Week 12 Gameday Thread (SNF Edition) - Green Bay Packers (4-7-0) @ Philadelphia Eagles (9-1-0)

[vegas492]

@Packerraymond

When you were watching the Love stuff....did you notice the defense?

I didn't feel like they were in a prevent at all.

Also, I didn't feel like they blitzed, stunted or did anything exotic or creative.

What did you see out of the defense?  

Because the velocity, footwork and decision making abilities from Love looked great.  I'd like to know if he was seeing some prevent stuff (and I don't feel like he was), or if he was reading more or less a "real" defense out there.

[Packerraymond]

44 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

@Packerraymond

When you were watching the Love stuff....did you notice the defense?

I didn't feel like they were in a prevent at all.

Also, I didn't feel like they blitzed, stunted or did anything exotic or creative.

What did you see out of the defense?  

Because the velocity, footwork and decision making abilities from Love looked great.  I'd like to know if he was seeing some prevent stuff (and I don't feel like he was), or if he was reading more or less a "real" defense out there.

It wasn't prevent. Lot of cover 2, just standard type stuff. They did play off as to not give up explosives, but any team does that in that scenario. Didn't really notice blitzes, not sure, ball came out in rhythm so I didn't really focus on OL/DL play, just the route concepts and his drops. 

[vegas492]

1 minute ago, Packerraymond said:

It wasn't prevent. Lot of cover 2, just standard type stuff. They did play off as to not give up explosives, but any team does that in that scenario. Didn't really notice blitzes, not sure, ball came out in rhythm so I didn't really focus on OL/DL play, just the route concepts and his drops. 

Thank you.

I saw a base cover 2 as well.  No real prevent.  But also nothing confusing or exotic.

And we still hit a 60+ yarder.

While I loved all his throws, that Cover 2 shot to Jones I thought was his best ball/read.  It got there so quickly that Jones wasn't ready for it.  Kind of a jaw dropping throw as I didn't know that he had a cannon quite like that.

[Mr. Fussnputz]

1 minute ago, vegas492 said:

Thank you.

I saw a base cover 2 as well.  No real prevent.  But also nothing confusing or exotic.

And we still hit a 60+ yarder.

While I loved all his throws, that Cover 2 shot to Jones I thought was his best ball/read.  It got there so quickly that Jones wasn't ready for it.  Kind of a jaw dropping throw as I didn't know that he had a cannon quite like that.

Love's better velocity was noticeable. Rodger's broken thumb, hurting ribs, and aging arm has apparently hurt his velocity. That's understandable, and it's the reason I think Love should start until Rodgers heals up. Always want to start the players that give you the best chance of winning. When healthy, Rodger is still the choice, but he's not healthy. Let Love have a couple of starts. That's what backup QBs are for. With the bye in there, if we're still in contention, Rodgers can come back healthy and rested for a playoff push. 

[squire12]

2 hours ago, Packerraymond said:

Got around to watching the 22 on Love's two drives last night. That was some high level ****. The throw to Watson, back turned to the field on the PA, back foot hits, turn around, survey and rip it, damn. Probably less than a second he took to decipher his read was open and get the ball out. The throw to Jones to beat Cover-2, lawd, he saw that open up on the tablet on the sidelines after the first series. They had Jones on the opposite side on the play he checked down to Dillon, same coverage, same play. Came back to it next series, saw he had the same look and let that rip with anticipation, stupid Jones ruined a sweet play.

He is ready, thanks Aaron for the GOAT career. Need to find a way out of that contract. 

how was the ball placement on the throw to Jones?  was it a back shoulder to decrease the safety coming over?

[vegas492]

11 minutes ago, squire12 said:

how was the ball placement on the throw to Jones?  was it a back shoulder to decrease the safety coming over?

From what I saw?  It was perfect.  Like the pass was "short" as to not the lead the WR right into the safety.  And it was on a rope.

I know that Rodgers has thrown many ropes like that over his career.  

But to me?  Really that throw was so very much Favre-like in how quickly the ball got there with what looked like minimal effort.

[minnypackerfan]

Love's delivery was also much less loopy and very compact.  A lot of improvement even compared to preseason.  I timed his delivery in preseason and it was about just over .4 seconds, which is average to slightly below average for a QB....in this game it was .3 seconds....that's really good and Rodgersesque.  That's a huge improvement.  Those throws were being snapped off.  He definitely showed arm talent too.  The velocity was really good and paired with that quick release he will give receivers a better opportunity to catch it before the defender closes the gap which should increase his completion percentage.  Not to mention that type of delivery and velocity will work well in tight spaces like the end zone where everything tightens up. That throw to Jones was big time.

Still has a tendency to pull the ball a little to the left occasionally with his follow through, but again much cleaner overall.  On the throw to Lazard, while its behind him to the left I think he saw the safety coming down from the middle and I think he was purposely placing the ball in a position to protect his receiver.  Rodgers does this all the time.  Great catch by Lazard. But Love probably wanted the ball slightly closer to Lazard's body.  Intent was good, accuracy could have been slightly better.  If the mechanics continue to improve which I think they will this offseason, this is going to become less noticeable.

On the throw to Cobb when he threw back against the grain...if that throw is one yard further to the right, its a touchdown.  But this is the type of throw he should get much better at with real game experience. 

I would bet that other teams that are QB needy saw that game and would love to see the Packers play Love more in the next several games in case he becomes available via trade.  If I knew I was going to get that version of Love, I would want it.  He's got the size, arm talent and knowledge of NFL offenses that is plug and play ready.  The Packers may have a GOOD problem on their hands and that's all we can ask for.

Edited December 2, 2022 by minnypackerfan

[squire12]

2 hours ago, vegas492 said:

From what I saw?  It was perfect.  Like the pass was "short" as to not the lead the WR right into the safety.  And it was on a rope.

I know that Rodgers has thrown many ropes like that over his career.  

But to me?  Really that throw was so very much Favre-like in how quickly the ball got there with what looked like minimal effort.

I agree it was well placed given the safety coming over.   There was someone posting in the GDT that said the throw was off target and behind Jones which led to the incompletion (or drop by Jones if it would have been thrown by Rodgers)

[Packerraymond]

2 hours ago, squire12 said:

how was the ball placement on the throw to Jones?  was it a back shoulder to decrease the safety coming over?

Back shoulder, has to be. Anything floats inside that safety is either picking it, or sending your WR to the blue tent. That's a catch and get the .... out of bounds route and throw. 

[Norm]

28 minutes ago, squire12 said:

(or drop by Jones if it would have been thrown by Rodgers)

Lololol

[squire12]

14 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

Back shoulder, has to be. Anything floats inside that safety is either picking it, or sending your WR to the blue tent. That's a catch and get the .... out of bounds route and throw. 

Was the safety in position to make a play on the ball if it was thrown in front of Jones?  There was some posters thinking the ball was "behind" Jones which led to the incompletion vs it being thrown in a good spot to avoid the safety.  

i thought live that it was thrown correctly, but didn't see a replay to confirm my thoughts

[vegas492]

4 minutes ago, squire12 said:

Was the safety in position to make a play on the ball if it was thrown in front of Jones?  There was some posters thinking the ball was "behind" Jones which led to the incompletion vs it being thrown in a good spot to avoid the safety.  

i thought live that it was thrown correctly, but didn't see a replay to confirm my thoughts

Honestly squire?  It doesn't matter where the safety was.

That throw was perfect.  He's throwing to a window and he's making sure that his receiver is protected.  That is the goal of that play.  The safety is back there, and if he's late to the spot, it's an easy completion.  If he's early, it's still a completion and the WR is still protected.

With that coverage, there is no reason to place that ball ahead of the receiver, regardless of where the safety is, because he is coming and he is going to close fast.

Jones dropped the ball because of two things.  1)  He's a RB.  That is a tough catch for a RB to make (and still he should have caught it.)  2)  The ball got there very quickly, probably caught Jones off guard a little bit.  You could see that Jones didn't get his hands up in time.

[incognito_man]

3 hours ago, minnypackerfan said:

Love's delivery was also much less loopy and very compact.  A lot of improvement even compared to preseason.  I timed his delivery in preseason and it was about just over .4 seconds, which is average to slightly below average for a QB....in this game it was .3 seconds....that's really good and Rodgersesque.  That's a huge improvement.  Those throws were being snapped off.  He definitely showed arm talent too.  The velocity was really good and paired with that quick release he will give receivers a better opportunity to catch it before the defender closes the gap which should increase his completion percentage.  Not to mention that type of delivery and velocity will work well in tight spaces like the end zone where everything tightens up. That throw to Jones was big time.

Still has a tendency to pull the ball a little to the left occasionally with his follow through, but again much cleaner overall.  On the throw to Lazard, while its behind him to the left I think he saw the safety coming down from the middle and I think he was purposely placing the ball in a position to protect his receiver.  Rodgers does this all the time.  Great catch by Lazard. But Love probably wanted the ball slightly closer to Lazard's body.  Intent was good, accuracy could have been slightly better.  If the mechanics continue to improve which I think they will this offseason, this is going to become less noticeable.

On the throw to Cobb when he threw back against the grain...if that throw is one yard further to the right, its a touchdown.  But this is the type of throw he should get much better at with real game experience. 

I would bet that other teams that are QB needy saw that game and would love to see the Packers play Love more in the next several games in case he becomes available via trade.  If I knew I was going to get that version of Love, I would want it.  He's got the size, arm talent and knowledge of NFL offenses that is plug and play ready.  The Packers may have a GOOD problem on their hands and that's all we can ask for.

Great breakdown. Now that you mentioned it, I also noticed a quicker release. Didn't realize it at the time, but after you said it, that makes sense why it looked different to me.

[squire12]

1 hour ago, vegas492 said:

Honestly squire?  It doesn't matter where the safety was.

That throw was perfect.  He's throwing to a window and he's making sure that his receiver is protected.  That is the goal of that play.  The safety is back there, and if he's late to the spot, it's an easy completion.  If he's early, it's still a completion and the WR is still protected.

With that coverage, there is no reason to place that ball ahead of the receiver, regardless of where the safety is, because he is coming and he is going to close fast.

Jones dropped the ball because of two things.  1)  He's a RB.  That is a tough catch for a RB to make (and still he should have caught it.)  2)  The ball got there very quickly, probably caught Jones off guard a little bit.  You could see that Jones didn't get his hands up in time.

@vegas492

Here is what I'm talking about.  I thought it was a good throw.  Others didn't 

On 11/27/2022 at 10:27 PM, StatKing said:

Whys he throwing it back shoulder when nobody is within 7 yards of him

 

On 11/27/2022 at 10:25 PM, StatKing said:

Jordan Love throwing behind everyone.

 

On 11/27/2022 at 10:24 PM, CWood21 said:

Another good throw by Love.  Goes through Aaron Jones' hand.

 

On 11/27/2022 at 10:25 PM, StatKing said:

Put it on the numbers.

 

[minnypackerfan]

1 hour ago, squire12 said:

@vegas492

Here is what I'm talking about.  I thought it was a good throw.  Others didn't 

 

 

 

 

I think if you looked at the "all 22" and saw the coverage and considered the situation, it was a nearly perfect throw for that play.  Protected the receiver and protected possession from a possible interception and if Jones would have caught it he would have gone out of bounds and stopped the clock.  Rodgers, Brady, and Josh Allen have this throw down pat.  It requires timing and anticipation and you have to have a great arm to get it into the turkey hole before either the safety or cornerback can make a play on it.  That was a big time throw with velocity and accuracy.  Just as impressive was how easy he made the throw look.  That's why Slay the cornerback, who is both experienced and savvy had good things to say about Love after the game.  He tried to bait Love on his first throw, but Love recognized the coverage and wisely pivoted and threw it to his check down receiver. Collingsworth was also impressed by that throw as he knew how hard that throw is to make on time accurately.

Edited December 3, 2022 by minnypackerfan