Norm Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 7 hours ago, vegas492 said: I found Herman's take to be "less than intellectual" as well. But, because of Twitter, I've become accustomed to reading "less than intellectual" tweets. It doesn't mean that the authors are idiots, it just means that at times, they drink and post. You know, like @Norm. And we love him, too. I literally just got home and sat down and opened a beer and FF and this is the first thing I look at......**** lol 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 (edited) 40 minutes ago, TransientTexan said: That’s a dishonest misrepresentation of the arguments. No one was ever categorically opposed to FA in a binary-thinking fashion. Were people complaining about Woodson? Or Pickett? The point was to say that they are not slam-dunks when you look at the league as a whole and do not cherry-pick situations to look at. There are legitimate risks to putting too much weight in FA’s that often regress and the team inevitable has less information on. In short, just because hitting on your own picks is *preferable* does not mean it is a world-ender that is not recoverable-from when it doesn’t happen. There are multiple ways to skin a cat. The 2015 draft is not still affecting GB’s current roster in any meaningful fashion. You are ignoring the premise of the post. The point being that after a decade of fans preaching the importance of draft picks, fans are now calling Herman an idiot because he is preaching the importance of draft picks. How can you say any draft doesn't affect a roster ? They all matter. Who knows what the chain of events would have been. The same argument with the Love, Dillon, Deguara draft. IF you want to say that it didn't affect the 2019 and 2020 season, you're kidding yourself. There are only so many windows. You can't say we don't win a Super Bowl no matter what, because you don't know. But you can certainly make an argument that drafting backups and non-premium positions during a Super Bowl window certainly doesn't help. With dire needs at DL, CB, OT, and probably WR moving forward, how can you argue otherwise ?? But thank god we have a backup QB and backup RB and an HB ?? I don't think I will. But I digress. Bottom line is I agree with Herman. Signing Z doesn't mean you can suck at the draft Edited March 29, 2021 by cannondale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TransientTexan Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 15 minutes ago, cannondale said: You are ignoring the premise of the post. The point being that after a decade of fans preaching the importance of draft picks, fans are now calling Herman an idiot because he is preaching the importance of draft picks. How can you say any draft doesn't affect a roster ? They all matter. Who knows what the chain of events would have been. The same argument with the Love, Dillon, Deguara draft. IF you want to say that it didn't affect the 2019 and 2020 season, you're kidding yourself. There are only so many windows. You can't say we don't win a Super Bowl no matter what, because you don't know. But you can certainly make an argument that drafting backups and non-premium positions certainly doesn't help. With dire needs at DL, CB, OT, and probably WR, how can you argue otherwise ?? But I digress. Bottom line is I agree with Herman. Signing Z doesn't mean you can suck at the draft I’m not ignoring anything. You are ignoring the nuance of the critiques. Regardless of how they panned out 2015 picks would not be on the roster **at cheap contracts** in 2019. to whatever extent his statement is correct, it is absolutely a N.S.S. statement and not exclusive to any team-building strategy. 27 minutes ago, cannondale said: You can't say we don't win a Super Bowl no matter what, because you don't know. Absolutely meaningless statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, TransientTexan said: I’m not ignoring anything. You are ignoring the nuance of the critiques. Regardless of how they panned out 2015 picks would not be on the roster **at cheap contracts** in 2019. to whatever extent his statement is correct, it is absolutely a N.S.S. statement and not exclusive to any team-building strategy. Absolutely meaningless statement. Obviously our expectations are different. Winning a Super Bowl is THE goal On the roster at cheap contracts is not the only domino affect of a draft class Edited March 29, 2021 by cannondale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TransientTexan Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 8 minutes ago, cannondale said: Obviously our expectations are different. Winning a Super Bowl is THE goal On the roster at cheap contracts is not the only domino affect of a draft class Yea, and maybe if they had drafting LS-K-P in rounds 1-3, the butterfly-wing domino-effect could have resulted in a SB win in a non-zero number of simulations. that is irrelevant. The discussion is how *significant* of a difference the actualities had 5yr later. And it is all pure speculation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, TransientTexan said: Yea, and maybe if they had drafting LS-K-P in rounds 1-3, the butterfly-wing domino-effect could have resulted in a SB win in a non-zero number of simulations. that is irrelevant. The discussion is how *significant* of a difference the actualities had 5yr later. And it is all pure speculation. What are the actualities 1 year later ?? What about 2 years later ?? That is the real argument. Draft importance. You are arguing a draft class doesn't matter 5 years later. While I don't agree, why do you ignore the immediate years ?? The Love class won't matter in 2034 but certainly affected the 2019 and 2020 and ..... seasons Edited March 29, 2021 by cannondale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TransientTexan Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, cannondale said: While I don't agree, why do you ignore the immediate years ?? I never did argue that it didn’t matter in the immediate years (15,16,17,18). Nobody ever argued that. The point is that people keep bringing it up in 2021 are acting like it significantly negatively affected the last couple years, probably out of salary cap cycle ignorance the pervades most fanbases. Edited March 29, 2021 by TransientTexan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighCalebR Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 1 hour ago, Norm said: I literally just got home and sat down and opened a beer and FF and this is the first thing I look at......**** lol Mannnnn. The wind was turnt up to like 100 today. The dirty 30s came a decade early. A beer sounds very nice right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted March 29, 2021 Share Posted March 29, 2021 2 minutes ago, HighCalebR said: Mannnnn. The wind was turnt up to like 100 today. The dirty 30s came a decade early. A beer sounds very nice right now. It was ******* stupid. I have two windows open at home like 3 inches and I swear it's going to move my chair the wind tunnel it made. At least it's warm... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighCalebR Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 1 minute ago, Norm said: It was ******* stupid. I have two windows open at home like 3 inches and I swear it's going to move my chair the wind tunnel it made. At least it's warm... 70 today 30s tomorrow. Wtf. I hate it here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 1 minute ago, HighCalebR said: 70 today 30s tomorrow. Wtf. I hate it here. I don't even notice anymore 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) Came here to say this earlier today and got sidetracked but I'll put it here. I've never been less interested in a GB season that I can recall. Unpopular, but I'd legit rather Rodgers was gone and we had Love. No we wouldn't win, it would probably be awful, but there's nothing interesting about being let down 2 wins before the end of it anymore and there's zero to lead me believe we did enough to win 2 more games. We were even pretty lucky with health (do think we might win with Bak) but yeah. Yawn. 3rd place it is again, maybe two years in a row. At least we didn't sell out and we might have something to build on, maybe. Teams always "successful" but oh man are we ever boring. If I'm wrong I'll be thrilled and worship Gute's nuts til the day I die. But I don't see that happening. Want to be wrong though obviously, not going to hold onto this like a grudge I want to prove. Edited March 30, 2021 by Norm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TransientTexan Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 16 minutes ago, Norm said: Came here to say this earlier today and got sidetracked but I'll put it here. I've never been less interested in a GB season that I can recall. Unpopular, but I'd legit rather Rodgers was gone and we had Love. No we wouldn't win, it would probably be awful, but there's nothing interesting about being let down 2 wins before the end of it anymore and there's zero to lead me believe we did enough to win 2 more games. We were even pretty lucky with health (do think we might win with Bak) but yeah. Yawn. 3rd place it is again, maybe two years in a row. At least we didn't sell out and we might have something to build on, maybe. Teams always "successful" but oh man are we ever boring. If I'm wrong I'll be thrilled and worship Gute's nuts til the day I die. But I don't see that happening. Want to be wrong though obviously, not going to hold onto this like a grudge I want to prove. Has Belichick/Brady really ruined football that much for you that you can’t enjoy 13-win seasons and deep playoff runs that are decided on a couple plays. I am sorry you feel that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, TransientTexan said: Has Belichick/Brady really ruined football that much for you that you can’t enjoy 13-win seasons and deep playoff runs that are decided on a couple plays. I am sorry you feel that way. You aren't wrong. I've been pretty spoiled. Two SBs only but that's still good for most fans. First year I can really recall football is 94 so didn't see hardly any bad seasons. Sometimes being just almost good enough gets old. I have other teams that are close, am a Gators fan, but also Detroit Tigers. Then U of SD teams. So I know what it's like to have no chance as well I suppose. It's kind of like when I played NCAA football religiously eventually you just blow it up after 9 nattys and go start at some ******* team to start over. Except, we haven't really done **** except break my ******* heart lol I know like Lions fans or whatever are going man I wish I was you! but I'm not really sure it matters. Being that close but falling short is still falling short. It doesn't really matter. I've never been SIGN EVERY FAAAAAAAAAAAAA and I'm not asking for it now. But when you drafted Love then got that close, it kinda feels like you didn't know that was even going to happen and you're just content to keep getting close and hope you just get insanely lucky, which you already need. I mean FFS, I'm probably the only one who's nearly 100% confident that the King re-sign is going to look brilliant. But still can't get behind it. Probably win 11+ barring insane injuries or something. Just don't think we have enough to beat KC and TB etc (maybe KC will suck with me playing OT IDK) but still. Hard to get excited. I was excited for last year, especially by mid season though. It felt like our year. But when you do absolutely zero it's hard to get excited. I feel like I'm rarely more than a fence sitter so I don't think I'm being out of line? Edited March 30, 2021 by Norm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TransientTexan Posted March 30, 2021 Share Posted March 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, Norm said: I've never been SIGN EVERY FAAAAAAAAAAAAA and I'm not asking for it now. I’m not meaning to imply that, I’m just sad that so much of football fandom (or any sports fandom) has gotten this way. Maybe there was some of this same thing in the 60’s-80’s and I wasn’t around to see it, but it just seems like people back then had a more innocent and enjoyable experience. They just got down to the base-level of football and enjoyed watching and appreciating the feats of athleticism on a play-to-play basis and game-to-game basis. And not getting wrapping up in expectations or grander narratives of how history will view this or that player/team. players stayed with the same team for ages so there was even less roster turnover than the boring seasons of today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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