AG20 2020 Mock Offseason

[Rainmaker90]

Just now, CWood21 said:

The personal shots aren't needed.  Stick to talking football.

Commenting on someone's mood is not remotely personal. Inconsistency. Should be uniform rules across the board, no? 

[CWood21]

Just now, Rainmaker90 said:

Commenting on someone's mood is not remotely personal. Inconsistency. Should be uniform rules across the board, no? 

That is literally the definition of a personal attack.  If you would like to discuss rules infractions, feel free to PM me.

[SSG]

It's going to be a tight off-season if Buluga is extended for market value and we don't find money elsewhere (restructures or possible extensions).  

[AlexGreen#20]

36 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

Someone is in a sour mood today. I'm not whining about Graham, he's just past his prime. Ok the FA class is weak. Still can work around it. Not like we need a #1

 

 

You have all the numbers you need in this thread to come up with a different approach. 

OT and DL need to be addressed. After that, pick your choice of the non-premiums to address, WR, TE, or ILB. There's higher quality prospect type bodies at WR (Lazard, EQ, MVS, Kumerow) and TE (Sternberger, Tonyan, Lewis) than ILB (Goodson, Burks, Summers, Bolton).

[Scoremore]

2 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

You have all the numbers you need in this thread to come up with a different approach. 

OT and DL need to be addressed. After that, pick your choice of the non-premiums to address, WR, TE, or ILB. There's higher quality prospect type bodies at WR (Lazard, EQ, MVS, Kumerow) and TE (Sternberger, Tonyan, Lewis) than ILB (Goodson, Burks, Summers, Bolton).

Yep and yep.  OT and DL are the top priorities.   Not at all sure Bulaga will be back.  He may have priced himself out of GB.  Think Gutey will take a couple of stabs at WR supposed to be a very deep group this year.  May re-sign Martinez hope we at least burn a mid round pick on ILB.  Not sure we need to go TE.  We'll have Sternburger, Toynan, and probably bring back Lewis.  FA should be interesting.  Agree with others it would be best to get a veteran WR in FA.  Quicker learning curve.  Hopefully Gutenheimer can plug a few holes in FA to allow us to go BPA in the draft.

[Joe]

58 minutes ago, Scoremore said:

Yep and yep.  OT and DL are the top priorities.   Not at all sure Bulaga will be back.  He may have priced himself out of GB.  Think Gutey will take a couple of stabs at WR supposed to be a very deep group this year.  May re-sign Martinez hope we at least burn a mid round pick on ILB.  Not sure we need to go TE.  We'll have Sternburger, Toynan, and probably bring back Lewis.  FA should be interesting.  Agree with others it would be best to get a veteran WR in FA.  Quicker learning curve.  Hopefully Gutenheimer can plug a few holes in FA to allow us to go BPA in the draft.

I have to soundly disagree here. Agholor's got stone hands, Devin Funchess should've put on 10 more pounds and moved to TE, @Packerraymond hit it on the head with Green and Sanders, and Cooper has some questions surrounding his toughness IIRC. I just don't see a situation where you find a WR in FA this year TBH. Also, some of you keep forgetting that Javon Walker was the only WR that came to Green Bay and blew up year 1....and that was 2002. News flash: that ain't happening again. I have no problem with a WR in the 2nd as long as IDL and OT are addressed first.

I'm going to give a couple of hot takes here in the event we double or even triple dip at WR seeings how we're drooling over the class:

1. MVS might have played his way out of Green Bay at this point. He got one target on a bomb that was three inches in front of where he needed to be. Kumerow made that same grab later in the game.

2. We really don't know where ESB is in his development; he might become a WR2 if he picks off where he left off when he got hurt.

3. Lazard has basically made Allison expendable as suggested by the OP. You can slot him as WR4 at worst going into next year. Rodgers really likes him and Lazard had four years of college experience doing nothing but finding ways to get open when he was surrounded by nothing but chaos. Just think how well he'd function in a consistent offense.

4. Lazard puts Kumerow on the hotseat, but both of them probably push Allison and/or MVS out the door.

 

With all that in mind, we still need to address Safety despite the return of Raven Greene. Shyheim Carter does that for us in this mock. However, OT is still an area of need even if Bulaga comes back. We've seen enough of what happens when he goes down. It's time to slow our roll on TE and focus on what's next to it; especially with a weak TE class.

 

[Scoremore]

47 minutes ago, Joe said:

I have to soundly disagree here. Agholor's got stone hands, Devin Funchess should've put on 10 more pounds and moved to TE, @Packerraymond hit it on the head with Green and Sanders, and Cooper has some questions surrounding his toughness IIRC. I just don't see a situation where you find a WR in FA this year TBH. Also, some of you keep forgetting that Javon Walker was the only WR that came to Green Bay and blew up year 1....and that was 2002. News flash: that ain't happening again. I have no problem with a WR in the 2nd as long as IDL and OT are addressed first.

I'm going to give a couple of hot takes here in the event we double or even triple dip at WR seeings how we're drooling over the class:

1. MVS might have played his way out of Green Bay at this point. He got one target on a bomb that was three inches in front of where he needed to be. Kumerow made that same grab later in the game.

2. We really don't know where ESB is in his development; he might become a WR2 if he picks off where he left off when he got hurt.

3. Lazard has basically made Allison expendable as suggested by the OP. You can slot him as WR4 at worst going into next year. Rodgers really likes him and Lazard had four years of college experience doing nothing but finding ways to get open when he was surrounded by nothing but chaos. Just think how well he'd function in a consistent offense.

4. Lazard puts Kumerow on the hotseat, but both of them probably push Allison and/or MVS out the door.

 

With all that in mind, we still need to address Safety despite the return of Raven Greene. Shyheim Carter does that for us in this mock. However, OT is still an area of need even if Bulaga comes back. We've seen enough of what happens when he goes down. It's time to slow our roll on TE and focus on what's next to it; especially with a weak TE class.

 

How about Amari Cooper.  You know he's going to be a FA right?  Probably too much cash but man what an addition he'd be.  We could bring back Cobb.  Although he's really not a #2.  Danny Amendola?   Cody Lattimer?  Look not going to go through the whole list but some of these guys can play.  We are not going to draft a rookie who is going to produce right away.  Especially with Aaron Rodgers as our QB.  That is just a fact.  Either EQ or MVS step up or we go FA.  Granted some of the guys listed are lower level guys.  Doesn't mean they couldn't excel in GB either.   Give you one more Breshard Perriman.   Green no thanks I'll agree on that pass on Sanders as well.  Wanted Gute to trade for DaVante Parker with Miami.  That would have solved our problem.  Unfortunately he broke out shortly after and just signed a multi year contract.  Gotta be honest our WR situation is a mess.  Adams maybe Lazard that's about it.  Maybe Kumerow will come on but really we need more talent.  

[AlexGreen#20]

11 minutes ago, Scoremore said:

How about Amari Cooper.  You know he's going to be a FA right?  Probably too much cash but man what an addition he'd be.  We could bring back Cobb.  Although he's really not a #2.  Danny Amendola?   Cody Lattimer?  Look not going to go through the whole list but some of these guys can play.  We are not going to draft a rookie who is going to produce right away.  Especially with Aaron Rodgers as our QB.  That is just a fact.  Either EQ or MVS step up or we go FA.  Granted some of the guys listed are lower level guys.  Doesn't mean they couldn't excel in GB either.   Give you one more Breshard Perriman.   Green no thanks I'll agree on that pass on Sanders as well.  Wanted Gute to trade for DaVante Parker with Miami.  That would have solved our problem.  Unfortunately he broke out shortly after and just signed a multi year contract.  Gotta be honest our WR situation is a mess.  Adams maybe Lazard that's about it.  Maybe Kumerow will come on but really we need more talent.  

How are the Saints doing it?

[Scoremore]

30 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

How are the Saints doing it?

They have the #1 WR in the league.  Michael Thomas.  Tre'quane Smith, Ted Ginn, and also a legitimate TE in Jared Cook.  Would trade their group for ours in a heartbeat. To answer your question Thomas 1553 Cook 577 Ginn 411.  Using Kamara as well has 485 receiving yards.  Our top 4 guys Adams 722 MVS 427 Jones 425 Graham 382. Biggest difference is Thomas>Adams and Cook>Graham.  Not really close either.  Guess one could argue either a decent #2 WR or #1 TE.  

[AlexGreen#20]

2 minutes ago, Scoremore said:

They have the #1 WR in the league.  Michael Thomas.  Tre'quane Smith, Ted Ginn, and also a legitimate TE in Jared Cook.  Would trade their group for ours in a heartbeat. To answer your question Thomas 1553 Cook 577 Ginn 411.  Using Kamara as well has 485 receiving yards.  Our top 4 guys Adams 722 MVS 427 Jones 425 Graham 382. Biggest difference is Thomas>Adams and Cook>Graham.  Not really close either.  Guess one could argue either a decent #2 WR or #1 TE.  

So the Saints #2 receiver is 34 year old Ted Ginn Jr (who at no point in his career has ever broken 800 yards), and they're still killing it. The Saints #3 receiver is Tre'Quan Smith who has 12 catches all year and they're killing it.

But it's impossible for Rodgers to do well with limited talent at the #2 and #3 receiver spots.

The Packers had 29 year old Jared Cook for 10 games, he went 30/377. The Saints have had 32 year old Jared Cook for 12 games. He's at 38/577

The Saints RBs have 695 receiving yards. The Packer RBs have 677. It's not the running back receiving that's making a difference. 

We're not good at spreading the ball around. We're not good at forcing the ball to a single target. We're not particularly good at anything, and realistically haven't been for a number of years. 

[coachbuns]

39 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

So the Saints #2 receiver is 34 year old Ted Ginn Jr (who at no point in his career has ever broken 800 yards), and they're still killing it. The Saints #3 receiver is Tre'Quan Smith who has 12 catches all year and they're killing it.

But it's impossible for Rodgers to do well with limited talent at the #2 and #3 receiver spots.

The Packers had 29 year old Jared Cook for 10 games, he went 30/377. The Saints have had 32 year old Jared Cook for 12 games. He's at 38/577

The Saints RBs have 695 receiving yards. The Packer RBs have 677. It's not the running back receiving that's making a difference. 

We're not good at spreading the ball around. We're not good at forcing the ball to a single target. We're not particularly good at anything, and realistically haven't been for a number of years. 

Yup,  1-2-3 get rid of the ball and hasn't been done in Green Bay for a long time.  NO has been in that get rid of the ball system for 10 years.  GB hasn't been but hopefully will be.  One year in a new system isn't enough to be fine tuned or comfortable ... it takes time.  I very much agree and hope it comes to this sooner than later!  

[Scoremore]

We don't have a Michael Thomas.  A guy who can just take over a game.  Cook is vastly better then Graham not even close.  My point is if we add either a solid #2 WR or a legitimate weapon at TE think we could get back to being a top offense.  Maybe Sternburger will grow into a that role.  Maybe MVS or EQ will come on.  Wouldn't bank on any of it.  If I were Gute I would add a veteran WR and draft another.  Actually like Breshard Perriman the best out of the FA WR's.  Think he has the most upside and wouldn't break the bank.  Gute is aware of our deficiencies sure he'll attempt to shore up the weak spots on the roster.  OT, WR, DL, ILB perhaps a hybrid S.  Looking toward the future RB and QB could also be on that list. As far as TE I am ok rolling with Toynan, Sternburger, and Lewis next year.  I am sure he'll try to add one to the mix as well whether it be a modest FA type or late round draft pick.

[Packerraymond]

3 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

So the Saints #2 receiver is 34 year old Ted Ginn Jr (who at no point in his career has ever broken 800 yards), and they're still killing it. The Saints #3 receiver is Tre'Quan Smith who has 12 catches all year and they're killing it.

But it's impossible for Rodgers to do well with limited talent at the #2 and #3 receiver spots.

The Packers had 29 year old Jared Cook for 10 games, he went 30/377. The Saints have had 32 year old Jared Cook for 12 games. He's at 38/577

The Saints RBs have 695 receiving yards. The Packer RBs have 677. It's not the running back receiving that's making a difference. 

We're not good at spreading the ball around. We're not good at forcing the ball to a single target. We're not particularly good at anything, and realistically haven't been for a number of years. 

The Saints throw the ball to Michael Thomas. We should throw the ball to Davante Adams as much as they throw to Michael Thomas. Spreading the ball for the sake of spreading it is the problem with the offense. Stop utilizing lesser players because you feel like you have to. However Payton gets Thomas open play after play deserves a ton of praise, because Ted Ginn and Smith are largely irrelevant.

[AlexGreen#20]

Just now, Packerraymond said:

The Saints throw the ball to Michael Thomas. We should throw the ball to Davante Adams as much as they throw to Michael Thomas. Spreading the ball for the sake of spreading it is the problem with the offense. Stop utilizing lesser players because you feel like you have to. However Payton gets Thomas open play after play deserves a ton of praise, because Ted Ginn and Smith are largely irrelevant.

Which is a lot of my point. If we went into every play with the thought process of: Call the play, get to the line with 22 seconds left, ID the coverage, call the audible that gets Davante there first good look, snap the ball. Then this is an entirely different offense.

[Scoremore]

8 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Which is a lot of my point. If we went into every play with the thought process of: Call the play, get to the line with 22 seconds left, ID the coverage, call the audible that gets Davante there first good look, snap the ball. Then this is an entirely different offense.

I'd buy into that.  However DaVante is not Michael Thomas.  Like the idea of coming up to the line with enough time to audible.  It's been an ongoing problem all year.