Mind Character Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 2 hours ago, NudeTayne said: http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000909856/article/baker-mayfield-shines-brightest-on-senior-bowl-day-1 http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000910173/article/is-baker-mayfield-better-than-jared-goff-out-of-college Truthfire for @Mind Character and @freakygeniuskid. 2 hours ago, freakygeniuskid said: Hey...I like Baker a lot. I just happen to think Sam Darnold is on the Aaron Rodgers path of development (Rodgers as a college prospect), and Josh Rosen is the purest skilled passer we've seen in quite some time. If there was no Rosen or no Darnold, I'd be glad to take Baker number 1 overall....seriously. But Darnold actually came out, and that's the comparison I make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 12 minutes ago, Mind Character said: The real comparison for Baker Mayfield in terms of pro play stye is Jeff Garcia at the height of his powers. That's not a slight as Garcia was a legit top 5 QB for multiple years with competitive fire and play action pass precision. Baker Mayfield has a rocket arm. Jeff Garcia had the arm strength of a drunk Stephen Hawking. He's much closer to Brees than he is to Garcia IMO. What makes him not as good as Brees as a prospect? Brees went in the 2nd round. Mayfield is going to go in the top 15. He's clearly more talented than Jeff Garcia ever was. I think they'll have similar playing styles, but the ceiling of Baker is significantly higher. Mayfield can play in a wide open deep ball offense like Pittsburgh runs or play in a pop-shot offense like we saw SF run when Garcia was at the helm. He's much more versatile because of his arm. I think you are overrating Garcia's arm of underrating Mayfields. Garcia had one of the weakest arms I've seen a starting QB have. I remember laughing watching him try to get the ball down the field to Owens. He had a noodle. Mayfield throws rockets. His arm strength covers both zip and distance. If you gave Garcia a great arm, he would have been a damn near elite QB in the NFL. This is what I see Mayfield having. If I had to come up with a comparison for Baker right now, I'm going with Russell Wilson. It's tough because Wilson is such a great QB and I don't like throwing out those lofty expectations, but like Mayfield, Wilson is a master at moving in the pocket, keeping his eyes down the field, and spinning it out accurately and with zip. Plus he can hit the moon balls when the defense plays up to the short stuff. Wilson is a slightly better athlete than Mayfield is, but that's the only thing I see as different. Oh, and the fact that Wilson had experience playing under center and working within a pro style offense. So Wilson was ready for the NFL faster than Mayfield will be, but in terms of athletic traits, size, and the way in which they get the job done as passers and runners, they are eerily similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BleedTheClock Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 7 minutes ago, Mind Character said: Hey...I like Baker a lot. I just happen to think Sam Darnold is on the Aaron Rodgers path of development (Rodgers as a college prospect), and Josh Rosen is the purest skilled passer we've seen in quite some time. If there was no Rosen or no Darnold, I'd be glad to take Baker number 1 overall....seriously. But Darnold actually came out, and that's the comparison I make. It might sound weird to say, but Baker might be the safest picks of all the top QB's. I think the safest is Rosen because of his mechanics, but people seem to hate his attitude for some reason and act like he's going to be a problem child. I'd rank the QB's in terms of safeness: 1. Josh Rosen 2. Baker Mayfield 3. Sam Darnold 4. Josh Allen 5. Kurt Benkert Darnold has a lot of flaws that were not exposed until this season. I hate his fumbling issue the most. He seems oblivious to backside pressure and can't seem to grasp the concept that you need to put 2 hands on the ball. It's mind-boggling that he continues to fumble the exact same way over and over again and hasn't realized how to fix this. I still like Darnold a lot too, but he has some big flaws as well. His footwork isn't better than Rosen's and his awareness seems questionable. He has a great arm and tremendous deep ball accuracy, but he's going to need to improve his focus to be an elite NFL QB. My current ranking of the QB's in the order that I want them: 1. Baker Mayfield 2. Sam Darnold 3. Josh Rosen 4. Josh Allen 5. Lamar Jackson The top 3 on that list will probably move all over the place throughout the draft process, but right now I'm going with Baker. If you would have told me he would go in the 1st round last year, I would have told you you're nuts. Now I'm leaning towards him being the top QB in a strong QB class. Maybe I'm in need of some psyc meds, but I haven't really heard a strong argument against Baker...other than his height, which was not an issue for him at any level thus far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdrawkcab321 Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 1 hour ago, freakygeniuskid said: I like him as a prospect but we shouldn’t put too much stock into this. It’s just cliche generic pre draft talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 @BleedTheClock Jeff Garcia as a weak-armed guy is a misconception. The comparison was based on PLAY STYLES. Jeff Garcia balled in this league early before serious neck and spine injuries. I said Jeff Garcia at the height of his powers. That's multiple 30+ TD, play action accuracy and deep shot SF 49ers Jeff Garcia. Not Cleveland and Philly Garcia. Their frenetic pocket movement along with various other attributes of their play styles matched up exactly to me. It's hard to underrate Baker's arm when I believe and said: 44 minutes ago, Mind Character said: One of the best Play Action deep ball throwers you'll find. If you watched Russell Wilson's college career and think Baker's play style resembles Russells' I don't know what to tell you...I couldn't disagree more. I made my points regarding their play styles. You made yours. I agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 The idea that Baker was better than Goff as a prospect is about the silliest thing I've seen. Charlie Casserly thought Goff was a second round pick at best, and I laughed when he said so on NFLN until he had to mock him much higher. Goff had better pocket poise, and pressure avoidance movement, and pro RPO ability and fearlessness than almost any QB prospect in the last 10 years. His accuracy and ball placement was on an entirely different level. He was battle tested and under duress every single game of Goff had his issues as well in terms of personality/demeanor, body frame maturity, fumbles, etc. Most serious QB evals had big grades on Goff and Wentz, but the majority preferred and had a bigger grade on Goff. Those same people don't even have close to as big a grade on Baker. Just like all white receivers are compared to other white receivers so are short QBs compared to each other. Baker's play style is nothing like Russell Wilson's, Johnny Manziel, or Drew Brees... To say so means one didn't really watch those guys closely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 11 minutes ago, Mind Character said: Most serious QB evals had big grades on Goff and Wentz, but the majority preferred and had a bigger grade on Goff. Sort of the opposite with Darnold and Rosen this year. 12 minutes ago, Mind Character said: Those same people don't even have close to as big a grade on Baker. How do they grade Darnold and Rosen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 1 hour ago, bruceb said: How do they grade Darnold and Rosen? Higher than Baker. Some Darnold over Rosen. Some Rosen over Darnold. All thought to be worth of franchise QB1 grades for number 1 overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 1 minute ago, Mind Character said: Higher than Baker. Some Darnold over Rosen. Some Rosen over Darnold. All thought to be worth of franchise QB1 grades for number 1 overall. ty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkronsWitness Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 I saw a scout tweet that if Baker Mayfield was 2 inches taller he would be the best QB prospect since Andrew Luck. Apparently he lit up the Senior Bowl today and looked clearly like the best passer, especially over Josh Allen. Another note was that he was asked for the first time to take snaps from under center and by the end of the practice one scout said it looked like he has been doing doing it for a year, speaking to his ability to be coached and learn quickly. Im not taking him #1 overall for the same reasons everybody is too skeptical about him, but man I would 100% grab him at #4 before the Broncos/Jets/Cards. The reason that somebody pointed out that makes him special is his insanely good intermediate/timing route accuracy. Apparently he made Allen and others look like D2 prospects today with his intermediate throws. They also said while everybody was gushing over Allen hitting a few beautiful deep throws, thats not nearly as important as intermediate/short accuracy. Saying thats what seperates guys like Manning, Brees, Brady, Rodgers from the pack because games are won by the QB being able to pick you apart in the intermediate game and convert at a very high rate on those 2nd+8 or 3rd+6 situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pnies20 Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 We're going to take him at 4. BOOK IT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, pnies20 said: We're going to take him at 4. BOOK IT If we like him most of all QBs we should take him at 1. If we don't like him quite as much as Darnold/Rosen then we should select Darnold/Rosen. If we have all three rated exactly the same with everything factored in, then yeah we can wait until 4 but that is the only time I would wait. Even then, if we take Baker at 1, say Rosen goes 2 then the Colts are trading the #3 pick to a team wanting Darnold and we get any player at 4 that we could have taken at 1 anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonanza23 Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 Wow the Mayfield hype is real. Love you senior bowl. Until the underwear bowl. Then the hype is real. Until the draft... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruceb Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 Dorsey seems like a no nonsense guy. Not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but not unintelligent. I just hope his vision and judgment are not clouded by visions of Farve and that he sees his way clear to Darnold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 25, 2018 Share Posted January 25, 2018 15 minutes ago, bruceb said: Dorsey seems like a no nonsense guy. Not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but not unintelligent. I just hope his vision and judgment are not clouded by visions of Farve and that he sees his way clear to Darnold. No truer post. I'm worried for that very reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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