incognito_man Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 4 minutes ago, MKnight82 said: Duh. I was stating that the NFL trying to allow players to play with no symptoms is moronic. Its just going to spread the virus to a ton of additional people. Not sure why you say "Duh" now when you literally just asked how it's spreading across a lockerroom of 90% vaccinated people? That's how: they interact with others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 4 minutes ago, Broncofan said: You missed the rest of my sentence - that was with Delta. What we know about Omicron is being vaxxed doesn't protect against infection - but it still protects against serious illness, especially in otherwise healthy and vaxxed individuals. We're about to go off-track, but IMO the focus shouldn't be on # cases anymore, it should be on # hospitalizations / ICU / deaths. Covid is endemic, so talking about case #'s is meaningless, from a general population perspective. Now, from a NFL perspective - because a positive = can't play, # cases obviously very meaningful for the NFL, but overall, the goal with an endemic isn't to prevent disease, it's to limit its impact. That's where we're at now. The window to not be in endemic phase passed a long time ago, so it is what is what it is now. So now we're talking about how many days does it take before a positive player isn't a risk for spread - and again, I have to repeat - positive tests aren't predictive, and aren't used to decide when patients and health care workers are no longer considered at-risk for spread (because PCR tests don't distinguish between dead & live virus). It's just resolution of symptoms and a set time frame. You're assuming all of these positive tests are Omicron when we haven't been given that information. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MKnight82 Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 1 minute ago, incognito_man said: Not sure why you say "Duh" now when you literally just asked how it's spreading across a lockerroom of 90% vaccinated people? That's how: they interact with others My question was rhetorical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 (edited) 7 minutes ago, MKnight82 said: You're assuming all of these positive tests are Omicron when we haven't been given that information. The NFL medical officer confirmed that Omicron is now becoming predominant, and this is echo'd by pretty much all epidemiologists (see link 2-3 posts earlier from me, earlier today). I would also point out vaxxes protect against serious illness to a terrific extent with Delta (and again, why getting vaxxed is really the message here for everyone). But everything now points to Omicron as to why things are changing so rapidly now, and we have NFL confirmation from Dr. Sills. Trust me, I understand your concern - the NFL is clearly doing this to improve their chances to get games in. It's just that using positive/negative tests was never a sound method to determine this - the timeframe and resolution of symptoms has been, and should be the standard. Now, what that timeframe should be and what the NFL will do - THAT's the $2B (I say $2B because I believe that's the TV contract $ - which let's face it, is what's driving all of this). This isn't supposed to be a thread to debate the merits / values / politics - I'm just trying to illustrate why this is happening, and how it's going to affect the league / teams. Understand I'm not trying to inject my own opinion...that only leads to thread closure. Edited December 16, 2021 by Broncofan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkippyX Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 1 minute ago, MKnight82 said: You're assuming all of these positive tests are Omicron when we haven't been given that information. Don't assume what others are assuming. Covid is spreading like crazy right now and Omicron is probably a factor. (and I don't think anyone said it was the only factor) Thanksgiving meant lots of people getting together which increases the viral load on the rest of the country which players then are a part of. Colder weather means more indoor gatherings. These players are not just getting caught up in random tests. The infection rate is higher right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 30 minutes ago, Broncofan said: That's likely the foundation behind the league's thinking - but to be clear, it's also with another transparent goal in mind - to enable the games to be played, and on-time, on-schedule for TV. Let's not kid ourselves. It's just that the practice of using tests to determine when players could return doesn't even mirror what is done in healthcare, where the stakes are far higher. So decreasing or even dropping the re-test requirement actually can be defended, and why the NFLPA would likely agree (although a smart union would still use it for concessions - but since it's the NFLPA, who knows). I feel pretty confident the decision the owners + NFLPA will come to on this resolution will be science-based. They have a good track record of that so far. So it's encouraging they are coming to the table to address this. Unfortunately some teams this week might suffer for not doing this sooner, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 2 minutes ago, MKnight82 said: My question was rhetorical. Definitely didn't come off that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 10 minutes ago, Broncofan said: We're about to go off-track, but IMO the focus shouldn't be on # cases anymore, it should be on # hospitalizations / ICU / deaths. Covid is endemic, so talking about case #'s is meaningless, from a general population perspective. This ^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spartacus Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 At some point i'm worried about the playoffs..... If a team is without 3-10 key starters due to covid even without any symptoms that would really be a BS way to lose a game especially so with the more vaccine resistant omicron variant. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Spartacus said: At some point i'm worried about the playoffs..... If a team is without 3-10 key starters due to covid even without any symptoms that would really be a BS way to lose a game especially so with the more vaccine resistant omicron variant. playoff bubble in Hawaii (lowest per capita case #s currently) Edited December 16, 2021 by incognito_man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SkippyX Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 1 minute ago, Spartacus said: At some point i'm worried about the playoffs..... If a team is without 3-10 key starters due to covid even without any symptoms that would really be a BS way to lose a game especially so with the more vaccine resistant omicron variant. Teams that are serious about winning the Super Bowl should start to think about making their own bubbles. Not as a team mandate, but players deciding this as part of their dedication to winning. I don't mean NHL or NBA 2020 style, just a conscious effort to greatly limit interactions until February. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 Holy ****... losing Harrison on top of their - now their run D is severely compromised, he was the last in the box run stopper in the safety group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawgX Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 4 minutes ago, Broncofan said: Holy ****... losing Harrison on top of their - now their run D is severely compromised, he was the last in the box run stopper in the safety group. Lol if the Raiders don't win this game... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 Green Bay will be without Kenny Clark vs Baltimore after a positive test as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFlaccoSeagulls Posted December 16, 2021 Share Posted December 16, 2021 I don't feel like googling this, but what day is the latest you can add someone to the COVID list and have them play on Sunday if they're vaccinated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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