Random Packer News & Notes

[Arthur Penske]

Hakeem Butler would be most welcomed by me

[craig]

2 hours ago, vegas492 said:

I just caught part of a Rodgers interview on Sirius XM....

Here's what I caught.  He was asked about wide receivers.  Obvious praise for Adams.  Rodgers loves Lazard.  Attitude, brains, work ethic....etc.  Next guy he mentioned was Kumerow.  Smart, plays with confidence.  Then he talked about MVS...and this was telling....said that he's has his "ups and downs" and that his practice habits have gotten much better.  He pointed out the obvious physical talent.  Made is sound like MVS was never really about studying a playbook or practicing hard in the past.  But this year has been different.

He was asked about what corners he doesn't like throwing at in camp.  First guy out of his mouth...Alexander.  Said he's been a "stud" for us for a couple of year.  Confident, closes fast.  Then he moved to King, said King is "an elite corner when he is out there".  Very long, great hands, great feet, tracks the ball really really well.  Then he went to Sullivan.  Talked about him as an UDFA and he got a pick against the "Boys...popped on specials...etc.  Said that he's worked with Sullivan this camp on things like body language when on the field.  Said that is very important for a nickle corner that has to cover, make some run stops and blitz.  He likes Sullivan.

Then I ran in for some lunch and missed the rest of the interview.

Interesting things to me?  At WR, Kumerow was talked about before MVS.  No ESB mention.  Corner wise, he used the word "elite" when talking about King.  And no mention of Jackson.

Take away from it what you will.

Thanks for observations, vegas.  The respect for Jaire and King seems to be pretty unanimous.  And everybody Packers seems to be consistently positive about Sullivan, too.  That he'd talk about a primary regular like Sullivan, and not about a roster-bubble like Jackson doesn't seem surprising.  The more curious thing is the "body language" bit, I would have guessed that as the heroic UDFA success story, that Sullivan would be a great-attitude overachiever personality.  I've maybe mentioned this, but Sullivan got some favorable pass-coverage statistics last season, but Gray talked about him as a more accomplished run-game guy, with pass being his bigger improvement priority.  So if his pass-coverage stats were already good, that either means he's got a shot to be a pretty good 2-way player... or else that pass-coverage stats maybe don't tell the whole story.  I also seem to recall that he was academic-all-conference, or something like that, in college, so perhaps an intelligent player, too?  

No EQ mention again doesn't surprise, because I've never gotten the sense that he's much of a playmaker in practice or in camp.  (His hypothetical virtues as a strong, physical run-blocker may be under-manifested in no-contact camp....).  The non-mention of EQ might also perhaps reflect that he's not back from his injury yet, and hasn't been practicing with Rodgers for the last week so isn't on the front of his mind; or perhaps it reflects that he won't be back from his injury for a while, and won't be part of the game planning in the forseeable future?   

[packfanfb]

Despite this clown-show of a secondary that Ted assembled for us in 2016, Rodgers STILL carried this team on his back to the 2016 NFC Championship game. Smdh. 

[MacReady]

40 minutes ago, packfanfb said:

Despite this clown-show of a secondary that Ted assembled for us in 2016, Rodgers STILL carried this team on his back to the 2016 NFC Championship game. Smdh. 

That defense still had a better performance in that game than Pettine just did with Smith, Smith, Clark, Amos, Savage, Alexander, King.

That’s what you should be shaking your head at more.

 

[MrBobGray]

35 minutes ago, packfanfb said:

Despite this clown-show of a secondary that Ted assembled for us in 2016, Rodgers STILL carried this team on his back to the 2016 NFC Championship game. Smdh. 

I mean that wasn't the secondary, but OK.

Randall isn't out of the league, he was just cut because he continues to be a headcase.  His talent and ability to play has never been in question.

HHCD was 2nd team All-Pro in 2016; he didn't really decline hard until 2017.

Morgan Burnett has always been a stud, and posted 93 tackles, 3 sacks, 2 INTs, 9 PDs, and 1 FR in 15 games.

You forgot to mention Micah Hyde for some reason, can't imagine why, and that Sam Shields should have been CB1 before he had essentially a career-ending injury week 1.

And Rodgers didn't "carry" a damn thing; he was magnificent sure, but the defense only allowed 19.5 points/game over the 8 game winning streak, and only one team got 30+.

[packfanfb]

16 minutes ago, MrBobGray said:

I mean that wasn't the secondary, but OK.

Randall isn't out of the league, he was just cut because he continues to be a headcase.  His talent and ability to play has never been in question.

HHCD was 2nd team All-Pro in 2016; he didn't really decline hard until 2017.

Morgan Burnett has always been a stud, and posted 93 tackles, 3 sacks, 2 INTs, 9 PDs, and 1 FR in 15 games.

You forgot to mention Micah Hyde for some reason, can't imagine why, and that Sam Shields should have been CB1 before he had essentially a career-ending injury week 1.

And Rodgers didn't "carry" a damn thing; he was magnificent sure, but the defense only allowed 19.5 points/game over the 8 game winning streak, and only one team got 30+.

Burnett is out of football right now too btw, but at least he's kind of old so there's some excuse. He was at least a dependable starter (an AJ Hawk of safeties if you will). "Stud" is a big-time stretch. 

Actually forgot all about Hyde, so I'll give you that, but if we go there, let's point out that Hyde took off after he left GB and was moved to the position he should have been playing all along with us. So I guess that one is more on Dom, not Ted. 

 

[packfanfb]

Wouldn't be surprised if GB called on Everett given the current state of our TE room. 

[MacReady]

51 minutes ago, packfanfb said:

Wouldn't be surprised if GB called on Everett given the current state of our TE room. 

We probably offered Tonyan and a 2027 7th.

[packfanfb]

20 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

We probably offered Tonyan and a 2027 7th.

What are you talking about??? Tonyan has the same haircut as Kittle and works out with him sooooo he's going to be awesome for us... 😉

[Beast]

Okay, I've gone on record to suggest that running the ball against the Vikings is the smart thing, as their defensive system is set up to really attack the pass, and that's still true, with two speed rushers, maybe the best Safety and LB coverage guys combo in the entire NFL.

But, looking at whom they kept, some aggressive passing might be smart too, as while they might have the best starting Safety duo in the entire NFL, right now, they have no backups, none unless you count UDFA rookie ST gunner ace Dan Chisena whom starter at WR, got moved to S and moved back to WR so just two Safeties on the entire roster. Which means for nickel and dime they have to use CBs (or sign Safeties between now and week 1 which either may not now the calls if they're new, or might not be talented enough if they're resigns).

But of their 6 CBs, 3 are rookie draft picks, and all 6 have less than three years of NFL experience.

I'm not sure if this is possible, but if you can seem something up to get the most DBs on the field possible and play against their lack of NFL experience, that could come up with some huge plays. They have come up with some creative items before, such an inexperienced group is when you prefer to try them.

Still,.make sure you force those speed rushers prove they can handle the run, or keep running it.

 

[Chili]

Just some random musings:

Looking at our WR group I think Gute finally has put together a group of players with a good mix of size, speed and athleticism.

Last year we IR 6'5" EQ and cut 6'5" Lazard and instead kept tiny Shepherd. The only speed guy who also happens to be tall was MVS. I suppose you could count Trevor Davis too but he was rarely used and was traded not too long afterwards. We also had pedestrian Kumerow and Geronimo. It wasn't a great group.

This year we got Lazard, EQ and MVS to provide height. For speed not only we got MVS we also got Taylor. All the pedestrian guys are gone. Gute has trimmed the fat and certainly got bigger, faster and more athletic overall. No more substituting pedestrian players on the field whilst the athletic ones sit on the bench. Whilst it's still not a great group but on paper they should be better and it will be interesting to see how they fare.

For the first time in a long time our offence should be faster and more powerful. Bigger and faster at RB and WR especially. Even at TE with Graham gone Sternberger and Tonyan is a speed upgrade. Can't wait to see how it all comes together.

Another thing that is important to note is that whilst we have Ervin for return duties we are going to need someone else on the roster who can take over in a pinch. For punts I believe our backup is Alexander, for kicks I believe it is Taylor.

The Packers usually designate four gunners on the roster. Redmond and Jackson are carry overs from last year. EQ, Hollman, Taylor and Scott are probably vying for the other two spots. MVS had only two special teams snaps last year so I don't think he's a serious candidate for gunner duties but I could be wrong. I think Sullivan was one of our other gunners last year but since his role on defence is expanding I think he will do far less ST work.

I've just realised that Nijman is our only true back up tackle should Turner's injury knocks him out for a few games, he will definitely be on the active game day roster should that happen. After him we are faced with the prospect of moving players out of position. Because of Covid limiting practice Runyan only worked at left guard instead of multiple positions but I suppose he could step in at tackle in a pinch as he is the only one with the most recent tackle experience having just played his entire career at LT for Michigan. I think we will look at him first before we even consider moving people like Jenkins and Taylor to tackle.

Edited September 6, 2020 by Chili

[VonKarman]

I can see us putting Jenkins at RT and Patrick at LG if both Turner and Wagner are out.

[pacman5252]

5 hours ago, Beast said:

Okay, I've gone on record to suggest that running the ball against the Vikings is the smart thing, as their defensive system is set up to really attack the pass, and that's still true, with two speed rushers, maybe the best Safety and LB coverage guys combo in the entire NFL.

But, looking at whom they kept, some aggressive passing might be smart too, as while they might have the best starting Safety duo in the entire NFL, right now, they have no backups, none unless you count UDFA rookie ST gunner ace Dan Chisena whom starter at WR, got moved to S and moved back to WR so just two Safeties on the entire roster. Which means for nickel and dime they have to use CBs (or sign Safeties between now and week 1 which either may not now the calls if they're new, or might not be talented enough if they're resigns).

But of their 6 CBs, 3 are rookie draft picks, and all 6 have less than three years of NFL experience.

I'm not sure if this is possible, but if you can seem something up to get the most DBs on the field possible and play against their lack of NFL experience, that could come up with some huge plays. They have come up with some creative items before, such an inexperienced group is when you prefer to try them.

Still,.make sure you force those speed rushers prove they can handle the run, or keep running it.

 

I think in general their D is going to take time to gel. Between their lack of experience at corner and DL turnover, they are gashable.

[Beast]

3 hours ago, Chili said:

This year we got Lazard, EQ and MVS to provide height. For speed not only we got MVS we also got Taylor. 

I'm disappointed you also didn't mention Ervin as he's been reported working at WR this preseason.

Last year there were certain plays where Rodgers was clearly targeting him as a bomb pass, but Rodgers and Ervin just couldn't quite get on the same page, but seeing as these speed WRs will be used as gadget WRs and Ervin was our best gadget WR last year and play callers often use to them for decoys then out of no where call their number.

3 hours ago, Chili said:

Another thing that is important to note is that whilst we have Ervin for return duties we are going to need someone else on the roster who can take over in a pinch. For punts I believe our backup is Alexander, for kicks I believe it is Taylor.

The Packers usually designate four gunners on the roster. Redmond and Jackson are carry overs from last year. EQ, Hollman, Taylor and Scott are probably vying for the other two spots. MVS had only two special teams snaps last year so I don't think he's a serious candidate for gunner duties but I could be wrong. I think Sullivan was one of our other gunners last year but since his role on defence is expanding I think he will do far less ST work.

I still hate using such important starters such as Alexander on punt return duty. Though I think the Packers were trying out some WRs last week, and my thought was "returner" options.

Last preseason, it was noted that Lazard (though mainly noted on kick coverage), Lazard kept consistently getting down the field well and almost better than anyone else, I know he might be a starter, but it's less separation between him and the WRs behind him, but Lazard doesn't have speed, but he has power and agility to keep defenders off him and consistency get where he needs to be.

3 hours ago, Chili said:

I've just realised that Nijman is our only true back up tackle should Turner's injury knocks him out for a few games, he will definitely be on the active game day roster should that happen. After him we are faced with the prospect of moving players out of position. Because of Covid limiting practice Runyan only worked at left guard instead of multiple positions but I suppose he could step in at tackle in a pinch as he is the only one with the most recent tackle experience having just played his entire career at LT for Michigan. I think we will look at him first before we even consider moving people like Jenkins and Taylor to tackle.

As VonKarman noted, LaFleur talked about the possibility of moving Jenkins to RT, which makes me think he's the emergency OT and then Patrick would go to LG.

1 hour ago, VonKarman said:

I can see us putting Jenkins at RT and Patrick at LG if both Turner and Wagner are out.

 

[craig]

Note:  MLF himself didn't actually mention Jenkins explicitly, or at least mention or volunteer his name in considering RT.  A media guy asked whether he might move Jenkins to RT if Turner and Wagner can't, and basically MLF didn't say no, but he basically just said "we'll consider everything" (normal vague coach-speak), and he expressed MM's view of trying to get the best five.