2.45 - Edgerrin Cooper [LB; Texas A&M]

[Old Guy]

48 minutes ago, skibrett15 said:

this guy is not a pass rusher though.  More of a guy who got sacks on blitzes.

More Nick Barnett than KGB.

Nobody is Micah Parsons.

Agree! Most of Parson's sack his first year I do believe were from a LB position rushing inside. 

The first line however, I don't necessarily agree with. LBers in a base defense getting sacks are always on blitzes. He got a lot of them rushing from his linebacker position. 

[vegas492]

Man.  If only Joe Barry were still here.  I see CB1 potential in Cooper.

[ThatJerkDave]

2 hours ago, vegas492 said:

Man.  If only Joe Barry were still here.  I see CB1 potential in Cooper.

[craig]

12 hours ago, vegas492 said:

...He's no thinker, so let's just turn him loose....

This is my hesitancy.  We can like the measurables, and the highlights.  But how many good LBers are dumb?  Can he think and process fast enough to be good?  How many plays are decided by mistakes, whose frequency is not measured into RAS.  I'm not saying he's dumb or won't be smart or instinctive enough to play.  But I do admit I'm kinda nervous about it.  

[Refugee]

12 hours ago, vegas492 said:

Betcha our DC pointed at this Cooper and said "Me Want!".

Here is what I hope.  I hope we do not let him think...like at all.  Let Quay think.  I want Cooper to have a clear assignment.  Go get the ball.  See it, run to it.  If you are in coverage, get deep, see it and go get it.  

He's a monster when he can attack.  Get those big bodies in front of him to keep him and Quay clean and let them both eat.

And the dude simply needs some reps on the EDGE or blitzing the gaps.

He's no thinker, so let's just turn him loose.

Sidenote:  pretty thrilled to have two loose cannons at ILB.  I just hope we don't coach the "dawg" out of him and Quay.

I think LB coach Campanile might become a fan favorite similar to Mike Smith or Kevin Greene. Ok, not Greene, that guy was an all timer but I believe we have  a coach that will coach his guys to be smart but let them hunt, which is important in this kind of scheme. The middle of the field guys can’t over pursue but hopefully the aggressive front allows them a beat to key in on where the ball is going and to attack. Until I see otherwise I’m just going to imagine GB has a top 5 defense by the end of the season. 

[HyponGrey]

6 hours ago, Refugee said:

I think LB coach Campanile might become a fan favorite similar to Mike Smith or Kevin Greene. Ok, not Greene, that guy was an all timer but I believe we have  a coach that will coach his guys to be smart but let them hunt, which is important in this kind of scheme. The middle of the field guys can’t over pursue but hopefully the aggressive front allows them a beat to key in on where the ball is going and to attack. Until I see otherwise I’m just going to imagine GB has a top 5 defense by the end of the season. 

I just want to see Quay stack and shed.

[vegas492]

10 hours ago, craig said:

This is my hesitancy.  We can like the measurables, and the highlights.  But how many good LBers are dumb?  Can he think and process fast enough to be good?  How many plays are decided by mistakes, whose frequency is not measured into RAS.  I'm not saying he's dumb or won't be smart or instinctive enough to play.  But I do admit I'm kinda nervous about it.  

Naw.  Give him an assignment and turn him loose.  Let him play on instinct.  That's how I'd use him.  Of course we are going to teach him tendencies so he processes what is going on in front of him, but his strength is "see it, hit it".

When I say he's no thinker, I don't mean to imply that he is football dumb.  Clearly he is not.  But speed and violence is his game.  Let's let Quay do the thinking so that Coop can run and hit.  

[vegas492]

Our DL coach and scheme is going to be really important.  If we can keep these ILB's clean, no doubt we will have a fast, physical defense.  They ain't choir boys, either, and I dig that.

[Spartacus]

12 hours ago, craig said:

This is my hesitancy.  We can like the measurables, and the highlights.  But how many good LBers are dumb?  Can he think and process fast enough to be good?  How many plays are decided by mistakes, whose frequency is not measured into RAS.  I'm not saying he's dumb or won't be smart or instinctive enough to play.  But I do admit I'm kinda nervous about it.  

There is a vast ocean of difference between being intelligent in a specific field and a good test taker. Plenty of studies have shown major flaws in pretty much every major IQ or intelligence rating test in existence. All I care about is football smarts when playing football and this guy has got it. My brother failed the ASVAB so bad they couldn't even tie him to a tank for extra armor... The dude builds houses for a living now and from helping him he does WAY more math then I have ever had to do in the Marines or my desk job. Some people just think differently. 

[Kampfgeist]

12 hours ago, craig said:

This is my hesitancy.  We can like the measurables, and the highlights.  But how many good LBers are dumb?  Can he think and process fast enough to be good?  How many plays are decided by mistakes, whose frequency is not measured into RAS.  I'm not saying he's dumb or won't be smart or instinctive enough to play.  But I do admit I'm kinda nervous about it.  

Rumors are Edgerrin Cooper scored an 11 on his wonderlic, which is really low.    However, it was reported that Quay Walker scored a 9, making Cooper a veritable mensa.  I looked at two different sites each showing a different avg for an NFL linebacker -- either 19 or 23.6 (which is a big gap - don't know the discrepancy).      For comparisons, here are avg wonderlic scores for various jobs:  21 train conductor, receptionist, firefighter, cashier     18 - craftsmen   17- security guard  14 - janitor

Some linebacker wonderlics reported over the years:  Kyle Van Noy 16  Lavonte David 16 Jadaveon Clowney 14 Ray Lewis 13 Reggie Ragland 10  Bobby Wagner 13   ( a couple Hall of Famers in that group).       Good number of very successful RB's and WR's scored in that 6-15 range fwiw

Positively:  Edge Cooper did say in an interview that he spent a good amount of his visit on whiteboard stuff.   I think the Packers really tested his learning abilities and obviously felt comfortable enough with the results - at least enough to take the leap at 45.      It will be interesting to see come camp whether Quay, Cooper or McKinney are expected to be the green dot guy - my money is on McKinney.   Only 4-5 teams have a non-linebacker green dot so will be interesting to watch.     

I'm assuming the plan for Cooper is to let him play a year of ball before adding any addtl communication responsibilities.  Is Quay at that experience point now where the team doesn't have to free him of extra responsibilities to play fast and free?      Will he need a year adjustment period in a new defensive scheme before that's the case again?    Does McKinney allow Quay and Cooper to play to their strengths and just to see-ball get-ball

 

[incognito_man]

I have to admit that that part of it is a concern for me w/ Quay and Cooper. Clearly our staff doesn't prioritize it. Will McKinney get the green dot on defense?

[packfanfb]

45 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

I have to admit that that part of it is a concern for me w/ Quay and Cooper. Clearly our staff doesn't prioritize it. Will McKinney get the green dot on defense?

IIRC correctly, you can have more than one guy designated for it. I still think McDuffie will be one of them. He may not be a three-down player, but I fully expect him to still be one of the starting LBs (in our 3-LB sets) to start the season. McKinney will probably be one as well because he'll probably never leave the field. 

[Packerraymond]

On 4/29/2024 at 11:48 AM, Old Guy said:

Is this dude a poor man's Micah Parsons? Sacks, fumbles, TFL. He sounds to me like a poor man's Micah Parsons. 

He's not Micah Parsons whatsoever. There is no raw power to Edge's game. He gets blocked, it's over. Parsons is one of the elite block shedders in the game. Cooper is a classic run and chase LB, and he can be elite at that, but he is not a take-on LB that can shed or bull rush OL. He will get 2-4 sacks a season from blitzing, there's absolutely no reason to utilize him as a 3rd down rusher over the stable of DL we have, he won't be effective. 

[incognito_man]

28 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

He's not Micah Parsons whatsoever. There is no raw power to Edge's game. He gets blocked, it's over. Parsons is one of the elite block shedders in the game. Cooper is a classic run and chase LB, and he can be elite at that, but he is not a take-on LB that can shed or bull rush OL. He will get 2-4 sacks a season from blitzing, there's absolutely no reason to utilize him as a 3rd down rusher over the stable of DL we have, he won't be effective. 

I dunno, I saw some reps where he clearly turns speed into power. He needs to launch though because he's undersized. But he's violent and explosive.

But Parsons is whole different level physically. Different tiers. Cooper would need to add 15 lbs of usable mass and get more explosive while doing so. Not impossible, but not very likely either.

[Packerraymond]

8 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

I dunno, I saw some reps where he clearly turns speed into power. He needs to launch though because he's undersized. But he's violent and explosive.

But Parsons is whole different level physically. Different tiers. Cooper would need to add 15 lbs of usable mass and get more explosive while doing so. Not impossible, but not very likely either.

Violent and explosive? Absolutely. He's not powerful though, there's no blowback or drive when he collides with a RB in pass pro. I just didn't see it. He's actually better in coverage to me than he was pass rushing. Excellent blitzer, but putting him on the LOS like a DE/EDGE just isn't his game. We should green dog blitz as much as humanly possible though, man can he close.