Kip Smithers Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 1 minute ago, RaidersAreOne said: That doesn't mean those 4 drops didn't change the outcome? Proving my point, you can play the what if game all day. Besides didn’t a couple of those drops happen on drives that still led to TDs? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearerofnews Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 12 minutes ago, RaidersAreOne said: I am so sick of playing the Chiefs after their bye week. Third straight year and Andy has a record win % coming off a bye. Yeah even with the eagles he was dominant off the bye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalixar Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 1 minute ago, Kip Smithers said: Point being, he isn’t only QB now or in history to have great weapons. No. And no one is saying he isn't good, he is maximizing the time he has been in the league. He may not always have the talent (especially when his salary will really affect the cap). That's just the adversity people want to see before crowning him the GOAT. That is all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyB Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, Kip Smithers said: Seriously? He’s got Kelce and Hill. I’ve seen better lol and it’s not held against others. Two of the best at their position, which takes up all the defensive focus, and then the rest of the receivers slotted behind them are better than whatever opposing defenses have left: Watkins, Hardman, etc. CEH looks like a really good runner, and looks like he can carry the load if/when they actually feel like focusing on establishing the run, and I haven't really seen a ton of Bell but especially as a second fiddle it looks like he has something left at least. Throw in Andy Reid calling plays and you have the most ideal spot for a QB to be in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJaxxenGuy Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 Patches has an unbelievable arm, but we’re lying to ourselves if we don’t talk about how Andy Reid gets people wide open all day. As far as making reads, Mahomes probably has it the easiest in the league. Note that he’s still a top tier QB in light of this, but let’s not pretend he’s Peyton Manning dragging 4 mediocre coaches to 4 Super Bowl appearances Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zalixar Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Bearerofnews said: Yeah even with the eagles he was dominant off the bye. We played Hawks off coming off a Monday night and they had their bye. Carroll had a good record for it too. So glad we got a win that night or we probably don't make playoffs. There is a graphic I saw somewhere where teams play x % teams coming off the bye...pretty sure Raiders were near the top of the list for the past few years. Edited November 23, 2020 by Zalixar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD4L Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 7 minutes ago, Kip Smithers said: Point being, he isn’t only QB now or in history to have great weapons. And it’s absolutely necessary to have elite weapons to reach peak levels of success. Too many people have this Tom Brady pre-2007 of winning with lesser known players to be something to be prideful of. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyB Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 3 minutes ago, ThatJaxxenGuy said: Patches has an unbelievable arm, but we’re lying to ourselves if we don’t talk about how Andy Reid gets people wide open all day. As far as making reads, Mahomes probably has it the easiest in the league. Note that he’s still a top tier QB in light of this, but let’s not pretend he’s Peyton Manning dragging 4 mediocre coaches to 4 Super Bowl appearances So I agree with your main point, but you lose me with Peyton. For at least half of those runs, Peyton was not the one doing the dragging. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD4L Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 If you want to imagine Patrick Mahomes without the infrastructure he’s part of, just watch DeShaun Watson play in 2020. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NVRamsFan Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 5 minutes ago, Zalixar said: No. And no one is saying he isn't good, he is maximizing the time he has been in the league. He may not always have the talent (especially when his salary will really affect the cap). That's just the adversity people want to see before crowning him the GOAT. That is all. Want to see something funny though? Name a QB's weapons and say they're better than what Mahomes has and the same people will argue that Hill and Kelce are the best duo anybody could have 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJaxxenGuy Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, DannyB said: So I agree with your main point, but you lose me with Peyton. For at least half of those runs, Peyton was not the one doing the dragging. That’s an aside we don’t need to dive into for the sake of a current topic, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Smithers Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 1 minute ago, DannyB said: Two of the best at their position, which takes up all the defensive focus, and then the rest of the receivers slotted behind them are better than whatever opposing defenses have left: Watkins, Hardman, etc. CEH looks like a really good runner, and looks like he can carry the load if/when they actually feel like focusing on establishing the run, and I haven't really seen a ton of Bell but especially as a second fiddle it looks like he has something left at least. Throw in Andy Reid calling plays and you have the most ideal spot for a QB to be in the league. Brady had Gronk one of the best TEs ever and Edelman one of the best slot receivers in the league plus McDaniels. Peyton had Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne and Dallas Clark. Rodgers has had his share of receivers. Of course what Mahomes has helps but we acting like all these great QBs haven’t had great weapons and haven’t also benefited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyB Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, MD4L said: And it’s absolutely necessary to have elite weapons to reach peak levels of success. Too many people have this Tom Brady pre-2007 of winning with lesser known players to be something to be prideful of. All we're saying is, showing you can be successful at QB without a great toolbox of weapons is one thing Mahomes hasn't done yet. It's not his fault, he's only been the starter for a few years, he'll have to do it eventually, so I'm sorry if it feels like people are taking shots at your boy, but we're really not. Every other certified elite, HoF ticket punched QB has done it. I don't doubt Mahomes will do it, he's amazing. He just hasn't yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MD4L Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 2 minutes ago, DannyB said: All we're saying is, showing you can be successful at QB without a great toolbox of weapons is one thing Mahomes hasn't done yet. It's not his fault, he's only been the starter for a few years, he'll have to do it eventually, so I'm sorry if it feels like people are taking shots at your boy, but we're really not. Every other certified elite, HoF ticket punched QB has done it. I don't doubt Mahomes will do it, he's amazing. He just hasn't yet. Calling him the GOAT at 24 years old would be irresponsible. It’s disrespectful to the guys who’ve put in the work for 15-20 years in the NFL and insulting because we don’t know what he’ll do in the future. So I think he’s got a bright future but where he’s at and what he’s done has been incredible. He’s also faced some adversity (the Kareem Hunt situation his first year as a starter, getting hurt last season, and the loss vs New England where he didn’t get the ball). I’m just happy to see where he is and excited as he navigates through upcoming career challenges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chiefer Posted November 23, 2020 Share Posted November 23, 2020 15 minutes ago, ThatJaxxenGuy said: Patches has an unbelievable arm, but we’re lying to ourselves if we don’t talk about how Andy Reid gets people wide open all day. As far as making reads, Mahomes probably has it the easiest in the league. Note that he’s still a top tier QB in light of this, but let’s not pretend he’s Peyton Manning dragging 4 mediocre coaches to 4 Super Bowl appearances It’s also the environment Reid fosters. He allows guys he trusts to check out of plays. He knows the connection that Kelce/Mahomes has and allows Kelce a lot of freedom with his routes. It works more often than not and keeps a fun atmosphere. but Mahomes talent is the engine that drives this thing. Reid needs that off script nature for his offense to truly shine. Mahomes has actually made Andy better, notice how time management is no longer an issue? He’s winning the timeout battle at the end of games. Plays are coming in faster, Chiefs are more dialed in and prepared during the final minutes. Thats all Mahomes getting on Andy’s *** 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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