vike daddy Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 6 minutes ago, JDBrocks said: Being uneasy about Kirk and the contract he will sign doesn’t make anyone less of a fan... yep, it's all good. the team is taking a big chance here, an expensive one. while nothing is assured to us, at least Cousins is being put in a favorable environment to succeed. (quality coaches, dedicated non dramatic ownership team, modern facilities, excited fanbase) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boda Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 Found this interesting 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gopherwrestler Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 3 minutes ago, JDBrocks said: I don’t think anyone is rooting for them/him to fail. I also don’t think it’s odd or wrong to temper expectations. I want him to succeed as a Viking. I want him to lead them to the promised land. I also recognize his limitations, and have questions about who he is as an nfl QB, and about whether the resources allocated to him might force the Vikings to make decisions about other key pieces. Being uneasy about Kirk and the contract he will sign doesn’t make anyone less of a fan... Uneasy, yes... but some of the thread is basically people just screaming thru a forum at each other that he isn’t worth it. is he worth the $28M average a year? Well probably not at this time. I mean he is getting paid the highest contract in NFL history. But when we look at the year after... and the 3rd year... he won’t be. There are a lot of QB’s that will be getting paid to make it not look as bad. Its free agency... it’s safe to say, he is a better all around player than Case. It’s safe to say he was more developed than Teddy, probably safer since we have absolutely no clue what his knee actually looks like..... If we would have drafted him, and he put up the numbers he did, I’d assume, since he is a better QB than Case, he would of got us to the NFC championship game. If we had drafted him, and he was putting up the best numbers this franchise has seen, been consistent, do you think you would have been hoping to resign him after leading us to the NFC championship game? Or do you think you would have been routing to try and draft a rookie at 30, with the defense in their prime, and hope for a lesser F/A to sign with us? Do you think if we drafted him, he would of signed some cheap deal? Find it doubtful. I look at it as an upgrade. We planned on paying a QB. With $10M dollars we could of signed one pass rusher, maybe one more middle of the road offensive lineman. Would that win us a Championship? Or would hoping a QB, playing with better talent than he ever had, with better coaching, Probably not playing from behind making mistakes as often, help us more. Right now I believe Cousins is a better improvement over Case +1 more player similar to Mike Remmers. And I get it, we all love Teddy, we wanted him to be the future. We could of even had him for cheaper, but we have absolutely no idea what that knee looked like. They were not even confident enough to sign him to a $10M contract, and the players, staff, and our Head Coach loved him. Of everybody in the league, our trainers and staff knew him better than anybody. They must have knew they couldn’t trust that. I have 100% faith in our staff. It’s the best complete team I’ve ever seen in my lifetime. Rick and Zimmer Built this. I trust whatever they are doing to continue to improve every single year. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDBrocks Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 It is interesting. It also doesn’t take into to consideration the long term team impact. The Jets and Cards can get out of most of that money after 1 year. Cousins cap number will impact flexibility with the rest of the roster precisely when the Vikings will need to resign a number of impact players. It’s not as simple as looking at one year cap allocation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDBrocks Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 Who is yelling that he isn’t worth it? This is wild to me. Why is anyone surprised that Vikings fans are guarded against a swing for the fences, a record setting and ground breaking contract, and especially with a player with Kirk’s resume? I would say that most are cautiously optimistic, and only expressing warranted concerns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 These are the QBs I would take right now over Cousins regardless of age, even if it was just for one year only. Tom Brady Aaron Rodgers Carson Wentz Jimmy Garoppolo Drew Brees Russell Wilson Ben Roethlisberger Matt Ryan Matthew Stafford Andrew Luck Phillip Rivers Derek Carr Cam Newton Joe Flacco Eli Manning Jameis Winston Alex Smith Deshaun Watson Jared Goff Marcus Mariota Andy Dalton Blake Bortles Nick Foles That is 23 QBs right now, and not including probably 2 or 3 QBs in the current draft potentially. But good for the Vikings, Keenum is not on that list, Teddy is not and of course Bradford is not. So in that regard the Vikings were winners getting Cousins, but if you look around the league it is not like you got a top 5 QB, you did not even get a top 10 QB arguably. Good yes, better than what you have yes I believe so. But not like you got this super star either. Hopefully he turns out but obviously some are a little hesitant about him. I liked him coming out of Michigan State, was not surprised by his success, is a good game manager, makes solid throws and is consistent. Does have a better arm than Keenum but is not as good moving in the pocket or creating plays at random. But is in no way a super star, and sadly the "loaded" Vikings roster is not that loaded. With a weak secondary especially late in the year at backup CB and S, and a suspect OL but improved granted. I think they are a little farther away than just a slight upgrade at QB, but will see. They need to make some more splashes of course in free agency or the draft without question. Siemian is a solid backup of course, but would be nice to see more talent at that position than just him and Cousins. Pathetic to be looking at a developmental QB but one is already doing that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gopherwrestler Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 I’ll listen to Chris Simms to make me happy instead of Ozzy... he has Kirk as the #12 rated QB & Blake Bortles as #70 Ozzy wants Blake... I prefer what Chris says right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENINCH Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 Blake Bortles? Gtfo 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rrgm Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Ozzy said: These are the QBs I would take right now over Cousins regardless of age, even if it was just for one year only. Jimmy Garoppolo Joe Flacco Eli Manning Jameis Winston Alex Smith Jared Goff Andy Dalton Blake Bortles Nick Foles That is 23 QBs right now, and not including probably 2 or 3 QBs in the current draft potentially. But good for the Vikings, Keenum is not on that list, Teddy is not and of course Bradford is not. So in that regard the Vikings were winners getting Cousins, but if you look around the league it is not like you got a top 5 QB, you did not even get a top 10 QB arguably. Good yes, better than what you have yes I believe so. But not like you got this super star either. Hopefully he turns out but obviously some are a little hesitant about him. I liked him coming out of Michigan State, was not surprised by his success, is a good game manager, makes solid throws and is consistent. Does have a better arm than Keenum but is not as good moving in the pocket or creating plays at random. But is in no way a super star, and sadly the "loaded" Vikings roster is not that loaded. With a weak secondary especially late in the year at backup CB and S, and a suspect OL but improved granted. I think they are a little farther away than just a slight upgrade at QB, but will see. They need to make some more splashes of course in free agency or the draft without question. Siemian is a solid backup of course, but would be nice to see more talent at that position than just him and Cousins. Pathetic to be looking at a developmental QB but one is already doing that. this is really bad man Edited March 15, 2018 by rrgm 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MNPackfan32 Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 In no world is Kirk Cousins the 24th best QB in the NFL. At very least he is better than 7 of those QB's right now. Bortles Dalton Foles Flacco Manning Winston Smith Carr, Jimmy G, Watson are not proven enough IMO. Smaller sample sizes of success. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 I just came in congratulate you guys on getting a major difference maker, with your team otherwise so close to being a SB champ. Didn't quite count on this lol. 23 QB's? Come on. SMH. Jesus. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MNPackfan32 Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 2 minutes ago, TENINCH said: Blake Bortles? Gtfo Jags win the Super Bowl if they have Cousins last year. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BWG VIKE Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 The one thing Cousin's brings with him is some consistency, he may not be a massive upgrade over what we have had recently but he has a much more secure floor. His average is Keenum's best, you get to remove the question if Keenum was to regress or if Bridgewater could return to form out of the equation and save the draft resources as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 (edited) Before people just point to you MIN fans as being incredibly homer-ish, take this from a guy on a team that really wanted him, didn't get him (and realistically, aren't good enough to win even with him, but wanted him anyways, because he's that good already - maybe not elite top 3, but top-10, when you take in the FULL context). This is from DEN's DEN FF Forum January 2018 QB Discussion Thread, page 6. Happy to copy/paste this here. Nothing has changed on this opinion - congrats on you getting him, PHI/LAR/NO and you will be battling it out for the NFC title if injuries don't cripple the teams (always a factor you can't predict). Good luck guys, we're out of this year, will be rooting for you as you have Siemian too. On 1/11/2018 at 6:24 PM, Broncofan said: Just so we understand the context here: WAS 2017: 24th ranked OL in pass pro, 21st in run blocking by DVOA No WR's in top 50 except Crowder in 40's, No TE's in top 30 (because Jordan Reed missed over half of season) No RB's in top 30 for rushing, a top 10 RB in pass-catching who missed last 6 games of season. NET result - 28th ranked running game, 14th ranked passing game by DVOA Opposition faced W-L pct - .538 (4th hardest) DEN 2017: 28th ranked OL in pass pro, 9th in run blocking by DVOA DT & Sanders perennial top 30 guys (Sanders injuries did knock him out of the top 50 this year, though), no TE's in top 30 CJ Anderson wasn't elite, but was a top 30 RB, while Devontae Booker was ranked as a top 25 RB in pass-catching despite limited use (JC incidentally #48...smh). NET result - 23rd ranked rush game, and 31st ranked passing game by DVOA. Opposition faced W-L pct - .492 (19th hardest) And before ppl state it's just numbers, the eye test bears the same result - WAS lost 3 starters for more than half a season on their OL. In the 1H, Cousins and the WAS O were better, but the fact is that Cousins is the SOLE reason why their pass game still functioned - no OL, no RB, no WR, no TE. ZERO run game - which meant D's just focused on stopping Cousins. Literally the only part of that O. Meanwhile, while our pass pro stunk, we had a better OL run game, and we had better RB/WR's (except for Chris Thompson in pass catching, who missed almost half the season). We also faced much weaker competition than WAS did overall. And yet our pass game was abysmal, and WAS still was 14th...and again, solely because of Cousins. People who think Cousins is a middle-tier QB aren't paying attention - the numbers alone don't support it, watch the games and you see it was literally all him every game. He made other guys around him better. Not the other way around. I don't know if he's at A-Rod / Brees peak level when they were at their best, but he's IMO a no-doubt 3-4W QB - WAS is a 3-4 W team without him this year. The SEA, DEN & LAR wins were all on him, and frankly, he had the NO road W all on his shoulders, until the Skins as a team choked it away (up 14 pts with ball with less than 6 mins left - first time a team has lost in that situation, apparently). I still don't know if Cousins will pick us as his 1st choice, or if WAS changes course and tags him, and I certainly have no faith that we can fix the other holes if we have to commit 25-30M annually (as Cousins alone isn't good enough to get us to the playoffs, but he can get us to 8-9W from a 5W team). But he belongs in the top 6-7 QB easily, IMO...especially when you consider the guys who are going to be done in the next 1-2 years (or at least, will likely be off that top tier). Edited March 15, 2018 by Broncofan 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gopherwrestler Posted March 15, 2018 Share Posted March 15, 2018 Hey @Broncofan, we have the great Kyle Sloter too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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