Dome Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 17 minutes ago, Raves said: Joe Montana consistently dismantled every single team he came across and in the Super Bowl had a perfect 11 TD 0 INT stat line. But the question isn't what QB played the best Super Bowls, it's who is the best of all time. That certainly ties into the equation but it's not the end-all-be-all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Brees peaks were right there with the guys on this list but he was too inconsistent. Too many multiple pick games, too many games you want to turn off at half time. Just a tad inconsistent for this discussion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 15 minutes ago, domepatrol91 said: But the question isn't what QB played the best Super Bowls, it's who is the best of all time. That certainly ties into the equation but it's not the end-all-be-all. Then why is the main argument that puts Brady as "Best Ever" is his Super Bowl wins? As an actual QB, passsing/control of the offense/etc I would take Manning, Rodgers, and Marino over Brady without thinking twice. The best argument for Brady is his team success and winning Super Bowls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dome Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Just now, Raves said: Then why is the main argument that puts Brady as "Best Ever" is his Super Bowl wins? The same reason it's used for Joe, it's the biggest stage, the whole point of the game. You can't have an argument about GOAT without bringing up postseason, and specifically Super Bowl, performances. However, the aspect of quantity is just as important as quality for some, especially if there is a noticeable gap in quantity which I'd say there is at this point. People bring up Joe being 4-0 in the big dance but don't mention three straight playoff appearances the 9ers were one-and-done with Joe throwing 0 TDs and 4 INTs in those three games. Brady's never had a slump like that, so that has to be looked at too. 20 minutes ago, Raves said: The best argument for Brady is his team success and winning Super Bowls. Well. Yeah. Same could be said for Joe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raves Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 1 minute ago, domepatrol91 said: The same reason it's used for Joe, it's the biggest stage, the whole point of the game. You can't have an argument about GOAT without bringing up postseason, and specifically Super Bowl, performances. However, the aspect of quantity is just as important as quality for some, especially if there is a noticeable gap in quantity which I'd say there is at this point. People bring up Joe being 4-0 in the big dance but don't mention three straight playoff appearances the 9ers were one-and-done with Joe throwing 0 TDs and 4 INTs in those three games. Brady's never had a slump like that, so that has to be looked at too. Now I know it's not the same, but you could make the same argument in the LeBron/Jordan debate. Either perfection, and perfection in those games for Joe's case, matter, or getting there consistently matters. If they both matter how do you choose which means more as long as the play is at a high level, obviously making for example 10 super bowls but playing like crap won't be the same as making 2 and being exceptional. I mean I'm fine with whoever people pick, I'm just trying to spur conversation and bring the other side of it to the table. I mean I would say as a QB, I would probably take Manning, Rodgers, and Marino over Brady, though Brady has the team success, which has to do a lot more with the fact the AFC East is basically 4-6 free wins each season for the Patriots, same argument used against LeBron, so his team is almost always guaranteed to have homefield advantage in the playoffs and a 1st round bye so teams even then teams that are surging at the end of the season and possibly in the 5th/6th seed have to face at least 1 other tough team to pull out a victory before facing the Patriots. There is a lot to look at it and Brady truthfully has as much claim to being the best QB as several others, but I think his play is propped up a bit too high by the team sustained success more so than his own performance at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 4 hours ago, Raves said: Then why is the main argument that puts Brady as "Best Ever" is his Super Bowl wins? As an actual QB, passsing/control of the offense/etc I would take Manning, Rodgers, and Marino over Brady without thinking twice. The best argument for Brady is his team success and winning Super Bowls. Brady has each one of those ticks on his ballot as well - remember that he still has the 2nd most prolific passing season in NFL history, and just came off a season where he posted a 28/2 TD/INT statline in 12 games. Brady's statline is just as impressive as the three names you mentioned, and he's got more rings than all of them combined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fretgod99 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 Voted for Brady then threw up in my mouth because that guy is the worst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eagles18 Posted July 19, 2017 Share Posted July 19, 2017 it really used to be a Peyton Vs Brady debate but Peyton's last year and Brady's recent year has considerably changed opinions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
navysaintsfan Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 In really feel like Tom Brady is going to always be sitting at the top of this list. And I really don't like the guy. When you look at the tools he has consistently won with, the level he has consistently been at with no looks of slowing down, year after year, I really feel like it isn't that close. yeah, people can make arguments about "the era in which he plays", but Brad's level of play I believe transcends that argument. Now excuse me while I go barf from all this Brady butt sniffing I'm doing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pats#1 Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 11 hours ago, Raves said: Now I know it's not the same, but you could make the same argument in the LeBron/Jordan debate. Either perfection, and perfection in those games for Joe's case, matter, or getting there consistently matters. If they both matter how do you choose which means more as long as the play is at a high level, obviously making for example 10 super bowls but playing like crap won't be the same as making 2 and being exceptional. But Brady has both gotten there consistently AND won the most, it's not a one or the other with Brady, he checks off both boxes. Brady has made the most SBs out of any QB, won the most, and hasn't played horribly in any of them. 11 hours ago, Raves said: I mean I'm fine with whoever people pick, I'm just trying to spur conversation and bring the other side of it to the table. I mean I would say as a QB, I would probably take Manning, Rodgers, and Marino over Brady, though Brady has the team success, which has to do a lot more with the fact the AFC East is basically 4-6 free wins each season for the Patriots, same argument used against LeBron, so his team is almost always guaranteed to have homefield advantage in the playoffs and a 1st round bye so teams even then teams that are surging at the end of the season and possibly in the 5th/6th seed have to face at least 1 other tough team to pull out a victory before facing the Patriots. AFCE has a higher win % against out of division opponents than half of the other divisions IIRC. The AFCE isn't a world beater division but people really overplay the help the Patriots get from being in it. Their win percentage against the rest of the league is identical to their win % against the AFCE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tatupu_64 Posted July 24, 2017 Share Posted July 24, 2017 I'd love for it to not be Brady, but I believe it is. I never got to see full seasons of anyone other than Brady and Manning though, so it makes it hard not to have a skewed perspective Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 On 7/18/2017 at 3:20 PM, Raves said: Brady's going to win, though I don't think he's better than Montana. gmta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y2lamanaki Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 On 7/19/2017 at 9:51 AM, Gmen4ev said: 3rd All time in yards, 3rd All time in Completions/Attempts, 3rd All time in Passing Touchdowns, 7th best All time Passer rating, 18th most intercepted(while having far more attempts)(besting Manning, Marino, and Unitas). You could argue his volume comes from playing with a horrid defense for most of his career. But without Brees the Saints would have been the Browns since 2006. He is, and will always be one of my choices for greatest QB of all time, and while I wouldn't put him number one, I'd say he deserves a spot on this list. The reason why I would argue that Brees doesn't deserve a spot on this list is that despite all of those great stats, he has never been an option of being the best quarterback of his generation. That's a two-man discussion - Brady or Manning. Brees is the third wheel of that discussion. Unquestionably great - in the way that guys like Favre, Young, Aikman, and Elway are unquestionably great. But because of that, there's no real reason to include him, IMO. The other choices are all in the best of their generation discussion. Went with Tom Brady. I'd love to pick Montana, but for every reason I'd choose Montana, Brady has bested him. Even with the 2 losses in the Super Bowl, that's still 7 Super Bowl appearances to 4. And what difference does it make if you lose in the conference playoffs or the big game? You still lost. So - for the foreseeable future, Tom Brady is the guy. And I don't know a player that will best him for some time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKTexans Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 Brady. I understand the arguments for all the other guys. But I think once he retires and people are able to judge objectively I think they will agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnAngryAmerican Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 Tom Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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