Josh McDaniels Decides to Stay with New England

[childofpudding]

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2018/02/07/josh-mcdaniels-colts-era-how-all-fell-apart/312617002/

Not going to quote the whole thing but it's a good story.

[MacReady]

Just now, childofpudding said:

aww, you're a cute lil' fella

I know I am.  And you're an obnoxious little pissant.

[KManX89]

10 hours ago, TankWilliams said:

They had a contract in principle with a guy who said he would accept it after the playoffs ended, and he was clearly their top choice.  How is it their fault that he ended up backing out?  Just because they didn't rush into a decision and force themselves into taking a guy they liked less just because they could sign him earlier?  The only mistake they made was in judging McDaniels character IMO.  

Exactly, we're not talking about a guy who was simply given a better offer, we're talking about a guy who straight-up conned a team and several new assistant coaches and leaving their families high and dry in the process. It was a total d!ck move and he deserves all the hate he's getting. Kraft and Billy B aren't innocent in this, either, conveniently waiting until the 11th hour before a team was set to announce him as their new HC after already agreeing in principle and having assistant coaches move across the country to work under him to woo him into staying. Then again, nothing this club does really surprises me at ths point. 

Anyone who thinks this won't affect him professionally is delusional. No GM wants a known conman who poses a very real risk of backing out on them. For his sake, he better hope Brady and Belichick have a slew of good years left in them because when he takes over as HC, he's gonna feel the weight of the world on his shoulders. No other team in their right mind will hire him after the shyt they've pulled.

Edited February 8, 2018 by KManX89

[childofpudding]

1 minute ago, KManX89 said:

Exactly, we're not talking about a guy who was simply given a better offer, we're talking about a guy who straight-up conned a team and several new assistant coaches and leaving their families high and dry in the process. It was a total d!ck move and he deserves all the hate he's getting. Kraft and Billy B aren't innocent in this, either, conveniently waiting until the 11th hour before a team was set to announce him as their new HC after already agreeing in principle and having assistant coaches move across the country to work under him to woo him into staying. Then again, nothing this club does really surprises me at ths point. 

Anyone who thinks this won't affect him professionally is delusional. No GM wants a known conman who poses a very real risk of backing out on them. For his sake, he better hope Brady and Belichick have a slew of good years left in them because when he takes over as HC, he's gonna feel the weight of the world on his shoulders. No other team in their right mind will hire him after the shyt they've pulled.

He didn't con a team. He was 100% planning on joining the Colts and got a better last-minute offer. Slimy, sure, but not a con in the least.

Patriots never address coaching changes until after the season is over.

Chill lol

[TheKillerNacho]

4 minutes ago, childofpudding said:

He didn't con a team. He was 100% planning on joining the Colts and got a better last-minute offer. Slimy, sure, but not a con in the least.

Patriots never address coaching changes until after the season is over.

Chill lol

Honestly the worst part of this, for me, is the assistants he left hanging in Indy. He didn't even bother to call them, they found out when the news broke like everyone else, lol.

[childofpudding]

2 minutes ago, TheKillerNacho said:

Honestly the worst part of this, for me, is the assistants he left hanging in Indy. He didn't even bother to call them, they found out when the news broke like everyone else, lol.

He did call them. Or at the very least, it's disputed whether he called them or not. But yeah, either way that was a ****ty thing to do to them.

 

[lancerman]

20 minutes ago, KManX89 said:

Exactly, we're not talking about a guy who was simply given a better offer, we're talking about a guy who straight-up conned a team and several new assistant coaches and leaving their families high and dry in the process. It was a total d!ck move and he deserves all the hate he's getting. Kraft and Billy B aren't innocent in this, either, conveniently waiting until the 11th hour before a team was set to announce him as their new HC after already agreeing in principle and having assistant coaches move across the country to work under him to woo him into staying. Then again, nothing this club does really surprises me at ths point. 

Anyone who thinks this won't affect him professionally is delusional. No GM wants a known conman who poses a very real risk of backing out on them. For his sake, he better hope Brady and Belichick have a slew of good years left in them because when he takes over as HC, he's gonna feel the weight of the world on his shoulders. No other team in their right mind will hire him after the shyt they've pulled.

Conned is a strong word. Every single report says he was literally on his way to clean out his office and was intercepted by Kraft and Belichick. Con implies that he was always going to do this. He just got a last minute counter offer that he couldn't refuse. That's the way things go sometimes. 

As far as the assistants, these aren't players. They have guaranteed contracts. The worst thing McDaniels might have done is they go to Indy and get to prove themselves for a year on a contract where they are making more than they likely ever had before. Or Irsay says screw it and buys out their contract in which case they get to figure out what they want to do over the next few months while having a large sum of money. That aspect to it is so overblown. They have a safety net. Not the ideal situation. But they aren't up the creek without a paddle. 

Also Kraft and Bill Belichick spent the last few weeks worrying about a playoff run and a Super Bowl. And tbh I wouldn't be surprised if the outcome of the Super Bowl played a large part in that where they saw their defense get shredded and their offense being the only thing that kept them in the game and they didn't want to worry about a new OC when they had a big defensive undertaking in the off season.

As far as professionally, people just aren't going to commit to him until he signs a contract. That's it. It's funny you have people like Rich Eisen spreading that notion, and then guys who are actually in loop like Adam Schefter laughing that  off. If right now the best HC candidate was someone who backed out on a team before, the Colts would still talk to him. I really don't think people in this thread are quite appreciating the predicament of a team searching for a HC. I also really don't think people understand how an OC who has led Super Bowl winning offenses and the best offenses in the league over the last several years are perceived by executive in the NFL. Even with Brady on the offense. Years ago I'm sure Denver fans were convinced he'd never get another chance. He did. He will again, assuming he likely isn't getting the NE HC job. Which is something he really coveted.

[lancerman]

 

26 minutes ago, TheKillerNacho said:

Honestly the worst part of this, for me, is the assistants he left hanging in Indy. He didn't even bother to call them, they found out when the news broke like everyone else, lol.

This is the one thing I don't get people getting upset about. One it's been reported he called them. 

Second, they have contracts. Guaranteed contracts. The Colts are either going to keep them on for a year and pay them or buy out their contracts. Either way they are getting paid. So they either get a year to prove themselves and get paid (which is essentially what they were doing before, because if Josh crapped the bed again, I doubt he's lasting more than a year) or they are getting paid to take a break while they figure out their next move. It's not the perfect situation anymore. But they didn't get screwed. If anything Josh got them more money for a year than they've been making before.

[Buc Ball]

I’m interested to see what the counter-offer from the Pats was. Secondly, I’m interested in why, despite McDaniels being linked with HC jobs for months, if not years, it took the Pats until he’d been announced as the HC of another team to make that counter-offer.

They could have done it long before they eventually did it. What changed and why should McDaniels have any faith that BB/Kraft will honour it?

[Buc Ball]

11 minutes ago, lancerman said:

 

This is the one thing I don't get people getting upset about. One it's been reported he called them. 

Second, they have contracts. Guaranteed contracts. The Colts are either going to keep them on for a year and pay them or buy out their contracts. Either way they are getting paid. So they either get a year to prove themselves and get paid (which is essentially what they were doing before, because if Josh crapped the bed again, I doubt he's lasting more than a year) or they are getting paid to take a break while they figure out their next move. It's not the perfect situation anymore. But they didn't get screwed. If anything Josh got them more money for a year than they've been making before.

The fact they were joining McDaniels’ staff would have factored into their decision to leave whichever other job they were in to pursue the one with the Colts. They wouldn’t necessarily have accepted the same job if it had been for another HC.

Some of these guys may have burned a bridge with whichever coaching staff they came from or traded a relatively safe job for a promotion/ different responsibility. Now that they don’t know who they will be working for, they have no way of knowing whether the opportunity that they were lead to believe they were getting will be the opportunity that they actually get.

Its a poor show from McDaniels and to suggest that he’s done them a favour, for example because they’re getting paid more, shows absolutely no understanding of the issue.

[lancerman]

1 minute ago, Buc Ball said:

I’m interested to see what the counter-offer from the Pats was. Secondly, I’m interested in why, despite McDaniels being linked with HC jobs for months, if not years, it took the Pats until he’d been announced as the HC of another team to make that counter-offer.

They could have done it long before they eventually did it. What changed and why should McDaniels have any faith that BB/Kraft will honour it?

It was rumored that their intentions beyond Belichick and their commitment to McDaniels were played pretty close to the vest for awhile. Presumably they opened up to Josh about their plans going forward and also said Belichick would take a greater role in mentoring him on the salary cap and roster management aspects of his job (which is kind of funny, because the Colts probably thought they were getting a guy who knew all of Belichick's tricks). They probably gave him a commitment that he didn't have previously, which included some sort of timeline for Belichick's departure. Sounded like he didn't really want to move his family all that much. The Colts would have needed that and I think there's a fear there that Luck's future is uncertain and McDaniel's would only have 2 years at most to right the ship before they dropped him. The Patriots saying "keep your family here, we'll Belichick's here for x years, you have a commitment for those x years, and wink wink, we are mentoring you". Then you consider that, aside from 3 years, he's been with the Patriots since 2001 in some capacity. He knows the owner (better than Irsay) he knows the coach and GM (better than he knows Ballard), he's spent most of his time living in the area, he has a great relationship with the QB, he is getting a more active role in learning under Belichick, he probably has a timeline of commitment, likely and understanding of succession plans and yes they probably said something like "how much is Indy paying you, let's see how close we can get".

I think what changed is they realized how bad their defense was this year and how much their offense had been carrying them and now they have more players on the defensive side leaving and the DC leaving so Belichick needs to spend more time there. They wanted the offense to stay the way it was.

[TheKillerNacho]

24 minutes ago, lancerman said:

 

This is the one thing I don't get people getting upset about. One it's been reported he called them. 

Second, they have contracts. Guaranteed contracts. The Colts are either going to keep them on for a year and pay them or buy out their contracts. Either way they are getting paid. So they either get a year to prove themselves and get paid (which is essentially what they were doing before, because if Josh crapped the bed again, I doubt he's lasting more than a year) or they are getting paid to take a break while they figure out their next move. It's not the perfect situation anymore. But they didn't get screwed. If anything Josh got them more money for a year than they've been making before.

That's disputed. Some sources say they were blindsided.

Also its not exactly a good situation for them, being forced on a HC like that. And being that Indy's defensive talent is rather sub-par, they are the easy scapegoat.

But more than that, these coaches moved their families so they could work under Josh McDaniels.

[lancerman]

Just now, TheKillerNacho said:

That's disputed. Some sources say they were blindsided.

Also its not exactly a good situation for them, being forced on a HC like that. And being that Indy's defensive talent is rather sub-par, they are the easy scapegoat.

 

1 minute ago, Buc Ball said:

The fact they were joining McDaniels’ staff would have factored into their decision to leave whichever other job they were in to pursue the one with the Colts. They wouldn’t necessarily have accepted the same job if it had been for another HC.

Some of these guys may have burned a bridge with whichever coaching staff they came from or traded a relatively safe job for a promotion/ different responsibility. Now that they don’t know who they will be working for, they have no way of knowing whether the opportunity that they were lead to believe they were getting will be the opportunity that they actually get.

Its a poor show from McDaniels and to suggest that he’s done them a favour, for example because they’re getting paid more, shows absolutely no understanding of the issue.

Like I said, it's not an ideal situation. The ideal situation is Josh goes there and kills it and they have job security for 5-6 years and they prove themselves and get promotions and HC jobs elsewhere. 

However, it's just as possible they sign a contract, the teams sucks, someone better comes on the market that expresses interest, Irsay goes after someone knew. And they are in the exact same situation. Actually a worse situation because now they are labeled as failures. Josh can still be an OC somewhere because he has that cache, they don't. 

The reality is, they have a guaranteed contract, it's in all likelihood worth more than their last jobs, and they will either have security for a year OR get bought out and have more than enough money to live on. The best case scenario from there is they are kept on, they kill it, Ballard makes it clear he wants them to stay on. Worst case is they are sitting at home with a lot of money they didn't have to work for while they look for a new job. Oh and there's 32 teams in league, every single one of them knows what happened here, it's never going to be held against them the next time they look for jobs. 

It's not an ideal situation. But it's getting blown up into more than it is. It's not like in the week or so they signed that they sold their houses and are already moved to Indy and now are out of a job with no money. Using them as the argument of "wow Josh McDaniel's is evil for doing this" also shows no understanding of the issue. They have security and they have money. And now they have time. 

[cddolphin]

2 hours ago, childofpudding said:

https://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/2018/02/07/josh-mcdaniels-colts-era-how-all-fell-apart/312617002/

Not going to quote the whole thing but it's a good story.

Ballard said all the right things until "The Rivalry is back on".

It really isn't, that's just pride speaking and bulletin board material for Belichick. Pats just lost in a SB. The Colts own the 3rd pick and have a ton invested in a QB with a bum shoulder.

[Forge]

2 hours ago, HorizontoZenith said:

3 hours ago, childofpudding said:

aww, you're a cute lil' fella

I know I am.  And you're an obnoxious little pissant.

@childofpudding

@HorizontoZenith

This is an official warning. Pudding, you were warned earlier in this thread about the trollish posts. Horizon, you absolutely know better than this.