Aussie9er Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 I have to say i hate the trade First giving up our 2nd is terrible high price to pay for a qb that we need to extend this off season and has only thrown 94 career regular season pass attempts. Saying that his on the team now so go jimmy g. Now lets hope they have a plan for him and not a hue jackson plan for how to ruin a qb. I would sit him till after the bye that gives time for him to learn playbook and time for our offensive line to get healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big9erfan Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 6 minutes ago, Aussie9er said: I have to say i hate the trade First giving up our 2nd is terrible high price to pay for a qb that we need to extend this off season and has only thrown 94 career regular season pass attempts. Saying that his on the team now so go jimmy g. Now lets hope they have a plan for him and not a hue jackson plan for how to ruin a qb. I would sit him till after the bye that gives time for him to learn playbook and time for our offensive line to get healthy. But the cost of a guy in the draft that has thrown zero career NFL passes is often way, way higher. I can imagine the very cheapest price Darnold will command if he comes out and a team wants to trade for him is two firsts and two seconds - and I think it could be higher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Just now, Aussie9er said: I have to say i hate the trade First giving up our 2nd is terrible high price to pay for a qb that we need to extend this off season and has only thrown 94 career regular season pass attempts. Saying that his on the team now so go jimmy g. Now lets hope they have a plan for him and not a hue jackson plan for how to ruin a qb. I would sit him till after the bye that gives time for him to learn playbook and time for our offensive line to get healthy. Look at it this way - one, we don't need to extend him. The franchise tag is more than enough. That gives us 20+ games to evaluate him. The money is completely inconsequential for the most part because we weren't going to use all 115 million we had available next season. Even if we sign him to a deal, it's likely front loaded and easy to get out of after the second year, so again, not really a major crunch on our cash flow situation because I doubt we would even use all of that money by the second year (especially considering we have relatively few people that we are probably going to extend). Secondly, by trading for Jimmy G, this gives us the ability to actually trade out of our likely top 3 pick and pick up at least a second in return to a team that badly wants a quarterback. If we didn't have Jimmy G or Cousins, that was not going to be an option unless we were once again balking at the quarterbacks at the top of the draft - which is pretty dangerous. You have to take a chance at some point, on someone. Now, it doesn't mean that we will trade out, but its definitely an option, and given what teams will give up to get the quarterback prospect they want, I think there's a better than decent chance. Or it gives us the chance to draft Barkley if we want, who is the best prospect in this draft class. So there's a real possibility that we give up our 1st rounder (say #2) and our second rounder (say #34), and get back something like Jimmy G, #8 (arbitrary trade down number), #40 (arbitrary trade down number in line with #8), and honestly, perhaps even more. For example, the Eagles moved up from 8 to 2 for Wentz (a similar situation to what we will have this year I'm hoping). The eagles gave up #8, #77, #100, A future first, and a future future second (2 years down the line). So lets add that up. Would you make this deal? #2, #34 for Jimmy G, #8, #77, #100, a future first in 2019, and a future second in 2020? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 2 minutes ago, big9erfan said: But the cost of a guy in the draft that has thrown zero career NFL passes is often way, way higher. I can imagine the very cheapest price Darnold will command if he comes out and a team wants to trade for him is two firsts and two seconds - and I think it could be higher. Pretty much...and on the scale of trading for backups to be your starter, this is actually one of the cheaper deals. Go back and look at the deals for Matt Schaub (believe that costs two seconds), Matt Hasselbeck (A flip of firsts and a third), Kevin Kolb (Dominique Rodgers Cromartie + second round pick), Aaron Brooks (who had never thrown an NFL pass and was a third string quarterback when dealt) cost a third round pick and a linebacker KD williams, Brunell cost a third and a fifth, I believe, and he had only thrown 27 passes at the time he was dealt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AustrianNiner Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Hey, we got a QB! Poor fella. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psychlone Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 40 minutes ago, Forge said: Pretty much...and on the scale of trading for backups to be your starter, this is actually one of the cheaper deals. Go back and look at the deals for Matt Schaub (believe that costs two seconds), Matt Hasselbeck (A flip of firsts and a third), Kevin Kolb (Dominique Rodgers Cromartie + second round pick), Aaron Brooks (who had never thrown an NFL pass and was a third string quarterback when dealt) cost a third round pick and a linebacker KD williams, Brunell cost a third and a fifth, I believe, and he had only thrown 27 passes at the time he was dealt. "Schaub, Hasselback, Kolb, Brooks, Brunell...???" Was feeling pretty good about the trade until I went down the list you posted. Back to being depressed . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 47 minutes ago, Psychlone said: "Schaub, Hasselback, Kolb, Brooks, Brunell...???" Was feeling pretty good about the trade until I went down the list you posted. Back to being depressed . Not sure why you would be disappointed. Prior to his injuries, Schaub was a fringe top 10 quarterback between 2009 and 2012. There wasn't anything wrong with him until the injuries got him. Brunell was a great quarterback for quite a long time. Hasselbeck was also a very good quarterback and got to a super bowl. Kolb was a bust, and Brooks only had a decent year or two before flaming out, but if you're getting 09-12 Schaub, Brunell, or Hasselbeck in this deal, that's worth way more than a second rounder. We've been enduring Beathard, Hoyer, Gabbert, and Kaepernick (which admittedly wasn't always bad, but when it was, it was really bad), and now we are going to be sad if Jimmy G "only" turns out to be comparable to Schaub / Brunell / Hasselbeck? Man, we aren't good enough to have first world problems like that lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4L Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 4 hours ago, Forge said: Interesting note. I was reading in the browns forum and Apparently the cost was higher for them to land Jimmy G because he would have been staying in the afc. Yay for conference alignment If that's true, then it shows how highly they think of Jimmy. Hes only 25. Doesn't seem like he has many holes in his game. That release is incredibly quick and effortless. The ball is thrown with anticipation and is generally pretty accurate. Looks like a very catchable ball too as it seems almost soft when if gets to where it's supposed to be. Sees the field well. Moves well in the pocket while keeping his eyes downfield. Can escape pressure and pick up first downs with his legs. Did I mention that RELEASE? Does anyone know what his cons/weaknesses were coming out? Other than the fact he played at a small school Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y2lamanaki Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 3 hours ago, N4L said: If that's true, then it shows how highly they think of Jimmy. Hes only 25. Doesn't seem like he has many holes in his game. That release is incredibly quick and effortless. The ball is thrown with anticipation and is generally pretty accurate. Looks like a very catchable ball too as it seems almost soft when if gets to where it's supposed to be. Sees the field well. Moves well in the pocket while keeping his eyes downfield. Can escape pressure and pick up first downs with his legs. Did I mention that RELEASE? Does anyone know what his cons/weaknesses were coming out? Other than the fact he played at a small school STRENGTHS Has a very quick trigger and good wrist snap that translates to a smooth throwing motion and clean, compact delivery (no windup). Lightning release quickness. Urgent decision maker. Sells play-action. Athletic enough to slide in the pocket and buy time with his feet while keeping his eyes downfield. Good anticipation -- throws his receivers open. Can change ball speeds and drop it in a bucket. Does not take unnecessary sacks and will dump the ball. Will deliver the ball looking down the barrel of a gun. Tough-minded and poised in the pocket -- can withstand a hit and pop back up. Highly competitive. Smart, respected, vocal team leader. Very durable, experienced, four-year starter. Good football intelligence. WEAKNESSES Is a tad undersized with small hands and short arms. Uses a three-quarters delivery that could lead to batted balls. Works heavily out of the shotgun in a spread offense, and footwork could require adjustment to working from under center. Does not always feel pressure in the pocket. Does not rip the deep out or drive the ball with high RPMs. Undershoots and often hangs the deep ball. Makes receivers work for the ball downfield, and deep accuracy could stand to improve. Makes a lot of simple, one-look reads and was not heavily challenged by consistent pressure or complex looks in the Ohio Valley Conference. Some of those weaknesses are no longer concerns, and those strengths still looked like strengths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GW21 Posted October 31, 2017 Author Share Posted October 31, 2017 6 hours ago, Psychlone said: "Schaub, Hasselback, Kolb, Brooks, Brunell...???" Was feeling pretty good about the trade until I went down the list you posted. Back to being depressed . How about Alex Smith? He's having an MVP caliber season. (runs for cover) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldman9er Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 12 hours ago, y2lamanaki said: There is this... lol, I don't want JImmy G playing a single down this year. Total throwaway year with Beathard as Jimmy gets ready for 2018. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 Why worry about the QBs mentioned? When Brunell was Garoppolo's age, he was pretty damn good. Loved the Jags of that era! Brunell was almost like watching another SY....almost. I would much rather pay a 2nd for a somewhat proven commodity than a 1st for an unknown. However, I am a little disappointed because this likely means Mayfield goes to another team entirely...hopefully the Jags! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldman9er Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 12 minutes ago, Chrissooner49er said: Why worry about the QBs mentioned? When Brunell was Garoppolo's age, he was pretty damn good. Loved the Jags of that era! Brunell was almost like watching another SY....almost. I would much rather pay a 2nd for a somewhat proven commodity than a 1st for an unknown. However, I am a little disappointed because this likely means Mayfield goes to another team entirely...hopefully the Jags! I like that comparison, Chris.. and also liked Brunell and the Jags a bit then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y2lamanaki Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 5 minutes ago, oldman9er said: I like that comparison, Chris.. and also liked Brunell and the Jags a bit then. Count me in this group. I still remember he had a pretty epic QB scramble of like 60 yards in the playoffs in one of their first seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pandomonium Posted October 31, 2017 Share Posted October 31, 2017 I'm sure someone has said something similar to what I'm going to say. I didn't have time to read all the comments I just do not trust any trade with the pats. They have made their bones by trading players that everyone else thinks is super-valuable to other teams for picks and at the end of the day the team that traded with them gets hosed (stuck with defective merchandise) and they convert that pick into a pro-bowler or at the very least an incredibly solid starter for them. They have mastered the "Art of the deal" which is one of the main reasons why they have been good for so long. They NEVER let go of players they still see value in and are shrewd evaluators of talent. If the Pats let you go via trade, free-agency, or release you typically aren't going to be fantastic or very good. I believe we got hosed in this deal I hope I am wrong as a $7 bill on this and Jimmy becomes a freakin' all-pro QB with us but I really think we got Osweilered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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