Xenos Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 16 minutes ago, DigInBoys said: https://www.yahoo.com/sports/report-broncos-offered-lions-top-200803674.html I would have taken this pick as well. Glad Detroit traded him to the Rams instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 6 minutes ago, Xenos said: I would have taken this pick as well. Glad Detroit traded him to the Rams instead. I heard Denver wanted 2.9 back from Detroit as well I don't think it was that simple 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 I think the problem I have with the Rams is the way they drug Goff threw the mud. I don't think you do that the way the QB position is glorified I think you keep that close to the vest. Goff's numbers aren't terrible the last 4 years. I like what the Eagles do The owner and Roseman prop him up say he's a tireless worker blah blah blah it's just a way better approach imo we'll see how it pays off. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Xenos said: If anyone has an Athletic subscription, Ted Nguyen does his breakdown of Stafford vs. Goff. https://theathletic.com/2361117/2021/02/03/matthew-stafford-jared-goff-comparison-analysis/ In essence, Stafford is the more accurate QB everywhere on the field except in the intermediate (10-20 yards). But that weakness is negated by how good McVay is at creating space with his scheme in those areas. https://cdn.theathletic.com/app/uploads/2021/02/01221400/stafford_goff.png He also has the ability to play out of structure much better than Goff. I'd say that's accurate with how things stand now. Goff is a tremendous intermediate thrower. The thing is, though, that Goff is also just about to enter his window for his prime. It's very possible he keeps growing. That's part of why I don't like this deal. EDIT: I will correct what seems like a misconception the article creates. Goff doesn't have Stafford's arm strength. That's true. But Goff doesn't lack arm strength either. He can hit every throw to every part of the field that is asked of NFL structure, and his terrific zip is a big part of what makes him so lethal in the intermediate range. But no, he can't bomb the ball off platform like Stafford can. That's not his game. He's a precision passer. Two other points: (1) the Rams did not have to pay the Lions to take on Goff's contract if the rumored trade offers are accurate, and (2) I would expect Stafford to be better at playing outside structure and making reads under duress. He has been in the NFL for over a decade. But it's also worth remembering that you can make one guy look good and another look bad when you're only comparing one play each made in a season among many plays. And Goff is coming off arguably his worst season, while Stafford is coming off of one of his better years. Edited February 5, 2021 by jrry32 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenos Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 2 hours ago, jrry32 said: I'd say that's accurate with how things stand now. Goff is a tremendous intermediate thrower. The thing is, though, that Goff is also just about to enter his window for his prime. It's very possible he keeps growing. That's part of why I don't like this deal. EDIT: I will correct what seems like a misconception the article creates. Goff doesn't have Stafford's arm strength. That's true. But Goff doesn't lack arm strength either. He can hit every throw to every part of the field that is asked of NFL structure, and his terrific zip is a big part of what makes him so lethal in the intermediate range. But no, he can't bomb the ball off platform like Stafford can. That's not his game. He's a precision passer. Two other points: (1) the Rams did not have to pay the Lions to take on Goff's contract if the rumored trade offers are accurate, and (2) I would expect Stafford to be better at playing outside structure and making reads under duress. He has been in the NFL for over a decade. But it's also worth remembering that you can make one guy look good and another look bad when you're only comparing one play each made in a season among many plays. And Goff is coming off arguably his worst season, while Stafford is coming off of one of his better years. I’m higher on Stafford than you are. I think it’s actually pretty amazing that he’s done what he’s done despite having inconsistent talent and especially inconsistent coaching to put it nicely. Most QBs would be ruined by now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, Xenos said: I’m higher on Stafford than you are. I think it’s actually pretty amazing that he’s done what he’s done despite having inconsistent talent and especially inconsistent coaching to put it nicely. Most QBs would be ruined by now. How? The guy came into the NFL throwing to Megatron. He has typically had solid to good supporting casts. About the only things he's lacked are a great running game and consistency at HC. But outside of Patricia, I don't think the Lions' HCs during his time have been bad. Caldwell is an above average HC. And Schwartz, while too flawed to be a good HC, wasn't terrible. If anything, I feel like people have bent over backwards to make excuses for Stafford not having accomplished more. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkippyX Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 (edited) Joe Lombardi was good enough to be Drew Brees' QB coach for 12 years. 2 years as Stafford's OC must have ruined Stafford. Being part of 6 top 5 and 6 more top 10 offenses in New Orleans is no kind of resume! 👀 Jim Bob Cooter was Stafford's QB coach for 2 years, He does not get the OC job if Stafford and others thought he was a bad coach Cooter was there for 4 years, including year one of Patricia Scott Linehan ran 5 different top 5 offenses as an OC for 4 teams. (one of those teams wears Honolulu Blue) Did he damage Stafford for 5 years? Darrell Bevell ran a top 5 offense in both Minnesota and Seattle. Another guy holding Stafford back for 2 years? You can spout any nonsense you want in player worship. It doesn't make any of it true. Edited February 5, 2021 by SkippyX 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkippyX Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 (edited) FYI, most of the people crushing the bad coaches teaching Stafford for 12 years did not even know the names of those coaches. Parroting lame excuses is free. It takes no research, knowledge, analysis, or insight. Edited February 5, 2021 by SkippyX 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 8 hours ago, jrry32 said: How? The guy came into the NFL throwing to Megatron. He has typically had solid to good supporting casts. About the only things he's lacked are a great running game and consistency at HC. But outside of Patricia, I don't think the Lions' HCs during his time have been bad. Caldwell is an above average HC. And Schwartz, while too flawed to be a good HC, wasn't terrible. If anything, I feel like people have bent over backwards to make excuses for Stafford not having accomplished more. Great running game? He has scarcely had a good running game. And the Lions defense has ranked in the bottom seven during the majority of his time in Detroit. Offensive line has routinely been a weaknesses as well. Outside of Patricia, I don't think the coaching has really been a problem, and I think your "solid to good" for receiving targets is accurate. But, man... there's a reason why the Lions have routinely been a laughing stock around the league: little to no running game, suspect protection, horrible defense. It seems that this gets forgotten when criticizing Stafford. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xenos Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 9 hours ago, SkippyX said: FYI, most of the people crushing the bad coaches teaching Stafford for 12 years did not even know the names of those coaches. Parroting lame excuses is free. It takes no research, knowledge, analysis, or insight. You do realize the irony of your post right? You basically parroted a bunch of former coaches to defend your Stafford criticism. But it all lacks context, not to mention research, knowledge, analysis, or insight. Take Joe Lombardi for example. He’s the OC of my team now and I’m obligated to defend him. But after doing even an inkling of research (something that I don’t think you did at all), I realized that his time in Detroit was an unmitigated disaster. He did not even last two years. Despite having Stafford, Megatron, and Golden Tate the highest he got that offense was 19th overall in 2014. It completely tanked the following year leading to him being fired halfway through the season. A huge part of the problem was that he tried to make the Lions into the Saints instead of being more flexible and building on his players strengths.@jrry32 can probably tell you more about the offensive wunderkind that is Scott Linehan. You can spout any nonsense you want. It doesn't make any of it true. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 10 hours ago, jrry32 said: How? The guy came into the NFL throwing to Megatron. He has typically had solid to good supporting casts. About the only things he's lacked are a great running game and consistency at HC. But outside of Patricia, I don't think the Lions' HCs during his time have been bad. Caldwell is an above average HC. And Schwartz, while too flawed to be a good HC, wasn't terrible. If anything, I feel like people have bent over backwards to make excuses for Stafford not having accomplished more. A running makes makes a world difference. Goff is cheeks without one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 11 hours ago, Xenos said: I’m higher on Stafford than you are. I think it’s actually pretty amazing that he’s done what he’s done despite having inconsistent talent and especially inconsistent coaching to put it nicely. Most QBs would be ruined by now. I kinda echo this. I think Stafford is an incredible what if? scenario that we could talk about had he gone to any other team (maybe besides my WFT ) - the next 3 picks in that draft - Rams, Chiefs, Seahawks - all better off. Also, the Jets made the AFC CG with Sanchez... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirill Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 14 hours ago, Xenos said: I would have taken this pick as well. Glad Detroit traded him to the Rams instead. 14 hours ago, Xenos said: I would have taken this pick as well. Glad Detroit traded him to the Rams instead. Yeah two firsts is franchise changing. Stafford is aight but in his old age, he's not worth the kitchen sink. Although I keep thinking if I was a Rams fan I wouldn't care lol Goff is that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bad Example Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 On 2/1/2021 at 8:29 AM, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Good post. The Lions have #7 this year. Perhaps the additional ammo allows them to move higher and grab a "franchise QB", or perhaps they'll think they can develop a QB at #7 behind Goff for two years. Or, as pointed out, maybe they don't love anyone this year, and then they just have extra picks coming for a few years and/or can pull the trigger on a move when they DO fall in love with a QB. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bad Example Posted February 5, 2021 Share Posted February 5, 2021 On 2/1/2021 at 8:30 AM, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Really hoping so. We have a long history of missed picks. (Hence, our struggles. I guess that's all kinda obvious.) John Dorsey has a significant history of getting good players and lots of 'em in the draft. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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