dante9876 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 He has never been great going through progressions fast enough. He still doesnt throw wrs open. And he still for most of the time only throw it downfield when a guy is wide open. Even rico Gafford had to stop and wait for his lofted deep pass when he was wide open. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBXISBXVSBXVIII Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 47 minutes ago, dante9876 said: https://nationalfootballpost.com/evaluating-the-evaluation-of-derek-carr/ Dam that’s bullseye 🎯 spot freakin on evaluation wow this is just who he is. Starting to think 2016 was just a fluke Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Chali21 said: I think Carr waits for guys to be wide open because he doesn’t trust them enough to get 50-50 balls. It makes sense because Waller was having a big season until he was taken out defensively, Carr’s backup options where guys he hadn’t played with very much. This offense is based on making scheduled throws and getting positive yards. It’s all very meticulous a precise which is why when they get a false start or a hold the drive is pretty much over. I think this is a product of a bad defense and no vertical playmakers. When you have a good defense you can take more risks because you can potentially get more bites at the apple. If you got legit playmakers who can take the top off defenses you can throw deep every now and then. They Raiders are very deficient in these areas which is why they’re targeting defense and WRs in the draft. If Carr stays i expect the offense to look a little different next season than this season. Naw cause even his infamous 4th down play he had Waller on a 50/50 ball and he wouldn’t throw it. Waller on a short lb. he wouldn’t even give Waller the baller a chance. I don’t think carr trust his arm / himself. 95% of starting qbs give Waller the chance. Go top shelf to the 6’6 baller with hops 🤷🏾♂️ Edited February 5, 2020 by NCOUGHMAN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 hour ago, dante9876 said: https://nationalfootballpost.com/evaluating-the-evaluation-of-derek-carr/ Do you think he was better at those in 2016? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dante9876 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 Some what but not as much as people want to believe. I think musgrave played to his strengths. Cooper made plays for him when the ball was in his hand. Only thing i think he did more of was throw more contested throws to Crabtree. As far as throwing to a spot or anticipating throws or throwing wrs open. I think he has minimal improvement on those things. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 29 minutes ago, dante9876 said: Some what but not as much as people want to believe. I think musgrave played to his strengths. Cooper made plays for him when the ball was in his hand. Only thing i think he did more of was throw more contested throws to Crabtree. As far as throwing to a spot or anticipating throws or throwing wrs open. I think he has minimal improvement on those things. I agree. I think there was a real regression in 2017, mainly due to the coaches imo, but i don't think he was much better in 2016 than he is now. I never thought he was a good timing passer and the consensus here was his ideal WR was a physical guy that could win jump balls or contested catches on the outside (Crabtree). I don't think we have had anyone on our roster in that mold at WR since Crabtree. I also doubt 50/50 balls are what Gruden wants to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucksavage1 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 20 minutes ago, oakdb36 said: I agree. I think there was a real regression in 2017, mainly due to the coaches imo, but i don't think he was much better in 2016 than he is now. I never thought he was a good timing passer and the consensus here was his ideal WR was a physical guy that could win jump balls or contested catches on the outside (Crabtree). I don't think we have had anyone on our roster in that mold at WR since Crabtree. I also doubt 50/50 balls are what Gruden wants to see. If gruden doesn’t want to see 50/50 balls then what does he want to see? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said: If gruden doesn’t want to see 50/50 balls then what does he want to see? Efficiency. High completion % throws. That's his system. https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2003-jan-26-sp-oates26-story.html Quote Almost 95% of Gannon’s record 418 pass completions this season were in one of the five short zones frequented by five Tampa pass-defense experts, two of them all-pros, Ronde Barber and Derrick Brooks. That's from 2002 so Gruden wasn't the HC anymore but that's still his system. That's the reason Al Davis didn't like Gruden, he wanted deep shots and Gruden was all about that WCO short passing game. Edited February 5, 2020 by oakdb36 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackinBlack Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, oakdb36 said: Efficiency. High completion % throws. That's his system. https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2003-jan-26-sp-oates26-story.html That's from 2002 so Gruden wasn't the HC anymore but that's still his system. Yup, and we saw our O was actually decent at moving the ball when they didn’t hurt themselves with penalties. it really felt like when we got off track by penalty we couldNot recover. Obviously Derek Carr is part of the problem here. but I agree Gruden wants to run a controlled, efficient O. Similar to NEs O. One of the biggest differences is obviously Brady is one of the best of all times, but, the other is NE has been one of the most disciplined teams in the league. Which is needed when running that style of O 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, BackinBlack said: Yup, and we saw our O was actually decent at moving the ball when they didn’t hurt themselves with penalties. it really felt like when we got off track by penalty we couldNot recover. Obviously Derek Carr is part of the problem here. but I agree Gruden wants to run a controlled, efficient O. Similar to NEs O. One of the biggest differences is obviously Brady is one of the best of all times, but, the other is NE has been one of the most disciplined teams in the league. Which is needed when running that style of O And it relies on the pass catchers ability to gain yards after the catch. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverNBlackFan Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 Just watching those highlights...man was Charlie Garner good. He would've fit perfectly in today's NFL. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 33 minutes ago, oakdb36 said: Efficiency. High completion % throws. That's his system. https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-2003-jan-26-sp-oates26-story.html That's from 2002 so Gruden wasn't the HC anymore but that's still his system. That's the reason Al Davis didn't like Gruden, he wanted deep shots and Gruden was all about that WCO short passing game. This offense imo doesn’t look like 02’. The game is so different now gruden included. You get guys like Waller who are matchup nightmares just for 50/50 end zone plays. He threw the same 50/50 ball to Waller vs gb for a td. Same exact play. But like I mentioned earlier by the time we played tenn carr had less confidence in himself than he did earlier in gb. I have to disagree gruden expects carr to take calculated risks but carr takes no risks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted February 5, 2020 Share Posted February 5, 2020 1 minute ago, NCOUGHMAN said: This offense imo doesn’t look like 02’. The game is so different now gruden included. You get guys like Waller who are matchup nightmares just for 50/50 end zone plays. He threw the same 50/50 ball to Waller vs gb for a td. Same exact play. But like I mentioned earlier by the time we played tenn carr had less confidence in himself than he did earlier in gb. I have to disagree gruden expects carr to take calculated risks but carr takes no risks. I'm not saying he never wants to see a 50/50 ball, just that it's not going to be a huge part of his offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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