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The Jets and Jamal Adams

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1 hour ago, Rockice_8 said:

"Very few" certainly holds true when you found 6 players over the the past 9 seasons that includes over 250 first round picks.

You said very few teams. So it’s out of 32. And I didn’t go through the rest of the league because I got lazy. But if you insist. 

Dolphins did it with Xavien Howard. 49ers did it with Patrick Willis. Lions and Megatron. Titans and CJ2K. Browns with Joe Haden. Eric Fisher of the Chiefs. Chargers and LT. Aaron Rodgers. Hell, the Jets did it with Revis. 

Seems like a lot more than very few.

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5 hours ago, Nabbs4u said:

Since you took it upon yourself to nitpick 6 examples as if he should list every single one, curious how many "Elite" players you can list from the 250 you so nonchalantly threw out there? Go......!

Most GM'S with the foresight to not only recognize Elite talent but the ever increasing payscale would rather lock up that Stud in year 3 , then wait 2 more years which will undoubtedly increase that contract number (baring injury). Howie Roseman has done it for years.

You don't have to look any further than Adams own draft to see the Superbowl MVP is still on his rookie deal.  If he can play into year 4 than so can Adams.  There are other great players from that draft too but I take it you know how to Google and that "most" haven't been extended.

Please stop saying most GMs when in fact that's not true.  

That's great for Roseman but since there a you know this massive economic question mark hanging over the league and the world now might not be the best time to extend a guy when you don't have to.

Adams will get his money and most certainly deserves it but not this year.  That doesn't mean JD should have to his demands or make an awful trade for a worse play also looking to be paid.  I mean how dumb is that.

Didn't you just say Adams wasn't even a top 5 safety or something like that?  Why are you pushing for him to get extended then if you think so little of him?  Now he's an elite player?

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5 hours ago, Yin-Yang said:

You said very few teams. So it’s out of 32. And I didn’t go through the rest of the league because I got lazy. But if you insist. 

Dolphins did it with Xavien Howard. 49ers did it with Patrick Willis. Lions and Megatron. Titans and CJ2K. Browns with Joe Haden. Eric Fisher of the Chiefs. Chargers and LT. Aaron Rodgers. Hell, the Jets did it with Revis. 

Seems like a lot more than very few.

Dude again it's still very few given you are pulling names out from the 2007 draft who are retired to try and make your point.  Just look at the players in Adams draft not extended yet.  1 did get extended and how many countless others worthy to be extended didn't.  Every draft yields a handful of great players in round 1 and most don't get extended in year 3.  I don't need to go draft by draft to prove that true.  Feel free to do that on your own time.

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1 hour ago, Rockice_8 said:

Dude again it's still very few given you are pulling names out from the 2007 draft who are retired to try and make your point.  Just look at the players in Adams draft not extended yet.  1 did get extended and how many countless others worthy to be extended didn't.  Every draft yields a handful of great players in round 1 and most don't get extended in year 3.  I don't need to go draft by draft to prove that true.  Feel free to do that on your own time.

You said very few teams did it. Just wanted to point out that many teams in fact are willing, for the right players. A team like...the Jets. Does it mean all elite players get extended AFTER year 3? No, of course not. But saying very few teams do it, isn’t correct.

How good those other players were/are shouldn’t be relevant if Adams is the player that Jets fans say he is (top 5-10 defensive player in the league, Ed Reed/Troy P type trajectory). 

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This is somewhere in between. I personally don’t think he is on an Ed Reed/Troy path to become one of the best S of all time. Not yet. I also don’t think he should be deemed “untouchable” like some Jets fans seem to think, but I don’t think Joe Douglas does either.

But he’s worth the top S contract in the league. I think it’s possible we are going to see some statistical regression with Jamal this year. 5 of his 6.5 sacks were in 2 games vs Jones and Haskins.

Easily worth the largest S contract in the league. But I’m not paying him north of 18m a year.

Either way, dude needs to realize this is not happening this summer, especially with what’s going on in the world. Stop the senseless posturing and you’ll get paid next year.

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On 5/22/2020 at 3:16 PM, SaveOurSonics said:

Of your 1,176 posts, does every single one consist of you chest-bumping yourself over what the Chiefs have done to earn 1 Super Bowl or am I just happening across all of the right content? It's nauseating. 

I can be guilty of the same thing.  However I only do it because Chiefs are the only team I feel confident speaking about.   

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11 hours ago, Rockice_8 said:

Pressure is such a arbitrary stat.  If you make the the QB slide to his left but still completes a pass is that still a pressure?  

What really constitutes a pressure?  You get a sack that is an impact play it counts as a down and negative yards.  How many pressures result in positive yards for the offense?  Not totally discounting pressures because getting the QB off his spot can result in incompletions or something better but it's such an arbitrary stat.  Like @NJerseypaint said leo was the king of the almost sack.  Not looking to pay 18M to like Yannick for almost sacks.

As someone that still highly values pressures, I would love it if the bolded was somehow able to calculated. Although that might speak more to the talent of the secondary than the effectiveness of the pressure

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13 minutes ago, JaguarCrazy2832 said:

As someone that still highly values pressures, I would love it if the bolded was somehow able to calculated. Although that might speak more to the talent of the secondary than the effectiveness of the pressure

It's both or nothing. Often times the pressure is a result of good secondary play and often good secondary play is due to the pressure. 

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Here's OTC with an article on pros and cons of trading Adams. He'll fetch more in 2020 than next year because of his rookie deal $$
One comment is that he's more valuable to a winning team than to the J-E-T-S as currently constructed.
A top end Safety doesn't move the needle as much for a 6-10 team as they do a 10 - 6 team

https://overthecap.com/thoughts-on-the-concept-of-trading-jamal-adams/

...being the best player on a bad team sometimes doesn’t carry the same value as the same player on a good team. Since Adams arrived in New York the Jets are 16-32.  His being the best safety has made little impact on the overall success or failure of the team. That isn’t a knock on him its just that there is only so much a safety can do to increase the chances of winning for a team. Adams being at the peak of his career isn’t going to make the Jets a 10 win team. It is also one of the reasons why the league values safety on the lower end of the salary spectrum, basically on par with running backs and tight ends.

That said to a good team that considers themselves a Super Bowl contender whatever added value that safety brings can be worth a lot because getting from 11 to 12 or 12 to 13 wins on a year is huge as is getting that one added win in the playoffs. While Adams isn’t going to make a bad team great or even good he can be considered a game changer in a different kind of situation. If that is something the Jets can exploit it can bring more value than the player himself. "

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15 minutes ago, Shanedorf said:

Here's OTC with an article on pros and cons of trading Adams. He'll fetch more in 2020 than next year because of his rookie deal $$
One comment is that he's more valuable to a winning team than to the J-E-T-S as currently constructed.
A top end Safety doesn't move the needle as much for a 6-10 team as they do a 10 - 6 team

https://overthecap.com/thoughts-on-the-concept-of-trading-jamal-adams/

...being the best player on a bad team sometimes doesn’t carry the same value as the same player on a good team. Since Adams arrived in New York the Jets are 16-32.  His being the best safety has made little impact on the overall success or failure of the team. That isn’t a knock on him its just that there is only so much a safety can do to increase the chances of winning for a team. Adams being at the peak of his career isn’t going to make the Jets a 10 win team. It is also one of the reasons why the league values safety on the lower end of the salary spectrum, basically on par with running backs and tight ends.

That said to a good team that considers themselves a Super Bowl contender whatever added value that safety brings can be worth a lot because getting from 11 to 12 or 12 to 13 wins on a year is huge as is getting that one added win in the playoffs. While Adams isn’t going to make a bad team great or even good he can be considered a game changer in a different kind of situation. If that is something the Jets can exploit it can bring more value than the player himself. "

I mean, is there any 1 player who is gonna take a team full of turds and injuries and make them a playoff team?  When Adams is on the field our defense plays better. But the Jets have had a team full of turds so yes having a great safety isn't gonna win games. But having a team that is a contender it could be a missing piece to jump that team up. But the Jets case hes a foundation player and should be kept because we need talent. Trading talent is dumb when you lack it, especially when said talent is 24. 

Football is a team sport, it doesn't matter what player you add if your team is trash around that player you won't be good. 

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Quote

Here's OTC with an article on pros and cons of trading Adams. He'll fetch more in 2020 than next year because of his rookie deal $$
One comment is that he's more valuable to a winning team than to the J-E-T-S as currently constructed.
A top end Safety doesn't move the needle as much for a 6-10 team as they do a 10 - 6 team

Exactly. But if they want to commit 18M to a complimentary player who isnt going to move the needle then let them. Thats a very Jets move. 

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5 hours ago, Rockice_8 said:

Didn't you just say Adams wasn't even a top 5 safety or something like that?  Why are you pushing for him to get extended then if you think so little of him?  Now he's an elite player?

No, just that he's not remotely in the same stratosphere as Ed or Troy. I already addressed my use of the word "might" but you two keep running with it.

Top 5 Safety right now, doesn't mean he should be mentioned along side with Alltime greats/ 2 HOF Safeties. Keep drinking that green colored koolaid though. I'm more of a Lemon Lime guy myself, don't care to much for the Green Apple.

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25 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said:

I'm more of a Lemon Lime guy myself, don't care to much for the Green Apple.

I See What You Did There GIFs - Get the best GIF on GIPHY

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1 hour ago, Nabbs4u said:

No, just that he's not remotely in the same stratosphere as Ed or Troy. I already addressed my use of the word "might" but you two keep running with it.

Top 5 Safety right now, doesn't mean he should be mentioned along side with Alltime greats/ 2 HOF Safeties. Keep drinking that green colored koolaid though. I'm more of a Lemon Lime guy myself, don't care to much for the Green Apple.

My post had nothing to do comparing him to Troy or Reed.  I actually don't recall comparing him to either.  I only mentioned him being on a HOF type tragetory that could put him in the same conversation as the greats if he could keep up this level of play.

Well done deflecting the conversation away from your awful points.

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8 minutes ago, Rockice_8 said:

My post had nothing to do comparing him to Troy or Reed.  I actually don't recall comparing him to either.  I only mentioned him being on a HOF type tragetory that could put him in the same conversation as the greats if he could keep up this level of play.

Well done deflecting the conversation away from your awful points.

 
Quote

 

So much wrong with this post.

Obviously Adams has his whole career to go but open your eyes.  The guy is special.  You'd be hard pressed to find 10 defensive players in the entire league more impactful than Adams.  He'd have a good shot at being in the top 5 and you think he's a fringe top 5 safety.  Lol ok.

 

When you decided to quote me and join the conversation I was having with another Jets poster, it applied to you as well. By by all means

https://images.app.goo.gl/kdJmWRVAKY2YHg7d7

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