Winners & Losers from Day One

[TENINCH]

11 hours ago, Lilseb93 said:

That's my biggest issue with him. I think he's the best QB in the draft, but every time I see him in an interview he rubs me the wrong away. I feel he's going to create tension with people around him. There's just something about the way he speaks and what he says that feels obnoxious. 

He's been hanging around Rodgers too much

[BStanRamFan]

59 minutes ago, Uncle Buck said:

It's possible they blew it big time, but to be fair, we will all have to see how Mayfield plays over the next 2-3 years.  Chubb was the obvious pick on the defensive side of the ball, but Ward is more than likely going to be a great player for them when the all dust settles.

Well we won't know anything for anyone this early lol This is all on paper. But Barkley and CHubb were arguably #1 and #3 overall and the Browns passed on both. It's just sad they keep botching drafts like this.

[goldfishwars]

I know the Seahawks have a different value system to other teams, but spending a 1st round pick on a player who wasn't regarded as a first rounder at a non-pressing area, when there are several, is kind of unforgivable. Schneider has built up a lot of good will, but the veneer has been off for a while now. Especially when it comes to to the draft. 

[Iamcanadian]

Winners:

Buffalo and the Jets by a mile, they both could be set up to dominate their division post Brady!!! Denver is in a similar position with the Chubb pick!!!

Baltimore - If Jackson can even approach Vick's escapability, they could be the biggest winners in this draft!!!

 

Losers:

NY Giants - Barkley had better pan out for a long career, because they passed up the opportunity to add substantial assets through a trade back and for a team that looks to be in a rebuilding mode, it was time to think that way and not believe you are just one player from a playoff team.

Cleveland - They settled for the 2nd best players available each pick, Mayfield over Darnold and Ward over Chubb???

Arizona - unwilling to pay the price to get Allen instead of Rosen. When Rosen had lost a couple of seasons to injury, they will really wonder why they did not move up past Buffalo???

Indy - If Luck never makes it all the way back to be the player he once was, they will seriously regret passing on a QB???

San Fran - Not a fan of McGlinchey, huge reach as a top 10 pick!!!

Oakland - Miller was another huge reach that high!

[Tugboat]

I don't think getting Josh Allen at 7 is really a "loss".  That one will take a while to come good, or blow up on them.  But at the end of the day, they very well may have got their top QB without trading everything to go up and get him.  I'd actually call that a win.

It's how they followed that pick up that i think makes them "losers" imo.  Edmunds is an alright prospect, though somewhat risky...he's got upside.  It's about the way they blew pretty all the rest of their premium draft capital on him that seems kinda daft.  If you're going to do the whole "Josh Allen Franchise QB" thing, you can't just roll on with an OLine that's kind of in shambles, and very little in the way of quality weapons (outside of Shady obviously).  To not have another pick for quite a while now, and have not shored that stuff up at all...it's easy to see this thing going sideways quickly.  It's already going to be a tough spot for Allen to survive, where AJ McCarron isn't going to last the year as "stopgap starter".  To not invest in supporting pieces for your new franchise guy on top of that...yuck.  That's what makes them "losers" for me.

 

Along with the Raiders who very "smartly" traded down for a bit of extra value...before overdrafting a guy by a full round or arguably two.

And the Seahawks, who don't really appear to have a clue how to fix their busted run game.  Fortify the OLine and yardage will follow from that.  Not overdrafting a "homerun hitter" RB like Penny.

 

I don't love the price the Saints paid to go up and get Davenport, but i think he's one of really only 2 "bluechip" pass rushers.  So, with a rapidly closing window on Drew Brees, i can understand paying what it costs to make sure you get the piece you think can put you over the top.

[TENINCH]

2 hours ago, Nastradamus said:

Lions a huge win, 14th rated player on PFF, huge need, great character, scheme versatile etc etc. 

RAGNOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW

He's a Minnesotan....that's why!!

[Duke5217]

2 minutes ago, goldfishwars said:

I know the Seahawks have a different value system to other teams, but spending a 1st round pick on a player who wasn't regarded as a first rounder at a non-pressing area, when there are several, is kind of unforgivable. Schneider has built up a lot of good will, but the veneer has been off for a while now. Especially when it comes to to the draft. 

Agree. The Hawks have not drafted particularly well for a few years now. Last years draft was ok, but there top pick is never going to play a down of football. 

[Sacks98]

1 minute ago, goldfishwars said:

I know the Seahawks have a different value system to other teams, but spending a 1st round pick on a player who wasn't regarded as a first rounder at a non-pressing area, when there are several, is kind of unforgivable. Schneider has built up a lot of good will, but the veneer has been off for a while now. Especially when it comes to to the draft. 

That's the thing though team's don't go by what the draft experts think.

[goldfishwars]

2 minutes ago, Tugboat said:

I don't think getting Josh Allen at 7 is really a "loss".  That one will take a while to come good, or blow up on them.  But at the end of the day, they very well may have got their top QB without trading everything to go up and get him.  I'd actually call that a win.

It's how they followed that pick up that i think makes them "losers" imo.  Edmunds is an alright prospect, though somewhat risky...he's got upside.  It's about the way they blew pretty all the rest of their premium draft capital on him that seems kinda daft.  If you're going to do the whole "Josh Allen Franchise QB" thing, you can't just roll on with an OLine that's kind of in shambles, and very little in the way of quality weapons (outside of Shady obviously).  To not have another pick for quite a while now, and have not shored that stuff up at all...it's easy to see this thing going sideways quickly.  It's already going to be a tough spot for Allen to survive, where AJ McCarron isn't going to last the year as "stopgap starter".  To not invest in supporting pieces for your new franchise guy on top of that...yuck.  That's what makes them "losers" for me.

Yeah, I think that's well put. The trade up and selection of Edmunds makes the Josh Allen pick look worse than it is. I personally wouldn't have drafted Allen top ten, but I don't have a major issue with the price it cost to get him. 

[Iamcanadian]

7 minutes ago, Tugboat said:

I don't think getting Josh Allen at 7 is really a "loss".  That one will take a while to come good, or blow up on them.  But at the end of the day, they very well may have got their top QB without trading everything to go up and get him.  I'd actually call that a win.

It's how they followed that pick up that i think makes them "losers" imo.  Edmunds is an alright prospect, though somewhat risky...he's got upside.  It's about the way they blew pretty all the rest of their premium draft capital on him that seems kinda daft.  If you're going to do the whole "Josh Allen Franchise QB" thing, you can't just roll on with an OLine that's kind of in shambles, and very little in the way of quality weapons (outside of Shady obviously).  To not have another pick for quite a while now, and have not shored that stuff up at all...it's easy to see this thing going sideways quickly.  It's already going to be a tough spot for Allen to survive, where AJ McCarron isn't going to last the year as "stopgap starter".  To not invest in supporting pieces for your new franchise guy on top of that...yuck.  That's what makes them "losers" for me.

 

Along with the Raiders who very "smartly" traded down for a bit of extra value...before overdrafting a guy by a full round or arguably two.

And the Seahawks, who don't really appear to have a clue how to fix their busted run game.  Fortify the OLine and yardage will follow from that.  Not overdrafting a "homerun hitter" RB like Penny.

 

I don't love the price the Saints paid to go up and get Davenport, but i think he's one of really only 2 "bluechip" pass rushers.  So, with a rapidly closing window on Drew Brees, i can understand paying what it costs to make sure you get the piece you think can put you over the top.

I disagree on your Buffalo comments. Winning franchises want game changers and Edwards has the potential to be a huge game changer as does Allen, teams that settle for average starters, remain in the middle or bottom of the pack for years, teams that find game changers win SB's!!!

[chris00cm]

27 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

I think the Redskins had the most "meh okay whatever" pick of the first round. 

 

Neither a winner or a loser.

Them and Steelers are getting off the hook because of other teams egregious errors. But yes, equally bad. 

[detroitroar]

Winners

Cardinals. Got the best Qb in the draft.

Chargers. Great value with James.

Losers

Buffalo. I dont like Allen at all. He just doesnt have the key qualities you want in a Qb.

Cleveland. Ward is great but I just personally dont believe in building from the outside in. He has to be an absolute shutdown corner to be worth it, which he may. Mayfield isnt a franchise qb imo.

Ravens. Great job trading down but im not a fan of Lamar at all.

[cddolphin]

12 hours ago, CWood21 said:

Tannehill isn't going to lead  you to the playoffs...

Like he when he last played in 2016?

12 hours ago, CWood21 said:

At least I'm optimistic about Rosen.  We know what Tannehill is.  An average starting QB.  He's not good by any means.

Most recent 8 games (this was during his first and only season with Gase):

Tannehill
7-1
161/233 for 69.1%
1,723 yards at 7.39 YPA
13 TDs - 5 INTs
100.1 passer rating

"Not good by any means". Even if he were merely average and him turning it up after getting comfortable with Gase was a mirage.. we've seen in 2017 what an average QB on a good team can do. Keenum, Foles, Bortles.

12 hours ago, JustAnotherFan said:

Tannehill is very replaceable. 

k

12 hours ago, Lilseb93 said:

Again, what's the point of having an elite QB if the rest of the team is a mess? I'm not the biggest supporter of Tanny, but the dude has had several different coaches, the worst O-line in football, and a lack of weapons. The defense has been a mess. I'd rather have a more complete team. 

Tanny had the best year of his career in 2016 before he got hurt. They are still going QB, but it was never in the plans that high this year. We desperately need another LB and a TE. We need another DT. 

They don't want to hear it

11 hours ago, Iamcanadian said:

It is my understanding that the HC loves Tannehill and just because he was injured most of last year, he was a winner the year before and there is no reason, he cannot be a winner again in the 2018 season.

There's a reason they restructured his contract.

10 hours ago, Lilseb93 said:

He does, but I do think Miami will get a QB somewhere in this draft. We need a young QB to groom. He had the best year of his career in 2016. They went on a long winning streak even if it wasn't pretty. They basically made the playoffs with him even if he did get hurt at the end. The guy has had numerous head coaches and offensive coordinators, the worst O-line in football (he got hit so much he was peeing blood), and a lack of weapons for the first couple of years of his career. He's not elite, but people talk about him like he completely sucks. He makes the right decisions, his deep ball actually got good, he can run, and he's efficient. He makes throws that trash QBs don't make. He's not elite in the the sense that he makes game changing plays, but he's a solid guy you can win with if you surround him with a good team. Maybe he could have been a great QB had he had consistent coaching and a better team. 

However, he's 30 and coming off an injury. I see why people want Miami to get a QB for sure. But It's not as big of a need as getting a stud defensive player who can change your whole defense. The defense is awful at covering passes in the middle of the field. They were God awful last year. Worse case scenario, Tanny gets hurt again and he's done here so they draft a QB high next year. People seem think Miami is a 2-14 team anyways so you might as well suck with a foundation piece on defense. Best care, Tanny is good again and they win games with a foundation piece on defense. 

I agree with all of this, totally. Tannehill is a good starting QB. However, the Dolphins need to draft a backup, that was made all to clear last season.

[Iamcanadian]

2 minutes ago, cddolphin said:

Like he when he last played in 2016?

Most recent 8 games (this was during his first and only season with Gase):

Tannehill
7-1
161/233 for 69.1%
1,723 yards at 7.39 YPA
13 TDs - 5 INTs
100.1 passer rating

"Not good by any means". Even if he were merely average and him turning it up after getting comfortable with Gase was a mirage.. we've seen in 2017 what an average QB on a good team can do. Keenum, Foles, Bortles.

k

They don't want to hear it

There's a reason they restructured his contract.

I agree with all of this, totally. Tannehill is a good starting QB. However, the Dolphins need to draft a backup, that was made all to clear last season.

You can count on about 2 fingers the # of solid backup QB's in the league and I thought the Dolphins did pretty well with their backup last year. Just not too many Foles or Garp's in the league and they are gone as soon as they are FA's.

[cddolphin]

Just now, Iamcanadian said:

You can count on about 2 fingers the # of solid backup QB's in the league and I thought the Dolphins did pretty well with their backup last year. Just not too many Foles or Garp's in the league and they are gone as soon as they are FA's.

Giving Cutler $10m when they were already paying Moore to be a veteran backup was a colussal screw-up by Gase, it's been the worst move of his 2 years in Miami bar none IMO. Moore was terrible but I doubt Cutler's addition was worth more than a win or two max. Moore was paid way too much for 3+ years to do jack squat, I guess he helped a bit in 2016. A bit.