Is there an argument for Baker Mayfield #1 ?

[Bonanza23]

2 hours ago, Aztec Hammer said:

Great college football performance, the second half at least. But I'm just not impressed. Two TDs on pop passes to wide open guys and a third on a nice scramble drill but not really something I envision happening much in the pros unless you're Russell Wilson. 

Where are the tight window throws under pressure? For as vaunted as Ohio State's D is, he mostly either had a ton of time, or was able to escape the pocket easily. When he did get a fierce rush, it was a mixed bag of sacks and a few nice escapes and 'making a play'.

I know I come across as a hater, but I'm honestly not. I hope he does well. I just don't see it, even in a game where he goes 27/35 for 3TDs.

I liked him early on when I first took a dive in, but the more I evaluate it, the more I think he's being overrated because of how good a college player is and how big a personality and name he is.

Yeah I can’t lie I wasn’t impressed with him that game. Was horribly upset at the Buckeyes playing crap defense. 

[bruceb]

16 hours ago, Thomas5737 said:

There is no data to indicate if any QB will be good as a pro. If there were this would be a lot easier. If Mayfield would have completed 60% of his passes with 29 TD and 13 INT would he be a better or worse NFL prospect?

I do not consider Mayfield to be all that great an NFL prospect, so neither.

[FGK]

I'm just gonna pull out of this discussion. When the best one side can muster is "not impressed", "rubs me the wrong way", and "not enough of a leader" with no substantial argumentation behind it, I know that no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince.

[bruceb]

20 minutes ago, freakygeniuskid said:

I'm just gonna pull out of this discussion. When the best one side can muster is "not impressed", "rubs me the wrong way", and "not enough of a leader" with no substantial argumentation behind it, I know that no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince.

You missed: "do not consider Mayfield to be all that great an NFL prospect".

Good decision.

 

[MWil23]

27 minutes ago, freakygeniuskid said:

I'm just gonna pull out of this discussion. When the best one side can muster is "not impressed", "rubs me the wrong way", and "not enough of a leader" with no substantial argumentation behind it, I know that no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince.

I must be 12. I mean, we have "pull out" and "rubs me the wrong way", along with "not impressed" and "no substantial" all in the same sentence, and the kicker is "no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince". I'm dying laughing here.

[bruceb]

3 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

I must be 12. I mean, we have "pull out" and "rubs me the wrong way", along with "not impressed" and "no substantial" all in the same sentence, and the kicker is "no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince". I'm dying laughing here.

You are giving yourself too much credit.

More like 10.

It is quite funny, though (spoken as a 14 YOA).

[Thomas5737]

2 hours ago, freakygeniuskid said:

I'm just gonna pull out of this discussion. When the best one side can muster is "not impressed", "rubs me the wrong way", and "not enough of a leader" with no substantial argumentation behind it, I know that no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince.

It's all a guessing game and some people guess Mayfield won't be good at the NFL level. How they get there doesn't really matter, whether they have solid reasons or just don't think the sound of his name sounds like that of a successful NFL QB. If we draft him half of those that don't like him as a prospect will review their decision and begin to support the idea. The other half will want Dorsey fired until he is fired. We're just here killing time, we all know how the game works by now.

[Aztec Hammer]

6 hours ago, freakygeniuskid said:

I'm just gonna pull out of this discussion. When the best one side can muster is "not impressed", "rubs me the wrong way", and "not enough of a leader" with no substantial argumentation behind it, I know that no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince.

I imagine the "not impressed" part applies to my post. To be honest I thought I was more than fair with providing a substantial argument.

We're not all going to like the same prospects, it is what it is.

[Bonanza23]

15 hours ago, freakygeniuskid said:

I'm just gonna pull out of this discussion. When the best one side can muster is "not impressed", "rubs me the wrong way", and "not enough of a leader" with no substantial argumentation behind it, I know that no amount of information that suggests the opposite will convince.

Come on freaky both sides have provided good arguments. Unfortunately I think you’re dangerously close to @brownie man level of man love for Mansfield. 

[FGK]

4 hours ago, Bonanza23 said:

Come on freaky both sides have provided good arguments. Unfortunately I think you’re dangerously close to @brownie man level of man love for Mansfield. 

Honestly, I'm mostly just tired of a couple specific posters' single sentence, no back up or reasoning posts. On all topics.

Some anti-Mayfield folks have given solid reasons. But I think most of the proposed reasons are silly and for some reason most of the anti-folks don't focus on the real risks he has. Like I've said. The arrest is a concern. The height is a concern. The offensive system is a bit of a concern. But people coming in over and over with "character" and "scrambler" and "receivers always open" and "never played good defenses" I'm just tired of trying to assert logic in those areas.

I'm just tired of tossing stat after stat, clip after clip, to break down the lazier of the complaints and having to hear them all over again the next time I post. I'm fine with concerns where you can see it one way or another, but when I show real, tangible evidence that a specific concern doesn't really apply and come in to people saying THE EXACT SAME THING the next day, it's tiring.

I'm getting silly season fatigue and this is where it's most manifest. So I'll just let people think whatever they want on this one and stop trying to change minds.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

@freakygeniuskid I was done with this when folks challenged the idea he was a good college football player.

I didn’t think that was ever a point of contention until this week. I live a sheltered life...

[Thomas5737]

2 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

@freakygeniuskid I was done with this when folks challenged the idea he was a good college football player.

I didn’t think that was ever a point of contention until this week. I live a sheltered life...

Yeah that's ridicerous. Again though, people have their guy by now, most anyway, and they'll bring up whatever issue that supports their guy and is against the other guys, that's how it works. Mayfield progresses through his reads better than most NFL QBs but you can't expect most Darnold fans to recognize that. He probably could come in and be a starter day 1, they said he is a faster learner with a playbook... but his age is a concern lets get the other guy and have him sit a year or two until he is about the same age.

I'm not sold on any of the QBs although I probably like Rosen the most but they are all really good prospects so I will be cool with any of the top 3.

 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 minute ago, Thomas5737 said:

Yeah that's ridicerous. Again though, people have their guy by now, most anyway, and they'll bring up whatever issue that supports their guy and is against the other guys, that's how it works. Mayfield progresses through his reads better than most NFL QBs but you can't expect most Darnold fans to recognize that. He probably could come in and be a starter day 1, they said he is a faster learner with a playbook... but his age is a concern lets get the other guy and have him sit a year or two until he is about the same age.

I'm not sold on any of the QBs although I probably like Rosen the most but they are all really good prospects so I will be cool with any of the top 3.

 

I’m a Darnold guy and I have no issue admitting it.

This is a good year to need a QB as there are a few that look like legit prospects. I’m not sure why some refuse to acknowledge other players besides “their guy” may actually be decent.

[MWil23]

Just now, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I’m a Darnold guy and I have no issue admitting it.

This is a good year to need a QB as there are a few that look like legit prospects. I’m not sure why some refuse to acknowledge other players besides “their guy” may actually be decent.

To me, as a Darnold fan, it boils down to this for me:

If we draft Sam Darnold, I'll be THRILLED, especially if he sits an entire year.

If we draft Rosen instead of Darnold, I'll be somewhat disappointed we didn't get Sam but excited since I also like Rosen.

If we draft Mayfield over either of the above, I'll be very guarded, angry, skeptical...but I'll gradually talk myself into liking him as a Franchise QB because of his college success, processing ability, and accuracy. 

If we draft Allen, I'm going to freak out.

If we draft another project QB or chicken out and trade back, I'll freak out.

If we draft Lamar Jackson, I'll freak out and hope that he progresses the way his potential says he COULD, but I'll be very skeptical.

In closing, here would be my reaction in gif form:

Sam Darnold: 

Josh Rosen:

Baker Mayfield:

Josh Allen, Trade Back, or Project:

Lamar Jackson:

[mistakey]

if we take darnold we have to get someone better than mccarron, i doubt mccarron can last 16 games.
if we take rosen, im fine with mccarron- it seems like this dude would be the best one to take if it wasnt for his concussion and off field concerns (partying/unwillingness to take to coaching)
if we take mayfield, i'm fine with mccarron- seems like to me htat processing and accuracy with a good enough arm is what makes a good qb, so... yeah.  lets do it.
if we take allen, same thing with darnold- just like.. for 2 years probably.
if we take jackson, *shrug*