2021 NFL Draft Thread

[e16bball]

27 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:

Huh, interesting. I'll keep watching for that. 

As I said the last time it came up, I feel weird beating the “mediocre arm” drum about Trask, because I deeply believe you don’t have to have a great arm to be a star in the NFL.

But I do think it’s really hard to be a full-time pocket passer in the NFL, which he will be. And if you don’t have the big arm to make throws lots of average guys can’t make, boy you need to be off the charts in terms of accuracy, ball placement, and the mental mastery of the position.

He’s got very good accuracy and excellent ball placement from what I’ve seen, so he’s got some of that combo. And we’ve certainly seen guys like Brady and Brees and Roethlisberger still able to be successful in recent years with no legs and a weakening arm — but it’s a lot to ask of a kid to be able to operate at that level of mental mastery. If I was the team that took him, I’d absolutely sit him for a year, just so I could be sure he was a little more advanced mentally before I sent him out there. 

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, ripsean21 said:

I don’t he was tough while he had a great defense he had 0 at OL in the pass blocking dept. he got beat up in Chicago. If he had of played behind the line Tebow had in Denver with that team they probably play the AFC championship game then who knows. I don’t let the hype or anything distract me from the fact I watched that man get beat up week after week like no other good QB. But when your team trades 2, 1’s for you then whatever for BMarsh your losing developing assets so a year or two later your roster shows those voids. It happens almost every time. When the bears traded for Mack they peaked first year and by the 3 rd year you see his team missing players in positions they could have addressed in the draft with those picks. It’s why no player is generally worthy of the trade value unless your trading with Bill O’Brien

He made poor decisions regardless, that happened in Denver too. Again, Kirk Cousins has had a better career since he’s become a starter than Jay Cutler did. He was more hype than accomplishment. He had a strong arm and was athletic. Jay Cutler = Jeff George and I’ll never be convinced of anything different.

I will give you that if we had traded for him in 09 & we still hired the Shanahan’s in 2010 that he would’ve had a good career here - Kirk Cousins esque w/ more bad turnovers - but I don’t think Cutler no matter where he had played his entire career wins a Super Bowl unless he was in a place with a defense like Pittsburgh or Baltimore And those defenses carry a Jay Cutler led offense to the Super Bowl despite what the offense is doing.

[turtle28]

46 minutes ago, e16bball said:

It’s definitely a thing.

Less this year than last, but it’s still not a plus. It’s not a *bad* arm, but I think it’s a notch down from Wilson, who I think is a notch down from Lawrence, Fields, and Lance. It’s enough arm for the NFL — but you’re talking about taking a guy in the top 10, pinning the future of your franchise on him, and he’s a pure pocket passer with almost no mobility and an “enough” arm. 

As I said earlier in this thread, I think, look at the young QBs who are having success at the moment — how many of them are lacking both mobility and a really strong arm?

Again, none of that means the guy can’t succeed. But it limits the ceiling, and it means he’ll need to be really really good in pretty much all the other areas of QB play. That’s a big bet to make, especially when you’re looking at a kid who was a really marginal prospect until this season and is putting up these huge numbers while playing with a ton of dangerous weapons to lean on. 

I agree with that. My dream scenario would be if we can’t get Fields at 2 that we take Sewell, Chase, Parsons or D Smith with our hopeful top 10 pick - I still don’t want us to win the division and lose 8-15 spots in the draft only to get killed in the playoffs - and then, in round 2 come back and take Kyle Trask or Mac Jones. Maybe we have to trade back into the 20s to get one of them, but that would be my dream scenario, to walk away with say Sewell at 3 & Trask or Jones at 35.

Kyle Trask to me is like Big Ben with a notch below in arm talent.

Mac Jones is in the Kirk Cousinsish category as a QB.

I have both in the category of likely to turn out to be really good - at their best - but never elite. That being said, if we get Sewell/Chase/DSmith, Terry develops into an All-Pro and Gibson develops into a pro bowl type RB with hopefully a top 10 D on the other side of the ball w/ Sweat & Young leading the way along the DL, we may eventually have a contender.

[turtle28]

15 minutes ago, e16bball said:

As I said the last time it came up, I feel weird beating the “mediocre arm” drum about Trask, because I deeply believe you don’t have to have a great arm to be a star in the NFL.

But I do think it’s really hard to be a full-time pocket passer in the NFL, which he will be. And if you don’t have the big arm to make throws lots of average guys can’t make, boy you need to be off the charts in terms of accuracy, ball placement, and the mental mastery of the position.

He’s got very good accuracy and excellent ball placement from what I’ve seen, so he’s got some of that combo. And we’ve certainly seen guys like Brady and Brees and Roethlisberger still able to be successful in recent years with no legs and a weakening arm — but it’s a lot to ask of a kid to be able to operate at that level of mental mastery. If I was the team that took him, I’d absolutely sit him for a year, just so I could be sure he was a little more advanced mentally before I sent him out there. 

Yeah, if we draft he or Jones they’d sit behind Alex next year and then hopefully by their second year Trask or Jones (whoever we draft) will done enough to beat out Alex and the starter.

[e16bball]

Trevor Lawrence better check his rearview because all 170 pounds of Devonta Smith is coming up fast for that #1 pick 😂

Last 7 games, all against SEC opponents: 66 catches (9.4 per game) for 1153 yards (164.3 per game) and 14 TDs (2.0 per game). Absolutely nuts. 

[ARTMONK HOF]

2 minutes ago, e16bball said:

Trevor Lawrence better check his rearview because all 170 pounds of Devonta Smith is coming up fast for that #1 pick 😂

Last 7 games, all against SEC opponents: 66 catches (9.4 per game) for 1153 yards (164.3 per game) and 14 TDs (2.0 per game). Absolutely nuts. 

Too bad we didn’t have the luxury of selecting a WR as our first pick to play opposite Terry. OL and LB and if they like a QB and he’s available are all bigger needs I feel than WR. 

[turtle28]

7 minutes ago, ARTMONK HOF said:

Too bad we didn’t have the luxury of selecting a WR as our first pick to play opposite Terry. OL and LB and if they like a QB and he’s available are all bigger needs I feel than WR. 

We certainly have that luxury. You take the best player available. This team is not one player away from being a good team.

I most certainly would take DSmith or Sewell over any of the QBs not named Lawrence or Fields and with the inconsistency that Fields has been showing the last two weeks, I might even take those two over Fields and draft a QB in round 2 or trade back into the end of round 1 for Wilson, Jones or Trask, find out a different way to address the QB position in free agency or through trade, hope that Haskins or Allen still develop into good starters or come back next year and take one of the top QBs in the 2021 draft with our first round pick.

[lavar703]

1 hour ago, ARTMONK HOF said:

Too bad we didn’t have the luxury of selecting a WR as our first pick to play opposite Terry. OL and LB and if they like a QB and he’s available are all bigger needs I feel than WR. 

I mean, we kinda do. It’s all but a given we’re stuck with Alex starting next year. I wouldn’t be shocked if they just go into next season with the same three from this year. 

[Thaiphoon]

4 hours ago, turtle28 said:

BYU just lost the lead vs Costal Carolina right now! Lmao 😂 

Zach Wilson 11/23, only 48%, 147 yds, 1 TD & 1 Int in the 4th quarter.

I’m sorry guys, Zach Wilson ain’t the one!!

And BYU lost.

FCS alumni, Coastal Carolina, doin' work.

[Troublez]

3 hours ago, e16bball said:

As I said the last time it came up, I feel weird beating the “mediocre arm” drum about Trask, because I deeply believe you don’t have to have a great arm to be a star in the NFL.

But I do think it’s really hard to be a full-time pocket passer in the NFL, which he will be. And if you don’t have the big arm to make throws lots of average guys can’t make, boy you need to be off the charts in terms of accuracy, ball placement, and the mental mastery of the position.

He’s got very good accuracy and excellent ball placement from what I’ve seen, so he’s got some of that combo. And we’ve certainly seen guys like Brady and Brees and Roethlisberger still able to be successful in recent years with no legs and a weakening arm — but it’s a lot to ask of a kid to be able to operate at that level of mental mastery. If I was the team that took him, I’d absolutely sit him for a year, just so I could be sure he was a little more advanced mentally before I sent him out there. 

Thanks for the supporting position regarding "arm strength". I just don't see but you guys likely have a better eye for those sort of things - I will keep an eye out. However,  I think that I also disagree agree with the last point as well. Trask is playing in the SEC. The defenses are much closer to the speed that he will see in the NFL than any other conference. You don't think that makes him "mentally tougher" than some of the other prospects. 

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, lavar703 said:

I mean, we kinda do. It’s all but a given we’re stuck with Alex starting next year. I wouldn’t be shocked if they just go into next season with the same three from this year. 

Same! I love it when we agree!

[ovfd55]

I haven't watched the BYU-Coastal game yet and it sounds like Wilson had a bad game which is bad for his stock, but I'd be willing to give him a pass this week as it was supposed to be a bye week and instead its a thrown together game with a top 25 team you have to travel across country for so it couldn't have been the best week for prep work as a QB.

I think 2 is the magic number at moment for this team,If we win 2 or more games I think we're looking at WR,TE,LB,or even DB whomever the best player is at them spots when we pick,1 or less wins and QB or OT would most likely be the pick unless they fall in Love with someone like Parsons.

[MikeT14]

15 hours ago, turtle28 said:

BYU just lost the lead vs Costal Carolina right now! Lmao 😂 

Zach Wilson 11/23, only 48%, 147 yds, 1 TD & 1 Int in the 4th quarter.

I’m sorry guys, Zach Wilson ain’t the one!!

Wait, I thought we shouldn't base off one game? Otherwise stay the hell away from Fields.

[ripsean21]

12 hours ago, Thaiphoon said:

And BYU lost.

FCS alumni, Coastal Carolina, doin' work.

That costal defensive front and that OL man they stayed true and by all means out coached by a huge margin and just punished BYU in the trenches and controlled the football game

[ripsean21]

1 hour ago, MikeT14 said:

Wait, I thought we shouldn't base off one game? Otherwise stay the hell away from Fields.

Right and the INt was a hail marry he hung 73 yards in the air!!! Their OC should be fired!!! They ran on 6 3rd and shorts and just completely played into what Coastal wanted and didn’t let Zach be Zach I won’t blame that performance on him can’t throw passes when they call idiotic run plays on critical downs like they did same play on 4 of the 6 it was a sad display of coaching