Danger Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Metcalf, you won't change my mind. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jakuvious Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 On 12/1/2020 at 7:24 AM, ET80 said: This is a bit incorrect - Hopkins put up a strong year as a #2 to Andre Johnson in 2014 (75/1,200+/10). He actually outproduced Johnson with less targets. I guess we sort of do know what Hill looks like without a top tier situation: His time with Alex Smith, where he was averaging 79 ypg. Very good, very respectable numbers... ...but not quite the 93 ypg he's hung up with Mahomes as his QB. You even see it last season, when Mahomes missed a few games with injury and Matt Moore had to play; The figure drops down to 71 ypg, even lower than the pre-Mahomes days. So, is Hill a "great WR" or is he a "great WR with Mahomes?" If you remove the best player in the NFL from the equation, what do you have? A good WR, but I'd hesitant to call him the best WR I'm football. Now... Hopkins? You have a guy who has consistent 95+ ypg with guys who are demonstratively NOT Pat Mahomes (or a playcaller who is arguably one of the worst we've seen in the past half decade). The only real noticable drop for Hopkins is the Brock Osweiler year (you can only do SO much) and the year the Hopkins/Bill O'Brien feud took over (which is pretty equal to Tyreek with Smith - respectable, but not world beating). Outside of those two anomalies, Hop is consistently in the 90s - doesn't matter if the QB is Kyler Murray, Tom Savage or TJ Yates (none of which are in the Pat Mahomes category - I think that's pretty much agreed upon). In the 3 games that Hill played where Mahomes was hurt in 2019, he averaged 96.7 ypg. 100 ypg flat if you count the couple rushes. He was technically more productive with Matt Moore than with any other QB in his career. His ypg was low in 2019 due to his own injuries, not Mahomes's. He had severely reduced snap counts against Jacksonville and LAC (we're talking like, 10% of the game's snaps.) He averaged 85 ypg otherwise, last year. Hill is a great WR. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaveOurSonics Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) This is such a grey area conversation to have because each WR is going to fit their scheme and their QB better than another WR could. And everyone is going to have their preference for what they want in a #1 WR (size, route running, speed, contested catches, etc.). I personally have Davante Adams as the games best WR. I just think his route running is such a weapon no matter where you're at on the field and it's very difficult to eliminate a player who is as precise as he is with an understanding for soft zones like he has. I'd rather have someone like Davante Adams in the redzone than Tyreek Hill. Guys like Tyreek, Nuk, Julio, MT, DK, and -- two names I haven't seen in this thread -- AJ Brown and Terry McLaurin make up the remainder of what I would consider the NFL's elite WRs. Edited December 3, 2020 by SaveOurSonics 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drained Posted December 4, 2020 Share Posted December 4, 2020 I'd rather have Hill on Houston than Hopkins. Hopkins biggest issue was always his speed, got shutdown completely against White last season in the playoffs cause of it, we had to put him in the slot to even get him some yardage. Happened again this past week against Gilmore and the Patriots. Hill has the speed, great route running, great hands, theres really nothing wrong with the guy other than personal issues, he's probably solidly in contention for #1, he just doesn't have the amazing catches like DHop or AB used to have or those game winning moments that we used to see in AJ or Megatron and that is what makes the Football world say "oh they're no.1" 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteelKing728 Posted December 4, 2020 Share Posted December 4, 2020 1. Adams 2. Hopkins 3. Metcalf 4. Hill 5. Thomas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UncleAdamz Posted December 4, 2020 Share Posted December 4, 2020 (edited) On 12/3/2020 at 9:52 PM, Drained said: Hopkins biggest issue was always his speed, got shutdown completely against White last season in the playoffs cause of it, we had to put him in the slot to even get him some yardage. Happened again this past week against Gilmore and the Patriots. I don't see this as an issue. In this past game he was targeted 7 times, and caught 5 for 55 yards. If that is getting 'shutdown', than that just shows how good of a receiver he is. I'm sure he would of done better as well if Murray had been 100%, with how much his running ability opens up the field. Going back to the speed, his use in our offense doesn't involve deep shots, that is left up to Kirk and Isabella typically. I also believe that our more horizontally based offense is actually hurting him a bit, as I would like to see him 15-25 yards downfield more often. I think the receiver is largely dependent on the scheme and other players, so different teams would probably rather have a player that fits what they are doing. (whether that is Hopkins, Hill, Metcalf, Adams, Thomas) Edited December 8, 2020 by UncleAdamz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 (edited) Double Edited December 7, 2020 by Bullet Club Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 On 12/1/2020 at 5:04 PM, BayRaider said: Bro you’ve anointed Julio #1 every single year since like 2013 lmao.Even during Antonio Brown’s Prime Days of Destruction, and getting Jerry Rice comparisons, you still kept going on about Julio as -#1. I’ve never had Julio at #1, think maybe for half a season. He gets taken out of games by DC’s sooo often. I’d probably put Julio at #5 currently, behind Michael Thomas, DeAndre Hopkins, Tyreek Hill, and Davante Adams. And that’s without even looking at any WR lists at the top of my head... Not dumping on Julio, absolutely tremendous football player and Wide Receiver, but the homerism on your part has been evident for about seven years now. Almost on par with Stl4life guy. Yeah, anyone championing Jones over peak AB isn't much for understanding the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBLIII Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 Adams Hopkins Jefferson Hill DK Kelce is the best overall receiver though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Illadelegend215 Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 1 hour ago, SBLIII said: Adams Hopkins Jefferson Hill DK Kelce is the best overall receiver though I don’t think Jefferson is the best receiver on his own team lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBLIII Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 6 minutes ago, Illadelegend215 said: I don’t think Jefferson is the best receiver on his own team lol. based on what? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 4 hours ago, SBLIII said: Adams Hopkins Jefferson Hill DK Kelce is the best overall receiver though WAY too early. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyler735 Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 Jefferson over Micheal Thomas 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSUeagles14 Posted December 7, 2020 Share Posted December 7, 2020 I still think when looking at this year alone, theres no best WR. Adams, Hopkins, Hill and another couple guys all have arguments. Adams is getting TDS (among other things) by the handful but hes also getting an absurd # of targets in the redzone (the most in the league), and yesterday alone he had 3 in one drive. When only looking at this year, Hopkins is running MIchael thomas type routes, so much of it is short or even behind the line. We know hes a complete WR but that AZ offense doesn't really ask him to do it all per say. Julios banged up too much, DK is a little too inconsistent this year. BUT, if were looking into the future, I think DK is going to separate himself from the pack as soon as next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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