Shockwave Posted March 2, 2023 Share Posted March 2, 2023 https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/giants-select-quentin-johnston-in-latest-mel-kiper-mock-draft/ar-AA186b6K Quote The Giants don’t have a No. 1 or No. 2 wideout on their roster, and Wan’Dale Robinson, a second-round pick last year, is most effective out of the slot. Johnston is the big, fast and physical receiver they need. At 6-foot-4, he is tremendous after the catch, breaking tackles and running for long touchdowns. He understands how to use his frame to high-point the ball in the air. Jones has improved every season, but he has never had a player who can make contested catches like Johnston. Schoen should make this happen in April. Me and Kiper on the same page for the first time ever lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minutemancl Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 23 hours ago, Shockwave said: https://sports.yahoo.com/b-j-ojulari-joining-azeez-115555250.html?src=rss If he's on the board in the 2nd or 3rd do you take him? Gives Wink a nasty rotation with Thibs, Azeez, and BJ coming off that edge. If BJ is on the board at 57, he would almost certainly be the BPA, in which case we should definitely grab him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minutemancl Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 23 hours ago, Shockwave said: https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/other/giants-select-quentin-johnston-in-latest-mel-kiper-mock-draft/ar-AA186b6K Me and Kiper on the same page for the first time ever lol Johnston is surprisingly worse at 50-50 balls than his frame would suggest, at least going by the stats on contested catches. I think Jordan Addison has the best contested catch rate in this draft. Schoen let us into his WR philosophy a little bit the other day; he said the #1 trait he looks for in a receiver is being able to get open, which is absolutely the right approach. I'm not sure that's the best trait Johnston has. He's a beast after the catch, but he's not exactly someone who makes DBs look silly. Also, something to look out for is that I think Johnston is going to absolutely blow up the combine in a few days here. He'll measure huge, run a fast 40, and move and jump really well. That may put him out of our range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 Pat Leonard of the New York Daily News reports that Jones and his reps are actually seeking more than $45 million per year. Quote League sources tell the Daily News that Jones’ representatives are asking for more than $45 million per year on a multi-year contract extension. That’s over $12.6 million more than what Schoen could get Jones for in 2023 on the $32.4 million non-exclusive franchise tag. https://giantswire.usatoday.com/2023/03/03/new-york-giants-daniel-jones-seeking-more-than-45-million-annually/ Tag him and draft Hooker. This is getting ridiculous. I like Jones, want him to be here and succeed but now it's obvious he switched agents to up his asking price. At that price what is left to surround him with any talent? Pay him the $32, sign SB, draft a QB, shore up the lines and go for gold with a QB on his rookie contract. Not going to win anything giving Jones Mahomes level money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 23 minutes ago, minutemancl said: Johnston is surprisingly worse at 50-50 balls than his frame would suggest, at least going by the stats on contested catches. I think Jordan Addison has the best contested catch rate in this draft. Schoen let us into his WR philosophy a little bit the other day; he said the #1 trait he looks for in a receiver is being able to get open, which is absolutely the right approach. I'm not sure that's the best trait Johnston has. He's a beast after the catch, but he's not exactly someone who makes DBs look silly. Also, something to look out for is that I think Johnston is going to absolutely blow up the combine in a few days here. He'll measure huge, run a fast 40, and move and jump really well. That may put him out of our range. Can you provide this stat? Every single scouting report I've read on Johnston praises him for contested catches. I agree with your second part though. I highly doubt he's there at 25. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minutemancl Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 Just now, Shockwave said: Can you provide this stat? Every single scouting report I've read on Johnston praises him for contested catches. I agree with your second part though. I highly doubt he's there at 25. https://titanswire.usatoday.com/lists/2023-nfl-draft-wide-receivers-strengths-weakness-pff/ Contested catch rates (from PFF)- Quentin Johnston: 34.8% Zay Flowers: 58.3% Jaxon Smith-Njigba: 90% Jordan Addison: 22.2% Josh Downs: 72.2% Take PFF's numbers with a grain of salt, but this is what I was talking about. And it was JSN who had the best in the class, not Addison (who actually has the worst). Addison though gets open so consistently that it isn't a huge deal for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 Don't really know enough about PFF to have an opinion on whether those numbers are legit or not. But on their front page they have Johnston ranked #8 overall in the draft. Addison at 17 and Njigba at 20 and Flowers at 22. So Flowers who they claim has the best contested catch rate and the best pure separation is their 4th ranked WR? Doesn't add up. I'm a BC fan. Watched alot of Flowers he's a damn good player. Considering the garbage BC had at QB it's amazing Zay put up 1000 yards. If he is there at 25 I wouldn't be opposed. It just feels redundant with Robinson, James and possibly Shep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acgott Posted March 3, 2023 Author Share Posted March 3, 2023 As always, contracts come down to the contents, not the headline. It be interesting to see the breakdown and hope it doesn’t kill us. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minutemancl Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 I love incentive laden contracts. If they went that route (which Schoen seems to like to do; he works in offseason workout bonuses into every contract), I wouldn't be upset. If DJ throws for 30 touchdowns and has 4000 total yards, he'll earn whatever he ends up making. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
w4rrior723 Posted March 3, 2023 Share Posted March 3, 2023 (edited) I'd be totally happy with giving DJ $36m/year guaranteed and then an additional $3m/year each for finishing top 8 (top 25% of starting QBs) in YPG, TD% and INT%. So potentially an additional $9m/year giving him a ceiling of $45m for playing like a top QB. I'm sure if he's hitting those metrics, we'd all be happy to see him get that money. And he would definitely deserve it. As of now, he hasn't earned top QB money. But a contract like that gives him the opportunity to. And if he consistently hits the metrics the first couple of years, then maybe you rework the deal by adding in more guaranteed money. That's totally fair for both sides IMO. Edited March 3, 2023 by w4rrior723 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y*so*blu Posted March 4, 2023 Share Posted March 4, 2023 If the deal starts with a 4 then we're overpaying him by at least $5 million a year, no matter how you slice it. He's had one decent season and we still need to pay the rest of the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
w4rrior723 Posted March 5, 2023 Share Posted March 5, 2023 6 hours ago, y*so*blu said: If the deal starts with a 4 then we're overpaying him by at least $5 million a year, no matter how you slice it. He's had one decent season and we still need to pay the rest of the team. I agree, unless the yearly salary starts with a 4 after hitting relevant incentives. If his camp wants him to be paid like a top QB before ever having top QB numbers, making All Pro or a Pro Bowl, then they're going to have a rough time. Nobody is paying DJ $40M+ in guarantee yearly right now. If another team is willing to do that, then we shouldn't match it, and he should take it. I like DJ a lot, would love to have him back, and WANT him to get that money AND earn it. But he simply hasn't earned it yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 6, 2023 Share Posted March 6, 2023 Man looking over combine results. Jalin Hyatt is a beast 😵 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMENNATION Posted March 6, 2023 Share Posted March 6, 2023 The argument for paying/not paying Jones very simply comes down to whether you believe Jones is going to be better with actual weapons. If you think that, pay him $40M dollars because he's only going to cost more next year and the year after that. If you think he's an average QB, tag him and move on. But he's very obviously the best option for them in 2023 and arguably better than several of the guys earning more than him. Him getting paid that $40M per year won't even feel like a lot once Burrow, Herbert, etc. get paid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 6, 2023 Share Posted March 6, 2023 From the cap breakdowns I saw on Twitter over the weekend if they tag him it just simply eats up so much of the available cap money for this season they almost certainly will lose SB. By signing DJ the hit for this season would be way lower then $32 and it frees up enough to make some other major moves. With the cap expected to rise significantly over the next couple of seasons that 40M won't be nearly as stifling as the $32 would be for this season. Anything over $35 is an overpay to me but I see the logic behind getting the deal done. Everything else is on hold right now. If they can somehow get it done at $40 and retain SB and Dex it's a forgivable overpay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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