JDD Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 4 minutes ago, Mind Character said: The actual video presser gives all context. It's not about headlines or misreading Baker. It's not just a misreading or misperception of some tongue-in-cheek comment. He was asked specifically, "Some of those little things you're talking about working on would you see someone for that." His response was similar and dismissive of external QB training help as he's been in the past in his comments and actions. The beach swimming thing is an embellishment of course but reflective of how little he thinks of such help. There's also a common thing that happens in human public communication called statement fixing. It's when people often say things first that reveal their real feelings and when they hear their words out loud and know that it might not be received well they throw on a phrase or 2 to clean things up public perception wise with the 2nd or 3rd thing not really being indicative of their overall point but instead a rhetorical device to blunt their original words. As a person that's studied communications, that's so very clearly what Baker was doing by throwing in the "Throughout this process, I have had people help me out along the way and try and take things from different people. Anytime I am around somebody, I ask questions. Do not act like I have it all figured out" line; that is, he himself is aware while saying it that he may come off as "sounding like he knows it all" so he threw in a line there before returning to the fact that he dismisses the value and need for seeking out QB training help which is what he concluded with. Contrary to your assessment, I think it is Very Clearly a person that isn't going to work with people in the off-season. I"m not sure how you could conclude otherwise. Beyond just this or past pressers, coaches and even Ryan Lindley have revealed that Baker isn't going to seek out such help. Around the 8:15 mark. That' That’s exactly how I take it. Now I think he needs someone to work with. I also think he was trying to get out of there. Maybe he isn’t trying to put pressure on another individual for his performance. If he said Jake Jakes is my QB coach, every fan would be saying he’s trash right now. I’ll give Baker the benefit of the doubt for now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 (edited) 54 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said: He was trying to protect a teammate. Duke didn't want to be here, I don't care what anyone says about a player who says they don't want to be on the team whether it is Duke or Mayfield, once you go that route I don't want you here either. I don't care about his issues with Grossi or Rex Ryan, it isn't football related. If you want to defend yourself I have no problem with that. If he felt bullied I support him. None of Baker's issues this season are fatal issues yet as Baker can still grow, but we can't just simply sweep them under the rug rationalizing them like they were nothing or never happened. Baker still can have a bright future, but we like him have to at least acknowledge the issues as issues. The NFL is a Business. Baker Mayfield is a business professional. Professionals apart of football organizations understand that you do not speak about another man's business especially when the Business Executives publicly come out and say that your coworker/teammate " Is Not Expendable Yet." Also especially, if said player has been a hard worker, put it on the line for teammates, and a high character member of the locker room. Sheldon RIchardson, Christian Kirksey, Olivier Vernon, and Joel Bitonio all spoke to Baker about the Duke stuff according to Willie McGinest. The Duke situation showed ignorance and immaturity about NFL Business as it relates to good teammates, but it was not a fatal issue at all as young players have a lot to learn and Baker certainly isn't the only young player that way. "IF BAKER FELT BULLIED"... come on man this is Billion Dollar Entertainment business. Reporters goal in this entertainment business is not accurate reporting but instead to make headlines. As a leader in the organization, you have to restrain yourself and be prepared to receive and respond to media foolishness in a disciplined manner. Baker should've/could've handled the Grossi thing with emotional restraint/maturity. If he was in a New York market, he would've been obliterated. On the Odell thing, it would've been easy to elevate and stick up for OBJ without throwing others under the bus. It takes maturity to know how to do that. "Odell battles through injury every week like a warrior and we love him for that." Baker's Emotional Discipline and Lack of Awareness Issues on the Season were 1.) Talking about Duke's situation without awareness despite Dorsey initiating the issue with his comments 2.) Criticizing the Medical staff instead of just positively uplifting a teammate on their own merits 3.) Blowing up on a troll reporter fueling headlines when responding to such reporters takes emotional discipline 4.) Turning to Twitter to defend his actions as if justifying oneself to the the Twitter Troll Verse matters. 5.) Lacking the self-awareness to know troll entertainers like Colin Cowherd want him to engage in back and forths to boost $$$ and then engaging in twitter back in forths. 6.) Thinking the season would come easy and not putting in elite work in order to be elite 7.) Believing he can just go it alone mostly for his QB development in the off-season. ------ Everything we and Baker want for his career is still out there. He just has to continue to mature and develop. Hopefully he does so. Edited January 1, 2020 by Mind Character Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 Yeah I'm not having this debate. Baker will have a good season next year and you will say he fixed his silly non football issues and that is why or he will fail and that will still be the reason. I'm not going to keep repeating my feelings on the non football stuff that rubs some people (mostly those who didn't want to draft him) the wrong way. I have no problem with them and you do, none of that will change by saying the same things over and over. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 I thought baker showed a lot vs the bengals. He played tough. He wanted to win when a bunch of guys didnt. He showed how bad the coaching was, 12 completions, it was either bad discipline, or a bad game plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornbybrown Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 Baker needs to mature. He is at a age that most males do that, but I definitely see a risk of him not doing that. I think we need to send him messages two different ways. One my hiring a coach who will ride him hard not be his friend and two by adding a QB number two who is a legit back up. its put up or shut up for Baker in season three Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
candyman93 Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 2 hours ago, Thomas5737 said: Yeah I'm not having this debate. Baker will have a good season next year and you will say he fixed his silly non football issues and that is why or he will fail and that will still be the reason. I'm not going to keep repeating my feelings on the non football stuff that rubs some people (mostly those who didn't want to draft him) the wrong way. I have no problem with them and you do, none of that will change by saying the same things over and over. The one thing I can absolutely agree with you on is that we’ve done him zero favors. He’s been surrounded by bad coaching and a terrible offensive line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 Just now, candyman93 said: The one thing I can absolutely agree with you on is that we’ve done him zero favors. He’s been surrounded by bad coaching and a terrible offensive line. Yeah, give any young QB a bad line and a bad scheme it probably won't work out. On top of that bad habits are going to be formed (bad footwork on throws and fear of a pocket collapsing). It's all normal and some QBs (broken QBs) never recover from it even when they have a decent line later in their career. I know some think we had good pass protection, I completely disagree but we won't know if there are going to be any last effects until we see what he does behind a line that doesn't always have a rusher coming free from the left and/or right side with regularity before routes are run. I thought he stood in there better than most though and didn't panic, his timing was off sometimes from throwing a little early and receivers having trouble locating the ball because he threw it a little early and usually with a lot of zip. What can you do though, there should be perceived pressure on every pass play because that was the norm for the year. I think he recovers fine, he didn't look or act like Brandon Weeden when the pressure got high. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtmmike Posted January 1, 2020 Share Posted January 1, 2020 Well first of all he is only24 2 obj at his best caught 80%of his passes 3 line performance this year was in the bottom 1/3 all this makes for a rough sophomore season 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hornbybrown Posted January 2, 2020 Share Posted January 2, 2020 We should either draft someone in the middle rounds or sign someone like Marcus Mariota. Just to have at least a short term plan in place in case Baker craps the need again. I’m still firmly a believer in Baker but a contingency plan is a must I believe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 47 minutes ago, hornbybrown said: We should either draft someone in the middle rounds or sign someone like Marcus Mariota. Just to have at least a short term plan in place in case Baker craps the need again. I’m still firmly a believer in Baker but a contingency plan is a must I believe I was thinking of trading a 4th for josh rosen, especially if we get McDaniels 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NudeTayne Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 22 minutes ago, Kiwibrown said: I was thinking of trading a 4th for josh rosen, especially if we get McDaniels Josh Rosen feels like a McDaniels guy--could see this. A 4th would be solid. His contract would be reasonable too. Mariota would still probably get at least 2/$17 mil or something like that, and he may get 2/$20 mil+. Not really a fan of that, but he may play better here 🤷♂️. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgpoun8017 Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 12 minutes ago, Kiwibrown said: That’s bad coaching 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistakey Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 Just now, Dawgpoun8017 said: That’s bad coaching yes AND thats not using analytics thats why dorsey and kitchens got fired. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted January 3, 2020 Share Posted January 3, 2020 1 minute ago, Dawgpoun8017 said: That’s bad coaching 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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