The New York Jets

[soflbillsfan]

51 minutes ago, Forge said:

They were 7-9 just last year and will get some guys back (like CJ Moseley) who opted out. They have a lot of cap space in a market that is going to be just a little tighter than normal with a couple of teams (Philly and NO notably) who are way underwater. I don't think that they are playoff material next year, but turnarounds can happen quick in the NFL. 49ers went from coaching the senior bowl to the super bowl in a year. The dolphins went from a team that a lot of people thought were the worst team in football (roster wise) to a team in that may make the playoffs in the potentially the deepest playoff chase in history in a year. 

But at this point you've also completely wasted Darnold's rookie contract, which is where you are really trying to hit the homerun on and it's hard to know when you'll have that shot again at the top 3 and a top tier QB prospect which is why so many teams make that choice, I think. 

Just cause you have a top 3 pick doesnt mean a qb needs to be taken. Do you honestly feel that Justin Fields or Trey Lance is significantly better that what Darnold is?

Keep in mind that post Gase Tannehill has been a solid qb in the NFL? Darnold had to deal with lackluster Offensive mind coaches since coming to the NFL. Also what did they do to help him succeed at the next level? Drafted 3 offensive players in the 1st 3 rounds since drafting Darnold 2 olineman and a Wr (2 of which were just drafted this year). Then look at their free agency signings Perriman and Crowder. While I like Crowder as a slot receiver Perriman was the 5th wr on a Bucs offense prior. Then you lose on the talented guys they had. Darnold hasn't been amazing but honestly they have set him up for failure. 2021 FA may change some but does the rookie QB have a chance of getting upgrades that Darnold never had the opportunity to get?

[One]

58 minutes ago, Forge said:

They were 7-9 just last year and will get some guys back (like CJ Moseley) who opted out. They have a lot of cap space in a market that is going to be just a little tighter than normal with a couple of teams (Philly and NO notably) who are way underwater. I don't think that they are playoff material next year, but turnarounds can happen quick in the NFL. 49ers went from coaching the senior bowl to the super bowl in a year. The dolphins went from a team that a lot of people thought were the worst team in football (roster wise) to a team in that may make the playoffs in the potentially the deepest playoff chase in history in a year. 

But at this point you've also completely wasted Darnold's rookie contract, which is where you are really trying to hit the homerun on and it's hard to know when you'll have that shot again at the top 3 and a top tier QB prospect which is why so many teams make that choice, I think. 

7-9 last year means just that: 7-9 last year. It's irrelevant. Remember when Carolina went 12-4 in 2008 and brought back virtually all of their starters for 2009? It didn't get them anywhere.

The Jets have a bad roster, an imbecile coach and Darnold hasn't shown anything thus far that he's the guy.

Edited December 21, 2020 by One

[.Buzz]

11 minutes ago, soflbillsfan said:

Just cause you have a top 3 pick doesnt mean a qb needs to be taken. Do you honestly feel that Justin Fields or Trey Lance is significantly better that what Darnold is?

Keep in mind that post Gase Tannehill has been a solid qb in the NFL? Darnold had to deal with lackluster Offensive mind coaches since coming to the NFL. Also what did they do to help him succeed at the next level? Drafted 3 offensive players in the 1st 3 rounds since drafting Darnold 2 olineman and a Wr (2 of which were just drafted this year). Then look at their free agency signings Perriman and Crowder. While I like Crowder as a slot receiver Perriman was the 5th wr on a Bucs offense prior. Then you lose on the talented guys they had. Darnold hasn't been amazing but honestly they have set him up for failure. 2021 FA may change some but does the rookie QB have a chance of getting upgrades that Darnold never had the opportunity to get?

I'm super confused by people questioning if these prospects are as good as Darnold. 

Darnold has been in the league 3 years. He hasn't shown that he's going to take the step to franchise QB level. He still has similar warts/issues just like when he came out. At this point, it's much more likely he won't develop into that franchise building block.

Fields/Wilson have the potential to be exactly that, a franchise QB. With proper development/building around them they have a much better chance as things stand currently. Just because when Darnold came out he was viewed as a highly touted prospect doesn't mean he still sits there now. 

Does any of this means they'll definitely work out/be better? No. There isn't a prospect that hasn't played a snap that you can guarantee something like that. But they present the possibility which is the whole point.

[KingOfNewYork]

I’m tired of people who clearly don’t watch enough Jets football blaming everything but Sam Darnold for his poor play. 

[Forge]

30 minutes ago, One said:

7-9 last year means just that: 7-9 last year. It's irrelevant. Remember when Carolina went 12-4 in 2008 and brought back virtually all of their starters for 2009? It didn't get them anywhere.

The Jets have a bad roster, an imbecile coach and Darnold hasn't shown anything thus far that he's the guy.

You're seriously making my point for me. Things change quickly in the NFL. 

[QBIso]

8 minutes ago, KingOfNewYork said:

I’m tired of people who clearly don’t watch enough Jets football blaming everything but Sam Darnold for his poor play. 

Darnold hasn’t been good, but the Jets have like close to zero redeeming qualities on their team. Other bad teams at least have like a lot of young up n’ comers. The Jets have nothing on either side of the ball.

Darnold isn’t without major flaws, but let’s not crucify the dude yet. He is playing with a bunch of scrubs. I think he can be a 15-20 ranked QB in the NFL. Even higher with a great cast of characters around him. 

[soflbillsfan]

26 minutes ago, .Buzz said:

I'm super confused by people questioning if these prospects are as good as Darnold. 

Darnold has been in the league 3 years. He hasn't shown that he's going to take the step to franchise QB level. He still has similar warts/issues just like when he came out. At this point, it's much more likely he won't develop into that franchise building block.

Fields/Wilson have the potential to be exactly that, a franchise QB. With proper development/building around them they have a much better chance as things stand currently. Just because when Darnold came out he was viewed as a highly touted prospect doesn't mean he still sits there now. 

Does any of this means they'll definitely work out/be better? No. There isn't a prospect that hasn't played a snap that you can guarantee something like that. But they present the possibility which is the whole point.

You do realize that players are impacted by the coaches and players around them. Darnold was never built for success how do you expect some players to take the next step at the pro level given zero talent around him and zero protection around him? Look at Josh Allen his first year was horrible then they got him some weapons and oline and was able to progress to the next level. Darnold was never given that and even if they draft Fields or wilson they still do not have the ability to give them success. Its not about questioning whether or not Darnold or the prospects are better its about what will change. You rush to get these guys on the field they faulter as they never built a team around them. Herbert has had some great success his rookie year you think he would get the same on the jets with that receiving core? No just like Fields or any one else that is behind center next year. So why bother spending another high draft pick on a qb when your team is an absolute shambles offensively and defensively because of the front office and their decision making. So I will continue to question whether or not it is the right choice to go with fields with no impact players and no oline to protect him where you can literally get an impact player or olineman with the 2nd pick as well as the late 1st they get from seattle.

[QBIso]

Look, I’d be all for the Jets upgrading at QB. However, that’s not probably gonna be possible this year. I don’t like Fields at all, Wilson is a crap shoot, and Lance is a non D1 guy. All are intriguing, but like others have said, I think Darnold gives you your best chance out of those guys. Plus it’s not like Darnold is some old wily vet. He’s literally young enough to be a rookie in this draft class. Also it sucks for the Jets that there isn’t a stud pass rusher at the top of the class. Like, a no-brainer edge. They need one of those just as much as a franchise QB, if not more. The Jets haven’t had a great pass rusher since Jon Abraham like 6,000 years ago. 

[KingOfNewYork]

2 minutes ago, QBIso said:

Darnold hasn’t been good, but the Jets have like close to zero redeeming qualities on their team. Other bad teams at least have like a lot of young up n’ comers. The Jets have nothing on either side of the ball.

Darnold isn’t without major flaws, but let’s not crucify the dude yet. He is playing with a bunch of scrubs. I think he can be a 15-20 ranked QB in the NFL. Even higher with a great cast of characters around him. 

Again I’ve watched every single snap of his career. He doesn’t have it. A good QB shouldn’t need a great cast of characters around him. That’s basically saying hey you’ll win the race if we give you a head start. 

[.Buzz]

1 minute ago, soflbillsfan said:

You do realize that players are impacted by the coaches and players around them. Darnold was never built for success how do you expect some players to take the next step at the pro level given zero talent around him and zero protection around him? Look at Josh Allen his first year was horrible then they got him some weapons and oline and was able to progress to the next level. Darnold was never given that and even if they draft Fields or wilson they still do not have the ability to give them success. Its not about questioning whether or not Darnold or the prospects are better its about what will change. You rush to get these guys on the field they faulter as they never built a team around them. Herbert has had some great success his rookie year you think he would get the same on the jets with that receiving core? No just like Fields or any one else that is behind center next year. So why bother spending another high draft pick on a qb when your team is an absolute shambles offensively and defensively because of the front office and their decision making. So I will continue to question whether or not it is the right choice to go with fields with no impact players and no oline to protect him where you can literally get an impact player or olineman with the 2nd pick as well as the late 1st they get from seattle.

Darnold is going to be going into YEAR 4 next year. He is the QB for a 1-13 team.

Does coaching have it's impact? Talent around them? Of course. But jeez guys...this ain't it.

[.Buzz]

If the Jets want to go the route of fixing the situation around Darnold and hoping he can become a solid middle of the road QB than I guess have at it. The chances of him being anything more at this point is low...

Top 10/franchise QB? Very unlikely. Passing up the opportunity for a young highly skilled QB in a draft that could be that to hang your hat on Darnold becoming a competent solid starter is just wild to me.

[Forge]

46 minutes ago, soflbillsfan said:

Just cause you have a top 3 pick doesnt mean a qb needs to be taken. Do you honestly feel that Justin Fields or Trey Lance is significantly better that what Darnold is?

Keep in mind that post Gase Tannehill has been a solid qb in the NFL? Darnold had to deal with lackluster Offensive mind coaches since coming to the NFL. Also what did they do to help him succeed at the next level? Drafted 3 offensive players in the 1st 3 rounds since drafting Darnold 2 olineman and a Wr (2 of which were just drafted this year). Then look at their free agency signings Perriman and Crowder. While I like Crowder as a slot receiver Perriman was the 5th wr on a Bucs offense prior. Then you lose on the talented guys they had. Darnold hasn't been amazing but honestly they have set him up for failure. 2021 FA may change some but does the rookie QB have a chance of getting upgrades that Darnold never had the opportunity to get?

But I didn't say that because they were top 3 a QB needs to be taken, so I'm not sure what you are arguing. My point to ET was that their current roster construction and set up, as it stands at this very moment, shouldn't dictate whether or not a quarterback is the choice. 

[soflbillsfan]

 

1 minute ago, .Buzz said:

If the Jets want to go the route of fixing the situation around Darnold and hoping he can become a solid middle of the road QB than I guess have at it. The chances of him being anything more at this point is low...

Top 10/franchise QB? Very unlikely. Passing up the opportunity for a young highly skilled QB in a draft that could be that to hang your hat on Darnold becoming a competent solid starter is just wild to me.

Who is going to protect this qb? Who is this qb going to throw to? You only kill a young man before he can even show what he is capable of doing ie Joe Burrow major knee injury and likely out for half if not all of 2021 season. So year 3 is where he essentially gets a cast to help him succeed or you go the herbert/ mahomes route build a cast that can be there so that way when the rookie qb comes in he has a decent oline and top tier weapons like hill kelce hunter or allen. It can work both ways. I see the jets more then a qb away from being successful they need a complete overhaul. So why waste years of a rookie qb deal when you can build the team up and when you are ready for him you go all in on the right qb.

[.Buzz]

Just now, soflbillsfan said:

 

Who is going to protect this qb? Who is this qb going to throw to? You only kill a young man before he can even show what he is capable of doing ie Joe Burrow major knee injury and likely out for half if not all of 2021 season. So year 3 is where he essentially gets a cast to help him succeed or you go the herbert/ mahomes route build a cast that can be there so that way when the rookie qb comes in he has a decent oline and top tier weapons like hill kelce hunter or allen. It can work both ways. I see the jets more then a qb away from being successful they need a complete overhaul. So why waste years of a rookie qb deal when you can build the team up and when you are ready for him you go all in on the right qb.

If a team is picking top 5, there's going to be issues on that roster. The Jets have a second 1st round pick as well as the rest of the draft and loads of cap space. They also have a couple decent receivers and what looks to be a franchise LT. They're not barren cupboards there even if they need help.

This doesn't even get into the whole point of Darnold still being under contract next year. No one is forcing them to deal him for a mid round pick and trot the rookie out right away.

[JetsandI]

47 minutes ago, KingOfNewYork said:

I’m tired of people who clearly don’t watch enough Jets football blaming everything but Sam Darnold for his poor play. 

Tell moderator to lock this thread. lol.   Anyway, after reading a several posts I do hope NFL front office other than Jets have similar excusable problems about Darnold.