raised the floor in some key areas like C, RG, and CB and nailed their rookie class to this point. 

I would have been far more upset if they swung massive draft day trades to go get a guy like Kenny at 10 or signed big FA deals that the next regime wouldn’t like. They didn’t do anything like that. Now we have cash, flexibility, draft capital, and some really useful 2nd year players for 2023. 

I guess I don’t get the “we should have set up the next GM”. I honestly think that’s the thing the did best. 

You have been defending it since the beginning, and you have every right to feel how you feel about it, but you have consistently ignored valid points from those who think it was a terrible decision to let Colbert make decisions for a team he was no longer going to be a part of.   

Its too soon to anything about how last offseason will effect the future.   Last years draft class could very much still go either way.   But as Ive argued many times, that isnt even the point.    The point is, it was beyond stupid to let a guy, even one as tenured as Colbert, make ALL the personnel decisions about a team he was leaving, and just hand the new GMs the team at the end of the year and say "here, make due with MY vision of the team...goodbye".

It wouldve been fine if the GMs were largely in place to start last offseason and Colbert was just a consultant and oversaw them and doled out advice.   But to let him have COMPLETE control?    Perhaps Khan was more a part of the process last year, I dont know, but I seriously doubt it, especially since Weidl was brought in until after the draft.

Your argument about trading up for Pickett makes no sense.   You have no idea how the offseason would have went under them.   Pickett may have not even been the pick.  We may have brought in an entirely different set of free agents.   Alot of decisions may have been made differently.    Is it possible that Colberts decisions in the 22 offseason will end up being better than the decisions Khan/Weidl would have made?   Sure, but we will never know.

At the end of the day, it doesnt matter though.    IMO, and the opinion of many others, Colbert shouldn't have had all the power last offseason, and Weidl/Khan should have been in place much sooner.    If you disagree, so be it....but its laughably obtuse if you legitimately cant understand arguments to the contrary.

[Chieferific]

7 minutes ago, warfelg said:

It’s not that they don’t like Tuli - it’s that edge isn’t enough of a need to get one early. 

Maybe part of it but they have him ranked #61. 

[43M]

12 hours ago, AFF said:

Especially with them being in very good shape cap wise after the 2023/24 season…

Figure out which young players aren’t the answer and go from there.

Yeah.

We were in "win now mode" for about 5 or 6 years at the end of Ben's career and we never treated it as such.   We always looked to the future as much as the present.   

Now, this is a team much moreso set up for the future than the present.   This team has alot of growing to do, and isnt as close as some people on here believe they are.  Again, sure, if Kenny has a monster leap in year 2, it could happen, but thats a massive IF, especially under Canada.

Any massive trades for guys like Ramsey or Hopkins would make no ******* sense at this point.   Those are the types of trades we should have made between 2016 and 2021.

If anything, use that same draft capital and trade up for a guy like Jalen Carter you could build around for a decade.    Not saying we should do that either, but Id much rather see that than trading high picks for a vet pushing 30.