Cousins value and the next wave of big contracts

[Jeezla]

5 minutes ago, mtmmike said:

friendly discussion here.

Frankly if he is going to sign with the redskins why is it not done yet? they have had 3 years to get it done

Because he's going to sign with Jags and win a SB.

[mtmmike]

21 minutes ago, Jeezla said:

Because he's going to sign with Jags and win a SB.

There are two other teams in your category if he wants to go that direction

[bucsfan333]

Demarcus Lawrence finna make QB money unless Dallas can afford to tag him. I think the tag would be ~$16M. And they're gonna have less than $25M in cap space next year.

[Iamcanadian]

3 hours ago, mtmmike said:

friendly discussion here.

Frankly if he is going to sign with the redskins why is it not done yet? they have had 3 years to get it done

Actually franchising him isn't a bad idea, he carries all the risk if he gets seriously injured, either way they have to pay him top dollar, so why not continue to franchise him??? It's pretty smart if you ask me. 

[mtmmike]

9 hours ago, Iamcanadian said:

Actually franchising him isn't a bad idea, he carries all the risk if he gets seriously injured, either way they have to pay him top dollar, so why not continue to franchise him??? It's pretty smart if you ask me. 

Not so sure the redskins could have locked him up for life with a initial offer of 150 million now they are probably going to have to pay him north of 250 milion for all that time.

There are quite a few teams that can put north of 160 million for him.

If you transistion him some body like cleveland can trade down in a trade netting alot of draft picks then leave a 1 and a 3 in the 20s of each round.

 

 

[Dashing202]

As a redskins fan I don't see Kirk cousins coming back .

i thought he would but why would he . Teams like the Jaguars Can pay him more and they offer a much more consistent defense with weapons on offense along with a weaker division .

plus DC a big qb town and it'd be less pressure for him to succeed there .

other teams would be the steelers or browns who I easily see spending the most .

alex smith stays with the chiefs as a back up . Teddy bridgewater says with the Vikings . Drew Brees stays with the saints 

49ers extend Jimmy G 

[Dashing202]

I hate to say it but ... New York Giants could be an sneaky option.

 

[Pugger]

7 hours ago, Dashing202 said:

I hate to say it but ... New York Giants could be an sneaky option.

 

They would have to get Eli's contract off the books first I would imagine.

[Iamcanadian]

On 11/28/2017 at 8:57 AM, mtmmike said:

Not so sure the redskins could have locked him up for life with a initial offer of 150 million now they are probably going to have to pay him north of 250 milion for all that time.

There are quite a few teams that can put north of 160 million for him.

If you transistion him some body like cleveland can trade down in a trade netting alot of draft picks then leave a 1 and a 3 in the 20s of each round.

 

 

It may well cost the Redskins 250 million, but still, he can be cut at the end of any season, should he get seriously injured and they can attempt to replace him at any time should his play fall off, so what is the likelihood, he ever receives 250 million. It even possible that he gets seriously injured and the Redskins are off the hook for any future earnings.

How much will it cost the Colts if Luck is done??? and they get nothing for their money!!! Those teams shelling out 160 million+ are all on the hook for that money even if he only lasts for a couple of seasons.

It's not a bad plan in a game where injuries occur at a high ratio.

[Iamcanadian]

8 hours ago, Dashing202 said:

As a redskins fan I don't see Kirk cousins coming back .

i thought he would but why would he . Teams like the Jaguars Can pay him more and they offer a much more consistent defense with weapons on offense along with a weaker division .

plus DC a big qb town and it'd be less pressure for him to succeed there .

other teams would be the steelers or browns who I easily see spending the most .

alex smith stays with the chiefs as a back up . Teddy bridgewater says with the Vikings . Drew Brees stays with the saints 

49ers extend Jimmy G 

They just franchise him again.

[CriminalMind]

I'm expecting both Jimmy G and Cousins to be given the franchise tag.

[Incarcerated_Scarface]

5 hours ago, CriminalMind said:

I'm expecting both Jimmy G and Cousins to be given the franchise tag.

I'd be ok with that for Jimmy G. That way we can break ties if he doesn't pan out. Cousins being franchised again is just plain wrong. He's been really durable and healthy since he became the starter. Justifying it because he might get hurt is not the answer. They need to give him a deal. They could be spending cap money on players to help him but instead they ruin next season's cap.

[Slateman]

On 11/26/2017 at 11:58 PM, TXsteeler said:

Why would they franchise him a third time instead of just offering $26 or $27 million a year?

 

On 11/27/2017 at 8:15 PM, mtmmike said:

friendly discussion here.

Frankly if he is going to sign with the redskins why is it not done yet? they have had 3 years to get it done

The TL;DR answer to both of these is Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen

 

The long answer: back in 2011-2012 off-season, Dan Snyder was tired of Mike Shanahan's crap regarding Rex Grossman and John Beck. It's still unclear who was responsible for the Donovan McNabb fiasco, but Shanny definitely held the bag for the next iteration of terrible QBs. So Snyder/Allen basically laid it out: Either Shanny takes Griffin with the number 2 pick, or he was fired. Shanahan didn't really want to, but he also didn't want to lose his job, so the deal was made, and Griffin was drafted.

Then came the fourth round and a guy named Kirk Cousins was selected by the Redskins. Shanahan played it off like he needed a backup, particularly for a mobile QB. And for at time, it was believable. Griffin excelled in the offense the Shanahans built for him. The Redskins went to the playoffs. The Nationals won 98 games. The Caps started to dominant. The DC sports curse was broken.

Before going on, you need to understand the relationship that Griffin and Snyder had. It was special. It was unique. Griffin was not treated like other players. Griffin was the blessed child. And SSnyder loved every minute of it. He'd been waiting for 15+ years for this moment. He had a young, hip, black franchise QB. And, yes, skin color was important here. Snyder had been besieged by his money grubbing tactics in the press, and the Redskins name controversy was not going away. Griffin being the franchise QB gave Snyder everything he needed to counter the social pressure around him. And he treated that guy like his own kid.

And  then Griffin was injured in the Seattle game. The curse remained alive. The fan base was stunned. Griffin was shook. But he rehabbed his *** off to get back. And then the nonsense started. He wanted the playbook changed. He didn't want to run as much option. He wanted to become a real pocket passer. The problem was, he'd never done it before. It became very obvious he couldn't do it. He didn't make basic reads. He couldn't make basic passes. Griffin could not operate as an NFL QB. But Snyder didn't care because that was HIS guy. Shanahan finally benched him at the end of the 2013 and Snyder fired Shanahan.

Jay Gruden was hired for the 2014 season. He was brought in to coach up Griffin. The guy who turned Andy Dalton into a pro-bowler. This was going to be the guy. Except ... Griffin still sucked. He got hurt in Week 2 and when he came back, he showed no progression until the last couple of games. Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen elected to pick up his option (15 million).

Now, during this saga, Cousins got chances and was up and down. Sometimes he flashed. Sometimes he struggled. There were questions about his attitude and demeanor. He allegedly asked for a trade.

During the 2015 preseason, Griffin got hurt. Cousins lept at the opportunity. He shined. He flat out won the job. Particularly down the stretch, Cousins was elite, taking the Redskins to the playoffs.

Prior to the season, the Redskins did something that truly hadn't done since Snyder was the owner: Get a general manager. At least from the outside, Scot McCloughan was totally in control of football operations. Bruce Allen was there to kiss babies, set up the homecoming game, and get Snyder a new stadium deal. We know now this wasn't the case, as McCloughan was nothing more than a glorified scout. During the 2015 season, McClough recognized that Cousins had the chops to be a very good NFL QB and started negotiating with his agent. Prior to the 2015 season ending, Cousins and his agent agreed to a deal that was essentially a 3 year, 19 million per year deal. McCloughan was stoked and took it to ownership, as, for obvious reasons, ownership has to sign off on that kind of deal

Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen said no.

You see, Cousins is the reminder of everything they screwed up and they didn't want to admit it. They felt Cousins was a flash in the pants and that he couldn't duplicate it. However both Gruden and McCloughan made it clear the team would face a lost season if Cousins was allowed to walk. Facing a dramatic drop in ticket sales to accompany the never ending PR nightmare that was the Redskins' front office, Snyder/Allen chose to franchise him. They bet he couldn't sustain his end of 2015 performance. Once again, they were wrong. Cousins lit it up. Dude put up elite numbers.

Meanwhile, two major things happened during the 2016-2017 offseason. The QB market continued to explode, with guys like Mike Glennon getting a huge deal, and Derek Carr getting a monster one. It was obvious that the original 19 million a year deal simply wasn't going to cut it. It was also obvious that Cousins was more than satisfied with being franchised again. Given the amount of money they guaranteed him, I don't blame him. But Cousins says all the right things, became a leader on the field, and learned to deliver in the clutch.

The second issue was the massive dysfunction that had come to a head at Redskins park. Allen had basically forced McCloughan out, with tales of heavy drinking being circulated throughout the media. McCoughlan wasn't at the combine and in March, was let go. Bruce Allen held press conferences and radio interviews with Tennessee sports talk radio, alleging  problems with McCloughan. The Redskins again elected to franchise Cousins, in the hope of working out a long term deal.

Which did not happen, and  in July of 2017, Bruce Allen held a press conference at Redskins Park where he informed everyone that "K-U-R-T Cousins" turned down $53 million guaranteed. Yes, Kurt. The president of the team mispronounced the first name of the franchise quarterback. Six freaking times. He chose his words carefully, saying that the contract would guarantee $53 million and make him the second highest paid per year over the contract. What he failed to mention was they were already in for 24 million, so the guarantee was only about 20 million more and the deal was fairly backloaded. Cousins' agent did not counter offer.

So Cousins is playing another year on the franchise tag, and despite losing his two 1000 yard receivers, he's second in passing yards. For his entire time in DC, Cousins has been brushed off and cast aside by ownership, who either didn't want him or refused to believe in him. He's been through two coaches and now three OCs. He watched as the GM who most believed in him was slandered in the press and embarrassingly drummed out of his job. He's watched the front office be one of the most inept and disingenuous in all of sports.

And now that same ownership is expecting to get some sort of home town discount. So yeah, that's why there isn't a deal despite three years. Because ownership didn't want to until it was too late.

[TXsteeler]

21 minutes ago, Slateman said:

 

The TL;DR answer to both of these is Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen

 

The long answer: back in 2011-2012 off-season, Dan Snyder was tired of Mike Shanahan's crap regarding Rex Grossman and John Beck. It's still unclear who was responsible for the Donovan McNabb fiasco, but Shanny definitely held the bag for the next iteration of terrible QBs. So Snyder/Allen basically laid it out: Either Shanny takes Griffin with the number 2 pick, or he was fired. Shanahan didn't really want to, but he also didn't want to lose his job, so the deal was made, and Griffin was drafted.

Then came the fourth round and a guy named Kirk Cousins was selected by the Redskins. Shanahan played it off like he needed a backup, particularly for a mobile QB. And for at time, it was believable. Griffin excelled in the offense the Shanahans built for him. The Redskins went to the playoffs. The Nationals won 98 games. The Caps started to dominant. The DC sports curse was broken.

Before going on, you need to understand the relationship that Griffin and Snyder had. It was special. It was unique. Griffin was not treated like other players. Griffin was the blessed child. And SSnyder loved every minute of it. He'd been waiting for 15+ years for this moment. He had a young, hip, black franchise QB. And, yes, skin color was important here. Snyder had been besieged by his money grubbing tactics in the press, and the Redskins name controversy was not going away. Griffin being the franchise QB gave Snyder everything he needed to counter the social pressure around him. And he treated that guy like his own kid.

And  then Griffin was injured in the Seattle game. The curse remained alive. The fan base was stunned. Griffin was shook. But he rehabbed his *** off to get back. And then the nonsense started. He wanted the playbook changed. He didn't want to run as much option. He wanted to become a real pocket passer. The problem was, he'd never done it before. It became very obvious he couldn't do it. He didn't make basic reads. He couldn't make basic passes. Griffin could not operate as an NFL QB. But Snyder didn't care because that was HIS guy. Shanahan finally benched him at the end of the 2013 and Snyder fired Shanahan.

Jay Gruden was hired for the 2014 season. He was brought in to coach up Griffin. The guy who turned Andy Dalton into a pro-bowler. This was going to be the guy. Except ... Griffin still sucked. He got hurt in Week 2 and when he came back, he showed no progression until the last couple of games. Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen elected to pick up his option (15 million).

Now, during this saga, Cousins got chances and was up and down. Sometimes he flashed. Sometimes he struggled. There were questions about his attitude and demeanor. He allegedly asked for a trade.

During the 2015 preseason, Griffin got hurt. Cousins lept at the opportunity. He shined. He flat out won the job. Particularly down the stretch, Cousins was elite, taking the Redskins to the playoffs.

Prior to the season, the Redskins did something that truly hadn't done since Snyder was the owner: Get a general manager. At least from the outside, Scot McCloughan was totally in control of football operations. Bruce Allen was there to kiss babies, set up the homecoming game, and get Snyder a new stadium deal. We know now this wasn't the case, as McCloughan was nothing more than a glorified scout. During the 2015 season, McClough recognized that Cousins had the chops to be a very good NFL QB and started negotiating with his agent. Prior to the 2015 season ending, Cousins and his agent agreed to a deal that was essentially a 3 year, 19 million per year deal. McCloughan was stoked and took it to ownership, as, for obvious reasons, ownership has to sign off on that kind of deal

Dan Snyder and Bruce Allen said no.

You see, Cousins is the reminder of everything they screwed up and they didn't want to admit it. They felt Cousins was a flash in the pants and that he couldn't duplicate it. However both Gruden and McCloughan made it clear the team would face a lost season if Cousins was allowed to walk. Facing a dramatic drop in ticket sales to accompany the never ending PR nightmare that was the Redskins' front office, Snyder/Allen chose to franchise him. They bet he couldn't sustain his end of 2015 performance. Once again, they were wrong. Cousins lit it up. Dude put up elite numbers.

Meanwhile, two major things happened during the 2016-2017 offseason. The QB market continued to explode, with guys like Mike Glennon getting a huge deal, and Derek Carr getting a monster one. It was obvious that the original 19 million a year deal simply wasn't going to cut it. It was also obvious that Cousins was more than satisfied with being franchised again. Given the amount of money they guaranteed him, I don't blame him. But Cousins says all the right things, became a leader on the field, and learned to deliver in the clutch.

The second issue was the massive dysfunction that had come to a head at Redskins park. Allen had basically forced McCloughan out, with tales of heavy drinking being circulated throughout the media. McCoughlan wasn't at the combine and in March, was let go. Bruce Allen held press conferences and radio interviews with Tennessee sports talk radio, alleging  problems with McCloughan. The Redskins again elected to franchise Cousins, in the hope of working out a long term deal.

Which did not happen, and  in July of 2017, Bruce Allen held a press conference at Redskins Park where he informed everyone that "K-U-R-T Cousins" turned down $53 million guaranteed. Yes, Kurt. The president of the team mispronounced the first name of the franchise quarterback. Six freaking times. He chose his words carefully, saying that the contract would guarantee $53 million and make him the second highest paid per year over the contract. What he failed to mention was they were already in for 24 million, so the guarantee was only about 20 million more and the deal was fairly backloaded. Cousins' agent did not counter offer.

So Cousins is playing another year on the franchise tag, and despite losing his two 1000 yard receivers, he's second in passing yards. For his entire time in DC, Cousins has been brushed off and cast aside by ownership, who either didn't want him or refused to believe in him. He's been through two coaches and now three OCs. He watched as the GM who most believed in him was slandered in the press and embarrassingly drummed out of his job. He's watched the front office be one of the most inept and disingenuous in all of sports.

And now that same ownership is expecting to get some sort of home town discount. So yeah, that's why there isn't a deal despite three years. Because ownership didn't want to until it was too late.

This is a great summation of events to explain why many people (including me) think Kirk will never sign with Washington just because he hates them. But it doesn't explain why they would franchise him a third time unless you mean to say they are too incompetent at this point to sign him long term yet also too immature just to admit they were wrong.

[Dashing202]

Kirk cousins is inconsistent 

 

As an redskins fan he isn't worth the money . He will go to the most paying team avalible .

 

and that won't be in Washington I doubt it .