2023 Rookie Minicamp / OTAs / Training Camp

[craig]

Downard on Tark Carpenter:  “He’s kind of a freak athletically. I think he gives us some options to do some more exotic things with him just because he can rush the passer. We’re going to see if he can do that. We’re going to see if he can cover. I’m sidestepping your question right now because I don’t have an answer. He’s got the ability to play both (safety and linebacker) really.

“When he came in, his weight was 225, 230, and so he would go a play or two and then he’s out of breath, right? At the safety position, you’re ruuuuunnnning, right? And by the time we got to the end of the season, there were some times at practice where he came downhill and thudded a couple of our backs and I’m like, ‘OK, this guy’s got the ability to run.’ … And we saw that in the preseason, too, so I think he can do both, but we’ll see where we put him.”

Craig note:  "exotic things" sounds kinda fun.  Perhaps a low-% snaps guy but earn his way into a couple of packages?  In the nickel/dime/base world, a guy who is on the intersection of LB/safety could get some occasional-package usage?  

Again, I'm a hope-springs-eternal guy, and 2nd-year-jumps do happen sometimes.  As a D+D team, I just kinda figure if it's gonna work, you need to have some of these types of low-probability-D+D guys click sometimes.  

[craig]

I'll quote the entirety of Schneidman's Toure section, since Schneidman is reflecting input beyond just that of Vrable: 

Quote

While Christian Watson and Romeo Doubs are set as the Packers’ top two receivers, Gutekunst, LaFleur and now Vrable have been quick to mention the name of 2022 seventh-round pick Samori Toure in the same breath. Toure had only five catches for 82 yards and a touchdown as a rookie, but you wouldn’t know it by the way those inside the building are talking him up ahead of what should be an entertaining battle for the No. 3 wideout spot.

“If you guys would see Samori right now, you wouldn’t even recognize the guy from last year, his growth,” Vrable said. “He’s probably, of everybody, the one that everybody around the building is like, ’83 looks unbelievable right now.’ He’s put on like eight to 10 pounds. He’s worked his butt off and he’s just grown into his own, so you feel comfortable in your own skin and you play fast and you play with confidence. That’s all you really want.”

 

[ThatJerkDave]

Samouri Toure + 10 pounds = 6'1 201

 

Thanks

[vegas492]

2 hours ago, Packerraymond said:

Dillon ran plenty hard in 2021, I just don't think he's a shotgun back, and with Rodgers injury we were exclusively in shotgun last year. 

You could be right about the gun stuff.  But he didn't run as hard as he should given his size and strength in those legs.  He went down on first contact way too often for his size....at least that is what I remember.

I feel like he can do better.  Just don't know if he has that demeanor to be, well, meaner.

[Packerraymond]

2 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

You could be right about the gun stuff.  But he didn't run as hard as he should given his size and strength in those legs.  He went down on first contact way too often for his size....at least that is what I remember.

I feel like he can do better.  Just don't know if he has that demeanor to be, well, meaner.

Hard to break tackles when you aren't at speed. Gun you're getting the ball standing still, under center you've got a 5 yard head of steam. 

[vegas492]

28 minutes ago, craig said:

Downard on Tark Carpenter:  “He’s kind of a freak athletically. I think he gives us some options to do some more exotic things with him just because he can rush the passer. We’re going to see if he can do that. We’re going to see if he can cover. I’m sidestepping your question right now because I don’t have an answer. He’s got the ability to play both (safety and linebacker) really.

“When he came in, his weight was 225, 230, and so he would go a play or two and then he’s out of breath, right? At the safety position, you’re ruuuuunnnning, right? And by the time we got to the end of the season, there were some times at practice where he came downhill and thudded a couple of our backs and I’m like, ‘OK, this guy’s got the ability to run.’ … And we saw that in the preseason, too, so I think he can do both, but we’ll see where we put him.”

Craig note:  "exotic things" sounds kinda fun.  Perhaps a low-% snaps guy but earn his way into a couple of packages?  In the nickel/dime/base world, a guy who is on the intersection of LB/safety could get some occasional-package usage?  

Again, I'm a hope-springs-eternal guy, and 2nd-year-jumps do happen sometimes.  As a D+D team, I just kinda figure if it's gonna work, you need to have some of these types of low-probability-D+D guys click sometimes.  

Googled "exotic things"....was not disappointed.

[vegas492]

1 minute ago, Packerraymond said:

Hard to break tackles when you aren't at speed. Gun you're getting the ball standing still, under center you've got a 5 yard head of steam. 

Soft is still soft.  I'm hoping he isn't.  But he looked it last year.

[Norm]

55 minutes ago, craig said:

Pass-rush specialist Jason Rebrovich talked about Cox, the UDFA knucklehead.  “Because he has a lot of talent, but he needs to be pushed and a lot of guys need that. They need that kick in the rear end. … If we can dig him the heck out of it and keep climbing that mountain, you might have an opportunity to have a pretty good player in that kid.”

Thanks for posting this stuff btw

[Norm]

22 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

Hard to break tackles when you aren't at speed. Gun you're getting the ball standing still, under center you've got a 5 yard head of steam. 

Do you not build any any speed from the handoff until you get to the LOS? Are we in a one yard deep shotgun?

[vegas492]

11 minutes ago, Norm said:

Do you not build any any speed from the handoff until you get to the LOS? Are we in a one yard deep shotgun?

It's kind of a "run and get the ball" versus stand there and wait to be handed the ball kind of thing.

And it doesn't matter to me at all.  I recall plenty of times he was 1:1 with a backer or safety and they took him down easily.  He needs to break those and turn some 3-4 yard gains into 25 yard gains.  No reason he can't.  He's done it before.

[craig]

1 hour ago, craig said:

Downard on Tark Carpenter:  “He’s kind of a freak athletically. I think he gives us some options to do some more exotic things with him just because he can rush the passer. We’re going to see if he can do that. We’re going to see if he can cover. I’m sidestepping your question right now because I don’t have an answer. He’s got the ability to play both (safety and linebacker) really.

“When he came in, his weight was 225, 230, and so he would go a play or two and then he’s out of breath, right? ...

https://twitter.com/packers/status/1651378108975513601

In link, Wayne Larrivee (sp?) interviews Carpenter, Toure, and Wyatt. 

Carpenter says he's been told he'll be linebacker this year.  I like the idea of a fast nickel-linebacker type in some packages.  Said last year he had thought he was going to be linebacker, so he came to camp at like 230-240 pounds, and felt really slow.  That's what Downard is alluding to with the "out of breath".  Carpenter spoke well of Rich B, and said he just made him run and run and run, and that at times he ended up getting as low as 215.  Carpenter thought that ~220 was really where his weight should be.  Not a ton of 220-ILB in the league, but there are lots who list ~230.  49ers tend to carry lighter guys: only 3 of their nine guys listed as LB list over 230, and they've lighter LBers that list at 214, 220, and 223.  

[craig]

Toure was on that Larrivee link.  He sounded like a sharp guy.  Those 2nd-year guys also seemed very positive about Love.  

[craig]

3 hours ago, craig said:

Interesting thought, you may be right.  I think so many other things intertwine, too. 

1. Others may disagree, but I don't think the interior line blocking was all that great last year.  Running between the tackles, you gotta have some gaps created for you.  Dillon will run better if Myers and Runyan and Jenkins all block better

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/2023/05/19/inexperience-competition-working-for-and-against-packers-c-josh-myers/?itm_source=parsely-api

Quote

...according to Pro Football Focus, he [Myers] ranked 27th out of the 39 centers who played at least 300 snaps. He finished 33rd in run blocking but held up pretty well in pass protection outside of allowing three sacks.

I know, I know, who knows if PFF scores mean anything.  But ranking 33rd in run blocking seems to kind of capture the qualitative observation that his run-blocking was pretty bad.  

He played all season with the knee brace, is that correct?  I wonder if that will remain true?  Or whether given the problems that he had, and given that the knee stuff was now almost two years ago, whether perhaps he's now ready to go without the brace and might have a little better bend and mobility?  

Of course I don't know anything.  When they drafted him in 2nd round, much bigger guy than any Packer centers I can recall, I think my assumption was that being so big might enable him to be a powerful and effective run-blocker.   Not thus far!

[ThatJerkDave]

2 hours ago, vegas492 said:

Googled "exotic things"....was not disappointed.

You sure you didn't type "erotic things?"

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